The Walking Dead Season 5

[davejames]

Well to be fair, anyone who isn't Rick, Daryl, Michonne, or Carol is probably destined to die at some point on this show. And I honestly don't sense any ill intent in how certain characters have been picked to die-- especially given how rich and complex characters like Tyreese and Bob were written to be in the first place.

I think it's more just an unfortunate coincidence this season more than anything.

 

[Trekker4747]

I know in Season 3 it was something of a "joke" that show had to rotate out characters in order to keep one black character on the show. T-Dog was killed when the black prison guy became more focused on, and then he was killed when Michonne joined our group.

But, honestly, the show has done pretty well in diversity and I think that black-characters keep dying is either more akin to staying within the bounds -more or less- with the comics or contract issues with the actors. I mean if they want to keep Noah around but the actor wants out to pursue another project, there's few options in this type of series. Killing him in the most violent way possible is the one of the few ways to go. Killing Tyreese was a pretty powerful episode and an interesting look at Tyreese's thought's as he succumbed to his injuries.

Noah's death is going to have some lingering effects on Glenn.

And Fr. Gabriel is still around as is Michonne and Sasha. (Of them I'd say Michonne is the safest.)

Gabriel is an ass-hat. I think he's trying to over-compensate for his own sins by trumping up the sins of others. And it's hard to really see, for me, why he's trumping up the actions of our group. He's been with them for over two months now and has likely seen how they are in more "normal" circumstances when they're not fighting other groups for their very lives. He's seen them work together and protect one another in desperate struggles but, apparently, he's still linger on the slaughtering of the Termites back in his church.

Yeah, they brutally killed a few people. People who were HUNTING them and intent on eating them! Gabriel, I'll take that over the man who locked his parishioners out of the church, leaving them to die a horrible death.

When ROTC Asshat got eaten I am sort-of surprised no one gave him a mercy head-shot.

And, really, through the episode we've seen more "good" from our group than bad compared to the Alexandrians. The Alexandrians were all prepared to abandon people and leaving them for dead. Glenn sacrificed himself and others to make sure they got out alive and tried to save ROTC Asshat. Eugene nutted up and sacrificed himself to save Tara.

Abraham sacrificed himself to save the build-team girl.

So, I think our group is still coming out looking better than the Alexandrians.

And then there's Carol.

Sigh.

This woman is out of her fucking mind.

Okay, maybe her little speech to the kid last week was something of act to make the kid wet himself and not tell anyone what she was doing. And maybe the kid is a complete idiot for going back to the woman who threatened to feed him to walkers just to get some stupid cookies. And it seems Carol's act is more to prevent herself from getting attached to the kid and getting hurt again should something happen to him. (She's lost Sophia, Mica and Lizzie.)

And the kid's father, Dr. Asshat, is a jackass as he apparently abuses his wife and kid.
But does that mean Rick needs to *kill* the guy?! Carol's grown detached from any form of society there may still be and that this community is trying to preserve or revive.

In a revenge sense maybe Dr. Asshat should die, but should Rick risk himself, his children and the rest of the group's security here because of some asshole?

I don't think so, Carol's suggestion is a touch extreme.

 

[Vendikarr]

In a revenge sense maybe Dr. Asshat should die, but should Rick risk himself, his children and the rest of the group's security here because of some asshole?

I don't think so, Carol's suggestion is a touch extreme.

The doctor is going to have to die. I mean what are the options. tell him to stop? Yea right. Move him out and tell him to keep away from them? Yea, restraining orders work so well when we're not in a ZA. Lock him up? Where? They are turning a housing development into a village. There is no jail.

So death or exile? And exile = death.

The choice is obvious.

 

[hux]

I don't understand why people talk about Rick's group as though they're dangerous or losing it or whatever. This is a different world. If they lived in my street, sure i'd phone the police immediately and inform them that a bunch of nutters are living next door.

The world they're living in is utterly unlike ours. Wife beater next door so you do what? Have a chat with him and suggest counselling. Screw that, you kill him. Dickhead coward putting everyone's life at risk on runs. So you do what, put him on trial for immense dickishness behaviour. No, you cut his head off and take his boots

Carol understand this. She knows that while baking cookies might be fun, ultimately she now lives in a world where popping round to Rick's house with murder suggestions is entirely sensible

Walter White is seen as "going bad" because he exists in a world where one can "be good"

Nobody in this world can be good or bad

They can only survive

Gabriel is technically right about Rick's group because Gabriel is still thinking in terms of the old world.

