TheGodBen Revisits Enterprise

[TheGodBen]

Although I've only seen eleven episodes of season two, I don't really see the drop in quality everyone else seems to notice - as far as I can see the first two seasons are pretty much the same, except that season two does have a couple of episodes that I really, really like.

The second season definately had some great episodes, particularly close to the beginning and end, the problem was the long stretch of episodes in the middle of dubious quality. If you look at my first graph you can see that the longest stretch of poor-average (0-5) episodes in season 1 was three, and it only happened twice, so you never had to wait a month for a good episode to remind you why you're watching the show. In season 2 those stretches were longer, and there was more of them, and when you're watching a show on a weekly basis that can get very frustrating.

Season 2 also had Precious Cargo.

What continuity issues arose from the Klingons being introduced early?

In the TNG episode First Contact Picard commented that a disastrous first contact with the Klingon Empire led to decades of war. It should be a trivial thing, a throwaway line from an unimportant TNG episode, but the amount of times that I've seen people use this line as an excuse for why they don't consider Enterprise canonical is unreal.

The line doesn't bother me too much, but B&B could have saved a little bit of their reputation and the reputation of the show if they hadn't been seen to break continuity in the very first episode. And for what? The Klingons in Enterprise were rarely interesting, they were dumb and mean and very little else. The only episode I can think of where the Klingons were treated with respect by this show is Judgement, and even then only for one character.

 

[Alex1939]

In the TNG episode First Contact Picard commented that a disastrous first contact with the Klingon Empire led to decades of war. It should be a trivial thing, a throwaway line from an unimportant TNG episode, but the amount of times that I've seen people use this line as an excuse for why they don't consider Enterprise canonical is unreal.

The line doesn't bother me too much, but B&B could have saved a little bit of their reputation and the reputation of the show if they hadn't been seen to break continuity in the very first episode.

Yeah I don't remember that line although I've seen the episode several times. Not that major an error in my opinion.

A reasonable conclusion would be the Klingons had a disasterous first contact with the federation in "Broken Bow".


*spoiler if you haven't seen season 4*


That eventually led to the Enterprise's (Phlox's) role in the "Klingon augments", which one could conclude led to decades of war with the federation.

A stretch (I guess), but an easy one for me.

And for what? The Klingons in Enterprise were rarely interesting, they were dumb and mean and very little else. The only episode I can think of where the Klingons were treated with respect by this show is Judgement, and even then only for one character.

I didn't really see it that way. They seemed more primitive and carnal, humans and vulcans both seemed that way, compared to the 24th century Klingons, Humans, Vulcans that we see, imo.



On a side note: I followed your voyager reviews and they were entertaining. I do not like Voyager, but 20 or so episodes were entertaining and good. On the whole, I agreed with your overall problems with the series, although I think I found them more difficult to overlook.

However, I strongly disagreed with your rating on Barge of the Dead, my favorite Voyager episode. I'll be interested to see your take on Dead Stop, which was my favorite overall Enterprise episode. (An appropriate viewing time with Halloween weeks away in the states. )

 

[apenpaap]

Picard just said "led to decades of war". He doesn't say those decades of war immediatly started, it could be like the Treaty of Versailles leading to WW2.

 

[TheGodBen]

Like I said, the Klingon thing doesn't both me, but for hardcore Trek fans who were nervous enough about a prequel series, being seen to ignore established continuity in the pilot episode was damaging for the show's reputation. As for the Klingons being primitive compared to the 24th century versions, so were the Humans, but at least the Humans were interesting. The Klingons... not so much.


Shockwave, Part 2 (**½)

The first part was an episode brimming with potential. The second part sweeps it back under the rug so that we can get back to stories about alien princesses and mean, nasty Klingons. Shockwave Part 2 isn't an episode which takes the time to explore or explain the situation the first part got it into, everything is geared towards getting Archer back to his own time. The only explanation we are given is that time travel is very difficult to understand, and that was my first warning that the Tasty Coma Wife wasn't going anywhere. The Tasty Coma Wife doesn't have to make sense, it is all just an excuse for B&B to have an action-packed romp without having to explain why to the audience.

That being said, the action in this episode is very well executed, and there's some very exciting shots of Enterprise under fire. One shot in particular, where the camera flies past the top of Enterprise at an angle, has stuck in my memory for years as one of my favourite effects shots. That still doesn't help the episode make any sense; one particularly jarring thing is that Archer had captured Silik, the man responsible for framing Enterprise and murdering 3600 people... and he lets him go. That's the sign of an episode which needed to be restructured.

