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"The Wait is Over..."

I don't see why a late 24th or early 25th century show couldn't be done. Costs for effects and film editing have dropped dramatically; even amateurs can make relatively slick films with off-the-shelf equipment. Why couldn't CBS let a bunch of obsessed fans make a show and let it run on a cable channel, such as ScyFy? They could allot a fairly modest budget, and if it's run by the right kind of devoted fans (who are plentiful and not interested in being well-compensated), it could be very good. It wouldn't make much money, but it would probably turn a profit and give immense satisfaction to die-hard fans. Now that TV has room for such niche shows, why not?

Haven't some of the independent fan creations shown that it's possible? Obviously it'd have to be of a higher quality and be official and all that, but I think it'd be doable without breaking the bank or interfering with the successful new movies.

The only tricky part would be getting quality actors, but I bet there are many good ones I'm Hollywood who are between jobs.

Can someone explain to me why this isn't being considered or it's a bad idea?
 
New Voyages produces 2 episodes a year? No corporation is going to bother with that few episodes. Also, you said quality actors. That means unions, which mean union wages and residuals. Plus once you're talking about officially produced materials you're now talking union production staff. Also, even if the costs were low, it would still take up a slot on the schedule, and that slot could be producing more money, so why waste it on a low revenue show?

Finally, why does CBS want to help out SyFy which is owned by NBCU? If CBS was interested in Science Fiction and/or had a place to air it, then they would do it professionally. They don't have a place, so they won't bother, no reason to waste time/money on a low margin/low revenue show which will air on a competitor.
 
What if CBS released the shows direct to video?

There are many quality independent films made on a low budget: I was assuming a new Star Trek could be produced similarly.

But you're probably right. There's no hope.
 
I have almost zero interest in fan-made productions. Not even all professional productions are good, let alone profitable. Why would a corporation stand behind unprofessional fan-made products. That sounds like a disaster in the making.

The TOS characters won't be in the TV series but if they could get the movie actors to do cameos, of course they would, for the PR value.

Yep.

If (and it's a very big if) a new Trek show were on the air, it probably wouldn't announce which reality it was in. But the aesthetics would work off the Abrams template, because that work has already been done and why go to the expense of re-doing it all? And you certainly can't use the TOS aesthetics.

Yeah, like it would really fly having a show but not committing to which reality it takes place in? Trek fans would stand for that? They are critical and relentless. "I'll chase CBS round the moons of Nibia and round the Antares maelstrom and round perdition's flames before I give up finding out what reality this new show takes place in."

And anyway...

The (1960s) TOS asthetics are a part of the original timeline for that time period. We have them in the more modern TNG "Relics", DS9 "Trials and Tribble-ations" and Enterprise "In a Mirror, Darkly." Seeing those episodes makes me feel all warm and fuzzy nostalgic. I accept that look (with remastered upgrades) as an inherent part of the 2260s in the prime timeline.

You're right, there's no way that would use the TOS asthetics today. So therefore, there's no way you could have a reality-ambiguous show. Since the show would have the new timeline appearance, it would be out of place in the original timeline, just like the TOS asthetics would be completely out of place and a real eye sore for the 2260s of the new timeline. They are mutually exclusive.

Don't kid yourself. If a new TV series ever happens, it will emphatically take place in the new timeline. But I think the smart money would be on making it thematically more in the spirit of the previous TV shows. Flashy looks and quality sci-fi exploration stories.

I dream of a Trek universe that has bold, epic, in-your-face cinematic adventure like the new movie and intelligent dramatic stories of the TV shows. It is possible for them both to exist in the same (new) universe.

And if it is any consulation, it is likely that Abrams wouldn't actually direct the TV series.
 
"T'Pau" was a character in a script created by a freelancer under contract terms of the WGA agreement then in place.

So how does the rock band of that name get away with using it?

You can have the same name in different mediums if it's clear that there is no relationship. The most obvious example is Apple Music(the Beatles) and Apple Computers(Steve Jobs). A rock band using the name is a similar story. But if a Star Trek writer uses the name to represent the same character, then that is obviously the same copyright and needs to be paid for.
 