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

I agree that Gabriel's visit might push Deanna in the direction of Rick's group is dangerous. And there is a reason it was juxtaposed with Carol telling Rick he had to kill Porch Dick. While we, from the comfort of our own non-Walking Dead world can be quick to judge Carol, this is a new world. There's no therapy for Pete, nor are there women's shelters for Jessie and her son (doesn't she have a daughter also, or am I imagining things?).

Rick didn't listen to those who warned him about Shane, until it was almost too late. Will he make the same mistake twice?

I do not think Rick has any business killing Pete; he may be the town "law", but Deanna is the leader, and all things have to run through her. Shane was his friend, so he was dealing with real emotional investment not easily settled until the last moment face off. But its funny you mention Shane, since I believe Rick is becoming obsessive about Jessie in the way Shane was about Lori.

 

[davejames]

I think Carol's comment came more from her having been there before, and sensing from the husband just how far he might go. That he would put up a big fight and possibly even threaten to kill his family, etc. And that Rick would ultimately have no choice but to go in and take care of the guy in as ruthless a way as possible.

I don't think this was her just being extreme and over the top.

Although that being said, I do agree Rick should at least run things by Deanna first, and let her at least try a better solution (although it's hard to imagine she doesn't already know what's happening, given how well she can supposedly read people).

 

[Velocity]

Gabriel saw the leg on the barbecue, so he knows that the Terminites were pretty evil. Rick's group were brutal to them, but he also saw Ricks's group's better sides. He doesn't seem very grateful that they saved him from zombies on more than one occasion. He was fine being with the group until he saw something/someplace better. For someone who had renewed faith when the rain came when they were dying of thirst, he suddenly lost it again and tore a bible to pieces. He's deathly afraid, but so is Eugene and Eugene overcame his fear when he knew Tara's life depended on him. Gabriel didn't even stand up for Aaron when he was at their mercy. I'm beginning to wonder if he is actually a priest.

 

[Ryan8bit]

Well to be fair, anyone who isn't Rick, Daryl, Michonne, or Carol is probably destined to die at some point on this show. And I honestly don't sense any ill intent in how certain characters have been picked to die-- especially given how rich and complex characters like Tyreese and Bob were written to be in the first place.

I think it's more just an unfortunate coincidence this season more than anything.

Yeah, I don't think it's deliberate, but it sure isn't incredibly thoughtful either. For a moment I thought the problem with Alexandria might be racism.

I know in Season 3 it was something of a "joke" that show had to rotate out characters in order to keep one black character on the show. T-Dog was killed when the black prison guy became more focused on, and then he was killed when Michonne joined our group.

But, honestly, the show has done pretty well in diversity and I think that black-characters keep dying is either more akin to staying within the bounds -more or less- with the comics or contract issues with the actors. I mean if they want to keep Noah around but the actor wants out to pursue another project, there's few options in this type of series. Killing him in the most violent way possible is the one of the few ways to go. Killing Tyreese was a pretty powerful episode and an interesting look at Tyreese's thought's as he succumbed to his injuries.

Sometimes I think the "black highlander" rule says more about those who invoke it. I don't really think it's the case. But that wasn't really my issue, it's just that right now there isn't a ton of diversity on the show. When they cut out characters like Heath and Scott and give their stories to new white characters, it does seem a little odd. Especially given the locations the show has taken place in. I bet Morgan will be back soon though, and there's still time for more characters to be introduced.

I do not think Rick has any business killing Pete; he may be the town "law", but Deanna is the leader, and all things have to run through her.

This brings up interesting points about their laws. I'd suppose they're trying to keep living by the old laws given how ignorant they seem, although that doesn't exactly explain the act of exiling. Having two police officers seems kind of strange if there isn't a court with a judge and rules.

And the punishment for every crime can't be exile. It sure seems like they should try something before just straight execution. Rick and Carol seem a little crazy here.

 

[hux]

Can someone clarify what Aiden meant when he said

"It was us, the others before, he didnt panick, we did...it was us"

What was he referring to? I don't remember anything connected to that (but I do occasionally zone out)

 

[Mojochi]

Can someone clarify what Aiden meant when he said

"It was us, the others before, he didnt panick, we did...it was us"

What was he referring to? I don't remember anything connected to that (but I do occasionally zone out)

On their 1st outing with Glenn, Aiden claimed that four members of their previous squad had died while on their last run... because they'd panicked, broke formation , abandoned the plan & lost control. When Glenn tossed it back in his face afterward, it's what caused their scuffle

On his death bed, he confessed that the four hadn't panicked, he & Nicholas had, just like they were doing in this situation & Nicholas confirmed it beforehand in his final words to Aiden, about "This is who we are", meaning they cut & run... not much different than Tobin's group, apparently

