So, largely, what we already have on this world…
This Side Of Paradise message
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So, largely, what we already have on this world…
I guess I chose the word poorly, then. The point I was trying to make is that the original script portrayed the spores as a controlling sentience rather than a mindless intoxicant as the final episode implies. That does make a difference. I've seen people suggest that Omicron Ceti III could've been used as a way to cure disease and injury, just getting people mad enough to break free when they're healed. If the part about the spores being sentient had been left in, it would be clearer why submission to their mind control would be seen as an unacceptable tradeoff for restored health.
Because it's the principle of the thing, you mean? Allowing it for even a moment would defeat the purpose of being healed, which is to continue to live life healthily and genuinely happily in freedom.
So then the effect of mind control would outlast your healing and your supposed liberty from their effects, as one cannot be sure if or when they will re-assert control somehow. Meaning the presence of the spores are in and of themselves a parasitic illness - something which doesn't belong and wasn't asked for.
So then the effect of mind control would outlast your healing and your supposed liberty from their effects, as one cannot be sure if or when they will re-assert control somehow. Meaning the presence of the spores are in and of themselves a parasitic illness - something which doesn't belong and wasn't asked for.
Are "duty" and "responsibility" collectively the purview of any one political bearing? That may not have been the message you intended to convey, but it could be read that way. To me, Star Trek is optimistic in that in shows humans - once their needs are satisfied - will still find a never-ending series of "wants" to chase after. They'll hitch their wagons to some sort of (non-destructive, non-oppressive) ambition.
By the way, it seems to me that most writers focus less on "Slavery is evil." (because most intelligent and reasonably civilized folk recognize that slavery is evil) and more on "This is slavery." (whatever "this" happens to be at the time).
Zombie!
It's incredibly antiquated to think that "left-leaning" means "hippies, druggies, and subversives." That's how many people in power in the '60s caricatured and lied about what liberalism is, to divert from the fact that it's really about civil rights, favoring constructive policies over destructive or regressive ones, and a standard of justice that applies equally to everyone instead of the privileged race, gender, or class.
Just saying that a starship's mission was to explore rather than exploit, to seek out new civilizations rather than conquer them, and to serve discovery over profit and power was an extremely left-leaning message for its day. TOS's generally anti-war, pro-peacemaking stance was very liberal, even subversive during the Vietnam Era. Including women and nonwhite people as equals in the service, and even a Soviet citizen (presumptively, since Leningrad was still named that), was extremely progressive and ahead of its time.
Although it was by no means atypical for 1960s-80s TV to be progressive and egalitarian in its messaging. The Twilight Zone frequently did allegories condemning war, bigotry, and fascism. M*A*S*H was certainly famous for its liberalism (an ironic contrast to the hardcore conservatism of the original novel's author), and there were shows like Quincy, M.E. and MacGyver that frequently embraced socially activist themes like civil rights, environmentalism, fighting corporate abuse, etc. Although there were occasional shows that seemed to take a more conservative stance, like Battlestar Galactica (which treated any character who favored peacemaking with an enemy as a fool or a quisling), although even it was progressive in certain ways (like not oversexualizing its female characters with skimpy costuming like most of its contemporaries did, while frequently putting the men in skimpy outfits).
Just saying that a starship's mission was to explore rather than exploit, to seek out new civilizations rather than conquer them, and to serve discovery over profit and power was an extremely left-leaning message for its day. TOS's generally anti-war, pro-peacemaking stance was very liberal, even subversive during the Vietnam Era. Including women and nonwhite people as equals in the service, and even a Soviet citizen (presumptively, since Leningrad was still named that), was extremely progressive and ahead of its time.
Although it was by no means atypical for 1960s-80s TV to be progressive and egalitarian in its messaging. The Twilight Zone frequently did allegories condemning war, bigotry, and fascism. M*A*S*H was certainly famous for its liberalism (an ironic contrast to the hardcore conservatism of the original novel's author), and there were shows like Quincy, M.E. and MacGyver that frequently embraced socially activist themes like civil rights, environmentalism, fighting corporate abuse, etc. Although there were occasional shows that seemed to take a more conservative stance, like Battlestar Galactica (which treated any character who favored peacemaking with an enemy as a fool or a quisling), although even it was progressive in certain ways (like not oversexualizing its female characters with skimpy costuming like most of its contemporaries did, while frequently putting the men in skimpy outfits).
Maybe Discovery used the wrong kind of spore drive. 
When you’re not used to sitting at the helm, always beware of strange, alien plants.
I still feel that it must have been a wonderful place to live and be free, happy and content. Spock too regretted the leaving as did Leila so as a man who has never taken drugs in his life to get high it still feels like Utopia to me.
JB
JB
I wondered why Mr Spock didn't take Pike there first. Would he even need to go to Talos IV? McCoy and his magical regrowing appendix, right?
It seems this planet would be a harmless way to have people with disabilities recover their missing abilities - and would brain injuries be healed?
It seems this planet would be a harmless way to have people with disabilities recover their missing abilities - and would brain injuries be healed?
While TOS was generally progressive, I have to admit that once in a while it did seem to veer the other way. I’m particularly thinking of “A Private Little War”, where Kirk concludes that it’s sadly necessary to arm the Hill People/South Vietnam against the Klingon-proxy villagers/North Vietnam.
(Though I guess one can make a liberal reading of that too, at least after the fact, given that conservatives seem to lean *against* supporting Ukraine.)
Well the Omicron Ceti adventure took place a long after the Talosian abduction of Pike. So I guess Spock would be kicking himself when he realised this.
JB
JB
The sensible cons, admittedly a minority, do. Certainly McCoy makes strong arguments for the opposition...so strong that Kirk furiously shouts them down.
Yes, but that was meant to be a tragic and ambiguous ending, not an endorsement. It was the same sort of deal as "Half a Life" or "In the Pale Moonlight" or "Tuvix" -- it's not meant to be the "right" answer, it's meant to leave people wondering and debating whether it was right.
And never leave.
could be an anti-drug message but also illustrates the importance of being a better person, bettering yourself and contributing to society in a meaningful way. At the same time it dealt with the "Ignorance is Bliss" idea.
Well, if you’re happy, and if there’s no alien-planet “gotcha” that kills you later…
Except that bliss was never depicted as being received with consent. Anyone taken within range of the spores was infected (except Kirk). Once infected, the victims are compelled to introduce and expose any new arrivals to the spores.
No one is depicted as voluntarily choosing to be infected by the spores after being informed of their affect. Everyone infected is ambushed by someone already infected.
Is it still a wonderful place if your consent is removed?
A reoccurring theme in TOS.
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