There are categories in copyright law - you have to check whether your name has already been taken by something else in the category. For instance, a computer game company I worked for wanted to name a game "Vortex." Of course a copyright search turned up a ton of stuff - a nightclub by that name, a potential movie, a motorcycle company, etc.

I'm sure there was a rock band by that name because there's a rock band by any name you can imagine. :rommie: Only the movie was a problem because it was in the same copyright category as computer games (being media entertainment).

Naming a rock band T'Pau might be okay but try giving that name to a computer game, even one that has nothing to do with Star Trek or that character, and you're in trouble. (This is all iirc - it's been a long time since I've done a copyright search like that.)

I don't see why a late 24th or early 25th century show couldn't be done. Costs for effects and film editing have dropped dramatically; even amateurs can make relatively slick films with off-the-shelf equipment. Why couldn't CBS let a bunch of obsessed fans make a show and let it run on a cable channel, such as ScyFy? They could allot a fairly modest budget, and if it's run by the right kind of devoted fans (who are plentiful and not interested in being well-compensated), it could be very good. It wouldn't make much money, but it would probably turn a profit and give immense satisfaction to die-hard fans. Now that TV has room for such niche shows, why not?

Haven't some of the independent fan creations shown that it's possible? Obviously it'd have to be of a higher quality and be official and all that, but I think it'd be doable without breaking the bank or interfering with the successful new movies.

The only tricky part would be getting quality actors, but I bet there are many good ones I'm Hollywood who are between jobs.

Can someone explain to me why this isn't being considered or it's a bad idea?
Because nothing you mentioned is a factor that would motivate CBS to do a 24th/25th C show. Here's the problem:

CBS wouldn't want to do a Star Trek show at all. They are making tons of money just doing police procedurals. Have you taken a look a their lineup? The Dominion doesn't have that many clones! :rommie: But their audience loves that shit - CBS is doing great in the ratings, while its network competitors are floundering to varying degrees.

The market sending a clear message to keep doing exactly what they are doing, with no variations, and they are complying. Why wouldn't they? The people who make decisions keep their jobs only if the money keeps flowing in. They're not going to risk their jobs over Star Trek!

Nobody is doing space opera, not even the so-called "science fiction channel." (Unless you count SG:U, which is too depressing to think about.) Why would CBS want to do space opera? It doesn't do sci fi of any sort, not even one of those cop shows with sci fi window dressing.

It could produce Star Trek for one of its channels other than CBS, but what would that be? CW? Showtime? They're both wrong for Star Trek.

So what could possibly motivate CBS to ignore the huge disincentives to making a Star Trek series and do it anyway? Only the hope of making massive amounts of money. The track record of Star Trek on TV does not scream "cash cow." Maybe Trek XI doesn't either - movie success doesn't guarantee anything about TV success - but it's the one and only element that might grab CBS's attention for a brief millisecond before they go back to planning CSI: Paducah.

If by some miracle, they do a Star Trek series for Showtime (which is more likely than CBS or CW), then they'll cater to the Showtime subscribers. If they don't think they can interest Showtime subscribers in Star Trek, it won't happen at all.

Yeah, like it would really fly having a show but not committing to which reality it takes place in? Trek fans would stand for that? They are critical and relentless.
The number of potential viewers who would notice whether a Trek show on TV matches Trek XI is not enough to cause a blip in the ratings. CBS would not bother making anything for the tiny number of people who care about stuff like that, much less bitch about it on BBSes like this one. They'd need a big audience, at least 10M, or they won't bother.

By any definition, Star Trek "fans" are too few to bother making TV or movies for. In either case, you need to cater to a mass audience. We were just lucky that Trek XI was pretty respectful of Trek lore. Abrams could have had a big hit while thumbing his nose at all of us. He doesn't need us; we need him.
And if it is any consulation, it is likely that Abrams wouldn't actually direct the TV series.
I'd love to see him produce the TV series, but I doubt it's a priority for him. However, nobody is going to produce a TV series that doesn't at least have his blessing, because the money his movie made has now made him Mr. Star Trek. In the Hollywood heirarchy, money is the only thing that counts.
 