Edit: Also... How evil, corrupt, or antagonistic can our group really be? Anyone who takes on a priest (Especially a cowardly one) has to be willing to entertain morality. They incorporate the weak & cowardly, and teach them to be strong, Cowardly Eugene, Suicidal Beth, Underage Carl, Elderly people, infants. I mean... C'mon. Sure Rick has to care for those kids, but no one else is required to, however... they do

What's ridiculous is that not only is Gabriel blind to the good they do & skewed to the awful they've done, he made a terrible call, even if he believes he's right about them. What's Deanna supposed to do about it NOW? They're already in & in leadership roles all over the place. If he truly believes they're dangerous, then why create conflict, cause a rift. HE'S endangering people by causing division... Sanctimonious shithead

 

[Trekker4747]

This brings up interesting points about their laws. I'd suppose they're trying to keep living by the old laws given how ignorant they seem, although that doesn't exactly explain the act of exiling. Having two police officers seems kind of strange if there isn't a court with a judge and rules.

And the punishment for every crime can't be exile. It sure seems like they should try something before just straight execution. Rick and Carol seem a little crazy here.

Deanna called Rick their constable, which is basically a glorified security guard. Strictly speaking, if we're to take Deanna literally for her word, Rick has little law-enforcing power and he's just there for general security and the occasional problem solving. Same would extend to Michonne as the "Deputy." She's not there for law-enforcement but more to make sure people are playing nice.

I would think that Deanna has worked out "something" for incarceration other than banishment (a death sentence.) Maybe they've plans to build a jail or a couple small homes are planned, or already exist, to give people "house arrest."

There's got to be a plan for law-breaking that doesn't warrant banishment.

 

[Morpheus 02]

I know in Season 3 it was something of a "joke" that show had to rotate out characters in order to keep one black character on the show. T-Dog was killed when the black prison guy became more focused on, and then he was killed when Michonne joined our group.

But, honestly, the show has done pretty well in diversity and I think that black-characters keep dying is either more akin to staying within the bounds -more or less- with the comics or contract issues with the actors. I mean if they want to keep Noah around but the actor wants out to pursue another project, there's few options in this type of series. Killing him in the most violent way possible is the one of the few ways to go. Killing Tyreese was a pretty powerful episode and an interesting look at Tyreese's thought's as he succumbed to his injuries.

Noah's death is going to have some lingering effects on Glenn.

And Fr. Gabriel is still around as is Michonne and Sasha. (Of them I'd say Michonne is the safest.)

Gabriel is an ass-hat. I think he's trying to over-compensate for his own sins by trumping up the sins of others. And it's hard to really see, for me, why he's trumping up the actions of our group. He's been with them for over two months now and has likely seen how they are in more "normal" circumstances when they're not fighting other groups for their very lives. He's seen them work together and protect one another in desperate struggles but, apparently, he's still linger on the slaughtering of the Termites back in his church.

Yeah, they brutally killed a few people. People who were HUNTING them and intent on eating them! Gabriel, I'll take that over the man who locked his parishioners out of the church, leaving them to die a horrible death.

When ROTC Asshat got eaten I am sort-of surprised no one gave him a mercy head-shot.

And, really, through the episode we've seen more "good" from our group than bad compared to the Alexandrians. The Alexandrians were all prepared to abandon people and leaving them for dead. Glenn sacrificed himself and others to make sure they got out alive and tried to save ROTC Asshat. Eugene nutted up and sacrificed himself to save Tara.

Abraham sacrificed himself to save the build-team girl.

So, I think our group is still coming out looking better than the Alexandrians.

And then there's Carol.

Sigh.

This woman is out of her fucking mind.

Okay, maybe her little speech to the kid last week was something of act to make the kid wet himself and not tell anyone what she was doing. And maybe the kid is a complete idiot for going back to the woman who threatened to feed him to walkers just to get some stupid cookies. And it seems Carol's act is more to prevent herself from getting attached to the kid and getting hurt again should something happen to him. (She's lost Sophia, Mica and Lizzie.)

And the kid's father, Dr. Asshat, is a jackass as he apparently abuses his wife and kid.
But does that mean Rick needs to *kill* the guy?! Carol's grown detached from any form of society there may still be and that this community is trying to preserve or revive.

In a revenge sense maybe Dr. Asshat should die, but should Rick risk himself, his children and the rest of the group's security here because of some asshole?

I don't think so, Carol's suggestion is a touch extreme.

It isn't African Americans in general, but black men in particular. But progress has been made...T-Dog didn't get anything until the very end. Lately, there's been more characterization, even before the episode of their death.

