Throwback: What was your opinion of Star Trek 20 years ago?

[JonnyQuest037]

That was a turning point for me as well.

"Well, even though that old kid's show was fun, NOW we're pumping out mature, sophisticated entertainment for our fans" is what it felt like they were trying to say.

Yeah, whether they intended it that way or not, it came off as really looking down at the old show, which was not a good look. I had the same feeling when early TNG would talk about how much more evolved they were than all those poor, dumb clods of the 20th century -- you know, the ones who make up the entirety of their viewing audience. I never thought those exchanges came off as enlightened. They just made me think that people from the 24th century were conceited assholes.

I hate to admit it that there may be something to that. When Scotty appeared on TNG, he certainly didn't come off as The Miracle Worker. He was made to seem like something that fell out of a tree. Scotty's ways were backwards and Geordi even had to snap at him for being such an annoyance.

I can understand & forgive Geordi for getting annoyed that Scotty was underfoot. What really irks me about "Relics" these days is the implication that Scotty had always been inflating the times for his repair estimates. What was just some gentle ribbing between Kirk & Scotty in STIII where they were both speaking ironically and joking together like old friends was now taken literally, to Scotty's detriment. Now, all of a sudden, Scotty wasn't a miracle worker who was really, really good at his job, he was just a talented BS artist who was giving Kirk false data even when the ship was in danger. Again, it may not have been meant as insulting, but it was building up the TNG characters at the expense of the TOS ones.

So, to have VOY speak this way of TOS, it probably was meant in a way that wasn't meant to show TOS in the best light. I wish those comparisons hadn't been there, because they really weren't necessary.

I tend to think it wasn't done with genuine malice. I'm sure that Berman & company genuinely thought that they were doing better shows than TOS, and that's their right (I severely disagree, but that's what makes horse races).

But whenever they did these types of tribute episodes, or even just passing references to the Kirk era, they tended to write to the pop culture cliche of what TOS was like rather than what the show actually was like. Kirk really wasn't the love 'em & leave 'em type that he's usually painted as (I'd call him a serial monogamist if anything), he wasn't the rule breaker who was constantly disobeying orders from higher up (though the movies deserve most of the blame for this one), and he didn't tend to go for phasers as his first option (he just wasn't afraid to use them if the situation called for it, is all).

But yeah, the comparisons are probably better left to the fans rather than doing them in the shows themselves.

If the new shows just stuck to the universes they were making up, I don't think anyone would've complained for lack of TOS crossovers or commentaries.

...On the 30th anniversary when there had already been a TV special and DS9 was doing its own tribute episode? No, I think VOY had to do something to acknowledge the milestone. Otherwise fans would've raised a stink about it. I just think that, as one of the VOY writers said in Cinefantastique (I forget who), the DS9 staff just had a better idea than the VOY had. And since they were inserting their characters into an actual TOS story on DS9, the annoying sort of retconning that was common on the 24th century era shows was kept to a minimum. (But they still couldn't resist putting in the line saying that Kirk had 17 temporal violations, because he was such a maverick rule-breaker & all.)

 

[Lord Garth]

They just made me think that people from the 24th century were conceited assholes.

Think? They were.

...On the 30th anniversary when there had already been a TV special and DS9 was doing its own tribute episode? No, I think VOY had to do something to acknowledge the milestone. Otherwise fans would've raised a stink about it. I just think that, as one of the VOY writers said in Cinefantastique (I forget who), the DS9 staff just had a better idea than the VOY had. And since they were inserting their characters into an actual TOS story on DS9, the annoying sort of retconning that was common on the 24th century era shows was kept to a minimum. (But they still couldn't resist putting in the line saying that Kirk had 17 temporal violations, because he was such a maverick rule-breaker & all.)

I loved "Trials & Tribble-ations". The best anniversary episode Star Trek ever did. Dax might as well have been me, even though TOS was technically before my time. I guess what we're talking about now is actually throwback within a Throwback Thread.

For "Flashback", I thought beforehand there would be an entirely new adventure focusing on the Excelsior. Which is what I think they should've done. That was a lame anniversary show.

 

[Refuge]

20 years ago my opinion was mostly nonexistent ... but always positive when it did exist. Until last year I had only seen TOS and the first 2 seasons of TNG. Don't think I've never had a negative opinion of Trek.

You know that's a good point. Twenty years ago I was blessed to be just an average viewer who didn't feel compelled to define or defend an opinion about something of which is entertainment. Was positive though about Star Trek. Loved the originals and Next Generation in re-runs. Totally missed DS9 but kind of liked the freedom Voyager had leaving most of the Alpha Quadrant baggage behind.

 

[JonnyQuest037]

But whenever they did these types of tribute episodes, or even just passing references to the Kirk era, they tended to write to the pop culture cliche of what TOS was like rather than what the show actually was like.

It occurred to me that this was an interesting question, but rather than derail this thread, I created a new one where we can discuss it, complete with a poll. Feel free to go vote & comment over there if you find this an interesting subject.

 

[Admiral Archer]

Twenty years ago, I was only nine years old. I was not a trekkie yet in the die hard sense, but I loved Star Trek. My family hated Deep Space Nine and Voyager, for various reasons, so instead of watching those shows, my dad ordered me a subscription of VHS tapes of The Next Generation, to hold us over between TNG films, as well as to get me caught up to the series proper (I had never seen it before in its entirety). Also, at 4:30 pm EST (we lived in Kentucky back then), I would get home from school and watch reruns of the Original Series on NBC, which was my favorite trek show at the time (I had only just discovered its existence, unlike TNG, which I had grown up around). I remember trying to put together my own TOS uniforms using my yellow, red or blue t-shirts and a black undershirt, and building lego TOS sets of the bridge and engine room. For the episode "The Ultimate Computer" I even built mini lego Constitution class starships with different colored bussard collectiors to tell them apart. I had owned a Playmates original run Enterprise-D toy earlier in my childhood (circa 1993), but my little brother lost both the engines, so it got thrown out pretty quick, and I was always looking for a new Enterprise toy to replace it. Later in 1998, I would end up being offered a choice of the crew in 9" scale action figure from Insurection, or the Playmates Enterprise-E from the same film. I chose the latter, and I had that ship for 12 years; to this day it is still my favorite childhood toy, though it eventually bit the dust in 2009.

Man, I miss 1998...

 

[UnknownSample]

I guess 1998 was a sort of peak. Was that when season 6 of DS9 was going? Season 5 of Voyager was close to the same time, and that's when it got consistently good and dependable, if not brilliant.