Then Archer gives a speech about some gazelles, Soval's emotional barrier breaks down and he starts laughing, Forrest realises that there's something wrong with Soval's judgement and he allows Enterprise to continue its mission! So that T'Pol can tell us a story she could have told anyone wnywhere!

Nipples Ahoy!: 7

 

[Jimmy Bob]

Season 2 also had Precious Cargo.

Be strong.

 

[Kegg]

Season 2 killed my interest in Star Trek. I caught it when it was airing, and after "Stigma" I never saw a first-run release of a Star Trek episode ever again. In addition to that it really cannot be stressed how terrible "A Night in Sickbay" is.

It wasn't until years later I caught some episodes of S4 and thought 'hey, this is actually pretty good.'

So, yeah, I'm one of those people who feels there are major flaws with it.

 

[Peter the Younger]

A reasonable conclusion would be the Klingons had a disasterous first contact with the federation in "Broken Bow".

When I first saw Broken Bow, I thought for sure the Klingon chancellor was going to kill Tiny (Klang) for letting himself be captured. This really wouldn't have changed the plot; they could have still used his blood to unlock the evidence of a the conspiracy against the Empire. But it could have sent one of the greenhorn humans - say, Trip - into a "What the hell is wrong with you people?!" outburst, a transgression the crew is only barely excused for, because of the service they had just done. Now that would have been a disastrous first contact.

 

[SRFX]

Shockwave, Part 2 is fairly stupid and shallow, but it's entertaining. Plus it has Archer fly-kicking Silik THROUGH TIME. I cannot stress how awesome this is.

Reminded me of the sort of shenanigans Kirk used to get up to.

 

[Glacial]

I dug Shockwave II. It's not high-concept sci-fi, it's sci-fi adventure a la TOS, which is the whole idea of the show. And the sequence with the Enterprise faking the warp core breach, the engines powering up and then warping away, is still one of my favorite sci-fi bits of all time.

And the Klingons are supposed to be like the TOS Klingons. What'd really brutalize continuity is if the 22nd-C Klingons were as well-developed as the 24th, and then for some reason just spent a couple decades being all shifty and evil while Kirk was around.

 

[Gepard]

Season 2 killed my interest in Star Trek. I caught it when it was airing, and after "Stigma" I never saw a first-run release of a Star Trek episode ever again.

Just about the same here--I held out a little longer than you did, and jumped back in early in season 4 when the folks around here started saying the show was getting better...but considering that I grew up with Trek and was one of those kids who felt like the world was ending if I didn't get to the TV right the instant a new episode of TNG started, killing my interest cold was quite the accomplishment.

In addition to that it really cannot be stressed how terrible "A Night in Sickbay" is.

Quoted for gods damned truth. ANiS might–might, mind you–be the worst episode of Star Trek ever made. And that takes effort.

 

[SRFX]

I honestly don't find A Night in Sickbay to be really that bad. I am not about to defend it and say it's a good episode - but to say it's the worst STAR TREK episode ever is a bit much.

Early TNG would be more in the running for worst ST ever. Code of Honor anyone? How about Justice or Angel One?

Those are episodes much more worthy of criticism - especially the downright racist and detestable Code of Honor.

 

[Dane_Whitman]

Early TNG would be more in the running for worst ST ever. Code of Honor anyone? How about Justice or Angel One?

Those are episodes much more worthy of criticism - especially the downright racist and detestable Code of Honor.

So true.

 

[Kegg]

I honestly don't find A Night in Sickbay to be really that bad. I am not about to defend it and say it's a good episode - but to say it's the worst STAR TREK episode ever is a bit much.

Perhaps, but it's still awful. And that's really what matters - if not at the very bottom, it's definitely down there as one of Trek's worst outings.

Early TNG would be more in the running for worst ST ever. Code of Honor anyone? How about Justice or Angel One?

I'm one of the three people who sorta like Justice. It's spectacularly cheesy in an amusing way.

 

[SFRabid]

ANIS was one of the few episodes of ST that made me mad. I was mad because the writers made Archer stupid enough to take his dog to the planet. I do know dog people who think they can take their dogs anywhere. One of the writers must be like that.

 

[bluedana]

I honestly don't find A Night in Sickbay to be really that bad. I am not about to defend it and say it's a good episode - but to say it's the worst STAR TREK episode ever is a bit much.

