Spoilers Titans - DC Universe Series

[kirk55555]

Dove is freaking great, I just have fuck all interest discussing anything seriously with you.

Of course you love the literal symbol of peace being a violent piece of shit, its very on brand for you. It makes sense from someone who obviously never read a comic (I mean for fucks sake, even Rob Liefeld never made Dove violent, and that man would add pouches and a machine gun to a picture of Ghandi if you gave him half a chance).

Honestly though, peple don't even need to read a comic in this case. Calling a duo Hawk & Dove should make their characterization apparent, unless (like the Titans writers) the people in question are literally a group of mutant sociopathic hamsters from an alternate reality.

No, just people who go on ridiculous, over the top rants over every little fucking thing.

I never do that. All the stuff I get angry about is pretty damn important. Like I said above, fucking Rob Liefeld never made Dove violent. Rob "Give everyone 5 huge guns and 10000 pouches" Liefeld understands what Dove is supposed to be. When you make that man look like a good writer, you have issues. Kind of like fans of Titans, apparently. Even Snyder fans will admit that his movies have some problems.

 

[Nerys Myk]

I never do that. All the stuff I get angry about is pretty damn important.

 

[DigificWriter]

no one has argued against what I've said about that, all the Titans "fans" clam up really good when I mention Dove, almost like they can't admit when the show does something outrageously bad

Likely because they don't share your "opinion" that this kind of stuff is "outrageously bad".

Or they accept that characters are going to be changed.

You apparently are incapable of doing the latter and insist on parroting the former whilst refusing to give evidence to support your assertion(s), despite many, many people pointing out to you why you ought to.

 

[Turtletrekker]

^ Like freaking out over Captain Marvel's green costume, when everybody knew she was going to be getting a comics accurate costume by the end, was "important"?

 

[dahj]

All the stuff I get angry about is pretty damn important.

 

[JD]

I never do that. All the stuff I get angry about is pretty damn important.

Dude these are fucking comic book movies and TV shows, there's nothing "important" about them. They're entertainment, nothing more. Which brings me back once again to my point about not taking this shit so serious.
If you this is what you think is important with all of the shit going on in the world right now, then that is pretty damn sad.
EDIT: I'm done. All this is doing is aggravating me, and it's not worth it.

 

[kirk55555]

Again, no one defending Dove being borderline Punisher level of violent.

I genuinely want someone to justify it at this point. I even promise to politely converse about it if someone tries to genuinely justify taking a character whose literally point is she is peaceful and making her maul people, and the reason can't be "because the writers wanted her to be grim and gritty".

 

[JD]

OK, I know I swore I wasn't going to respond, but I actually do have an answer here, sort of. I haven't watched the episode, but in IGN's reviewer did address this, their explanation was that Hawk and Dove were supposed to be an example of superheroes who had been at it for to long, and had taken things to far.
EDIT: Here's the relevant quote:

They're teen heroes who never figured out when to call it quits, chasing a white whale even as their bodies begin to fail them and their dreams of finding a better life slip away

.

 

[kirk55555]

Well, that's...not really an explanation, but I didn't really expect one from the show. Its actually almost physically impossible for Dove to be overly violent, but in a show where Robin is a cold blooded murderer, anything goes. Dove would never be overly violent, she couldn't actually be Dove if she had the capacity. Its like how someone without enough willpower literally can't be a Green Lantern, both Dawn granger and Don Hall had something special about them that let the power of Order turn them into Dove, in that they were both peaceful before their powers.

So, yeah, it goes against literally everything that the characters stand for, but obviously no one who works on the show really cares about the characters. But, at least I know the party line, so the only thing I was curious about Titans is pretty much fulfilled, thank you.

Now all I'm waiting for is someone to do a kill count at the end of the season, I'm predicting the Titans combined will kill more people then Punisher did on his show, and I'm curious to who will be the #1 mass murderer on the show (my bet is on the human woman they call Starfire).

 

[dahj]

IGN's reviewer did address this, their explanation was that Hawk and Dove were supposed to be an example of superheroes who had been at it for to long, and had taken things to far.