 

[Skywalker]

Jessie is so obviously the abusive one, not Pete. The question is: will Rick and Carol realize that before it's too late?

 

[RJDiogenes]

Man, poor Noah-- I didn't expect we'd lose him so soon. That was a heartbreaking moment when Eugene looked down at the notebook where he had written "This is the beginning."

And we had two people torn apart by zombies Dawn of the Dead style-- I don't think we've seen that in a while.

We had several interesting character twists this episode: Eugene manned up, Gabriel went totally around the bend, and apparently so did Carol. "You're going to have to kill him."

I hope Tara survives.

 

[Mojochi]

Jessie is so obviously the abusive one, not Pete. The question is: will Rick and Carol realize that before it's too late?

You're probably right, given the kid damaged something of hers. Depends on what is too late, Pete dying, or Carol & Rick making a mess of things, because the former is not set in stone, but the latter almost certainly is

 

[Jax]

Well to be fair, anyone who isn't Rick, Daryl, Michonne, or Carol is probably destined to die at some point on this show.

I think only "Rick" is 100% safe from death until the series finale or penultimate episode of the entire show. Daryl is safe for the next 2/3 seasons but when the show is winding down I think they will go for shock value and end his run. I expect Carol to go by the end of season 6 and Michonne to be on a similar path to Daryl.

 

[Trekker4747]

Jessie is so obviously the abusive one, not Pete. The question is: will Rick and Carol realize that before it's too late?

You're probably right, given the kid damaged something of hers. Depends on what is too late, Pete dying, or Carol & Rick making a mess of things, because the former is not set in stone, but the latter almost certainly is

We've SEEN Pete behave in an abusive manner, so he's clearly the abusive one in the relationship. The kid could be lashing out at Jessie a) for lack of options to lash out b) because his mother is passive in the abuse and isn't doing anything to stop it. Retaliate against dad and you get a beating, retaliate against mom and nothing happens to you.

 

[hux]

On their 1st outing with Glenn, Aiden claimed that four members of their previous squad had died while on their last run... because they'd panicked, broke formation , abandoned the plan & lost control. When Glenn tossed it back in his face afterward, it's what caused their scuffle

On his death bed, he confessed that the four hadn't panicked, he & Nicholas had, just like they were doing in this situation & Nicholas confirmed it beforehand in his final words to Aiden, about "This is who we are", meaning they cut & run... not much different than Tobin's group, apparently

Ah right, wasn't paying attention

We've SEEN Pete behave in an abusive manner, so he's clearly the abusive one in the relationship. The kid could be lashing out at Jessie a) for lack of options to lash out b) because his mother is passive in the abuse and isn't doing anything to stop it. Retaliate against dad and you get a beating, retaliate against mom and nothing happens to you.

This

It amazes me how much people want to speculate about this show. People seem to think there's gonna be a huge, clever twist every single episode. What is that based on? Have there been massive unforeseen twists thus far? I haven't notice any.

EDIT - one thing I'm noticing though is when walkers often get shot, the blood splatters the camera. Is this purely stylistic or something else?

 

[Admiral2]

^^Huge twists, no, but the Governor turning out to be a dictator with his dead daughter hidden in a closet was a couple of mini twists. And the Termites being cannibals was the twist that Everybody Saw Coming...

 

[Trekker4747]

^^Huge twists, no, but the Governor turning out to be a dictator with his dead daughter hidden in a closet was a couple of mini twists. And the Termites being cannibals was the twist that Everybody Saw Coming...

Neither of those things are twists. Twists are things happening that seems to drastically contrast what you are shown. Right out of the gate it's obvious The Governor isn't what he seemed to be and that his persona was a charm he put on. And with the Termites that was probably more out familiarity with the comics or just that it was obviously telegraphed that the whole thing was too good to be true.

But, this show has never really given us a full, actual, out-of-nowhere twist. Remember when we weren't sure who was feeding the walkers at the prison gate and it was suspected there was a mole inside the prison group? Had it been Bob or any of the other "new" characters from the outside, THAT would have been a twist. Especially if Bob was built up to be one of the good-guys/part of the group. (Regardless of how much people saw through it, the narrative is what matters.)

But this show has never really done a true twist, sub-textual things, hidden meanings or anything of the sort. The "Morgan Street" closer to an in-joke than it is any "hidden clue." The "W" on the walker heads (which we KNOW is related to "The Wolves" given what we saw in the gated community) happening to look like a "M" when viewed upside down. No hidden meaning beyond some reminder that Morgan is out there.

Good as this show is, it's not doing twists or Lost-ian style hidden clues and such for future episodes.