Perhaps, but it's still awful. And that's really what matters - if not at the very bottom, it's definitely down there as one of Trek's worst outings.

Early TNG would be more in the running for worst ST ever. Code of Honor anyone? How about Justice or Angel One?

I'm one of the three people who sorta like Justice. It's spectacularly cheesy in an amusing way.

Interesting that you would state that ANiS is "awful" as if it's irrefutable fact, then in the next breath admit that you're "one of the three people" who like an episode that someone else thinks is one of the worst ever. There is no objective measure of worst!ep!ever!, only one's opinion. There's no greater validity to someone's opinion over someone else's just because it goes on for several paragraphs or is offered repeatedly.

 

[Kegg]

Interesting that you would state that ANiS is "awful" as if it's irrefutable fact, then in the next breath admit that you're "one of the three people" who like an episode that someone else thinks is one of the worst ever.

Yes, interesting, but not contradictory.

1. I didn't claim it's an objective fact. But the bald claim that "A Night in Sickbay" is awful is entitled to exactly the same amount of legitimacy to saying that "Angel One" is bad - in that it's become pretty much a matter of subjective consensus among Trek fans.

Also, it is awful. Come on!

2. I never said "Justice" is good. It isn't good. I said I like it, which isn't the same thing.

 

[apenpaap]

I like A Night in Sickbay. Kind of.

 

[Jimmy Bob]

Eh, ANiS is overrated as the worst episode ever.

Now Acquisition on the other hand... I think that episode broke something inside me.

Also Precious Cargo made it quite hard for a moment there.

 

[Alidar Jarok]

What continuity issues arose from the Klingons being introduced early?

In the TNG episode First Contact Picard commented that a disastrous first contact with the Klingon Empire led to decades of war. It should be a trivial thing, a throwaway line from an unimportant TNG episode, but the amount of times that I've seen people use this line as an excuse for why they don't consider Enterprise canonical is unreal.

Since I'm a proponent of the lost art of rationalization (as opposed to the art of writing "not canon" with a period in between words, which seems much more popular), the key to that phrase for me is the "led to". It doesn't say immediately led to. Certainly the time frame adds up (if centuries ago implies at least 200 years, we're talking about some time before 2167. 2151 makes as much sense as any date). Or it could be referring to a date prior to that (maybe a Vulcan first contact as Timo likes to argue). If you look at the intent, it was just supposed to mean that, when looking back, the Federation realized that cultural misunderstandings were a big part of their problems with the Klingons, so they should make sure they understand species before making contact in the future. When you consider that the author of the episode says it was a throwaway line that somehow made it through all the edits and he doesn't see any contradiction, the whole thing is a bit pointless.

Granted, Klingons weren't handled all that well. But I understand why they had them. When people think Star Trek, they think spaceship exploring the stars and fighting Klingons. Since Enterprise was about returning to the roots as much as anything else (hence the emphasis of the "big three"), Klingons were a logical choice.

In case you can't tell, since that argument has been brought up so often, I've had time to refine my responses. Those who bring it up never did, which tells me that there's not much to that complaint. Now cloaks on the other hand is very hard to rationalize.

Speaking of which, Minefield is coming up, which is the episode I registered on this board to discuss. I'm curious to see what you think of it and Dead Stop.

 

[bluedana]

Interesting that you would state that ANiS is "awful" as if it's irrefutable fact, then in the next breath admit that you're "one of the three people" who like an episode that someone else thinks is one of the worst ever.

Yes, interesting, but not contradictory.

1. I didn't claim it's an objective fact. But the bald claim that "A Night in Sickbay" is awful is entitled to exactly the same amount of legitimacy to saying that "Angel One" is bad - in that it's become pretty much a matter of subjective consensus among Trek fans.

Also, it is awful. Come on!

2. I never said "Justice" is good. It isn't good. I said I like it, which isn't the same thing.

There is a qualitative difference between "It is awful" (stated as fact), and "I think it's awful" or even "I don't like it because I think it's awful" (stated as opinion), is the point. And since nobody's done a scientific survey of Trek fans (as if that could ever be defined) there's no way to assess what is or is not at the bottom or top of any scale or anywhere near approaching subjective consensus.

People like what they like, or dislike what they dislike, for whatever reasons that are important to them. That makes it opinion. And opinions about every Trek episode vary wildly.