You're misinterpreting that quote a bit, they have been at it for a while, four years at the very least (there's a flashback), likely more, and are talking of retiring after catching the baddies in this episode. The "taking it too far" isn't about how violent they are, it's about how far they've pushed themselves since they have no powers in this version, they're just regular people.

 

[JD]

Oh, OK, sorry about that.

 

[Morpheus 02]

I haven't subscribed and probably won't...has Brady Boy come into the picture? And so does he have regular human skin until his powers activate, like Starfire in this show? And does he actually turn into an animal or is he like Vixen in the Arrowverse?

 

[Nerys Myk]

I haven't subscribed and probably won't...has Brady Boy come into the picture? And so does he have regular human skin until his powers activate, like Starfire in this show? And does he actually turn into an animal or is he like Vixen in the Arrowverse?

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[kirk55555]

Oh, so there is actually no explanation for Hawk & Dove, except that they're powerless psychopaths for no reason meaning they aren't actually Hawk & Dove in the first place. At, at this point I just feel more and more sorry for people like Josh Trank. His Fant4stic is practically a line by line adaptation of the original comics compared to the (probably drug fueled) ramblings of the nutjobs writing this junk. Hell, the 70s Incredible Hulk looks like a love letter to the comic at this point, and the 90s JLA TV special looks like The Avengers in comparison

 

[Skipper]

I never do that. All the stuff I get angry about is pretty damn important.

Oh, this is a thread about the situation of Syrian children during the civil war? Global warming? No? Then I assure you what makes you angry is not "important".

 

[Skipper]

And, by the way, yes, we can be passionate about our preferred piece of pop culture, but your angered rants are about anything but passion.

 

[Gavin70]

Well I just saw the first episode with my 14yo son (who is a huge Titans fan - comics and both animated series - he even dragged me to the Teen Titans Go movie) and overall we both enjoyed it. Yes, it absolutely is unnecessarily violent, which does spoil it a bit. But the story (so far) seems intriguing and the violence isn't a deal-breaker. We'll definitely be watching more.

 

[dahj]

Yes, it absolutely is unnecessarily violent

The show is indeed violent, but I don't think they're doing it just for the sake of violence, because in episode two...


(and I'll leave a bit of space here if you don't wanna read spoilers before you see the next one, though it isn't really that big of a spoiler)


... there are two fights involving Hawk, Dove, Robin and a bunch of thugs. One is in a flashback scene 4 years ago, and that fight is more like your standard Arrowverse fight (well, one of the better choreographed ones ) with kicking and punching and flipping and stuff, and then there's a present day one in which Robin singlehandedly takes down a dozen thugs while Hawk and Dove are pinned down which is way more brutal and more like the Robin fight in the first episode. And this isn't just glossed over, first Dick expresses reluctance to suit up because of what he's become, and Hawk and Dove then comment on how he's changed as well after the fight. We're meant to be uncomfortable by the level of violence, and to see what years of working with Batman had lead him to and what he wants to get away from, but is still struggling to do even though he's physically left the Batcave and Gotham behind.

 

[Icemizer]

It is very easy to come up for a reason for Doves current behavior. As the demon Trigons power increases in our dimension (Raven using her powers empowers him) the lord of Order grows less able to influence his minions while the lord of Chaos is able to exert a stronger one. Dove having spent so much time with Hawk is easily susceptible to Chaos trying to take over. Dove unaware of the increased influence of Chaos on her psych, performs acts that her normal self would never do. This leaves Dove in the clear once the current situation is resolved. If they were the shows main characters you could easily go into the conflict she is experiencing as she becomes ever more violent due to Chaos influence.

 

[Thestral]

I've been following this thread out of curiosity to see people's reactions to the actual show, because the initial trailer turned me off but I was curious anyway.

That said, based on comments (or lack of them) here and what I've read elsewhere, Dove is a legitimate reason to give this show a pass. I'll not rant furiously but Dove is literally supposed to be the pacifist counterpart to Hawk using less-lethal means. It's the absolute core of the character as much as Batman's parents being murdered or Superman coming from another world. So unless somebody can give me a reason to think there's more to it than it'll be cool to have razor-Dove cutting people down, I'm calling nonsense. Come on, this is just silly - it's literally hawk (violent) and dove (peaceful).