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I still say if a new Star Trek series is going to happen, it will end up on The CW before CBS or Showtime. Even though CW is currently gearing itself toward a young female demographic currently, they look to expand to wider range of audience in the future. I cannot say Smallville and Supernatural are two shows aimed at just this group. If Paramount and CBS want to do it within the next few years, it won't be competing with many other sci-fi space shows.

I would like to have something go a few decades after The Next Generation era. 20 to 30 years maybe. It would allow a new show to exist on its own without relying on being heavily connected to any of the prior shows. It probably should be limited to loose references to major events that happened in a prior Star Trek production. Don't make to where the viewers have to be a Star Trek guru to follow the new show. Having some time after any of the prior shows allows some new history to be created for the new shows setting. Being set in the Star Trek Universe, going to need Vulcans, Klingons, Romulans, along with popular Star Trek aliens, and at the same time introduce to new ones.

I do not want to see something that is a sequel to another Star Trek show where every episode has something to do with an episode of TNG, DS9, Voyager, etc. I think I speak for the majority of us that it has to be original and existing on its own. Maybe after the show ran for a few years, then it can do some big connected episodes for the fans. Do it like DS9 did for the original series Klingons, Tribbles, or the Mirror Universe. Even with that, the episodes were written to stand on their own to fit in among the new show.
 
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"T'Pau" was a character in a script created by a freelancer under contract terms of the WGA agreement then in place.

So how does the rock band of that name get away with using it?

You can have the same name in different mediums if it's clear that there is no relationship. The most obvious example is Apple Music(the Beatles) and Apple Computers(Steve Jobs).

Didn't Apple Music actually complain about Apple Computer though?
 
So how does the rock band of that name get away with using it?

You can have the same name in different mediums if it's clear that there is no relationship. The most obvious example is Apple Music(the Beatles) and Apple Computers(Steve Jobs).

Didn't Apple Music actually complain about Apple Computer though?

Initially yes, but the courts ruled in Apple Computer's favor. When Apple Computer started iTunes and selling music they returned to court. I forget the outcome of the second case(maybe settled out of court), but they point is it was only when Apple Computers started selling music that it became an issue.
 
If Paramount and CBS want to do it within the next few years, it won't be competing with many other sci-fi space shows.

Where you see lack of competition, CBS sees lack of market interest in. Also, for the last time PARAMOUNT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH TV TREK.
 
I'll admit I haven't read the whole thread, so my apologies if I'm repeating points others have made.

With regards to a future show, I think they should let the recent film(s) sit in the public consciousness for a bit first, then start work on a new show.

And for that show, my personal preference would be to see a 25th century premise (a thought I didn't like to entertain before Trex XI). Much in the same way that TNG was far enough removed from the TOS films in the 80s to entice new fans and satisfy old ones, this new series could try a similar approach while tackling a whole new, independent area of the Trek universe.

For the film fans, there can obviously be reference made to the destruction of Romulus. For the series fans, undoubtedly there might be the occasional reference to the Borg or Dominion War, and that's all the involvement they have to play. With a big enough jump in the show's (prime) timeline, you can introduce a new set of characters, technology, visuals, politics and enemies. Basically start afresh from both the previous series and the rebooted film franchise, and gain a whole new fanbase, much as TNG did back in 1987.

And as for format, I'm definitely a fan of more serialised and darker settings, such as DS9 and ENT's Xindi storyline. While I missed the standalone episodes in Enterprise, I've realised rewatching season 4 that I rarely revisit the standalones, but I still think they should be incorporated now and then for character development and one-off adventures that wouldn't work in the main story otherwise.

I'm happy to wait a few years though, see how the new films fare. I'd also like to see a return to how TV used to be, when shows were given a couple of seasons to find their footing rather than being summarily cancelled for not maintaining 10 million viewers every single episode, and budgetary concerns weren't offset by how profitable and cheap to produce reality and talent shows are by comparison:p It's a big ask, but you never know...
 
Where you see lack of competition, CBS sees lack of market interest in. Also, for the last time PARAMOUNT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH TV TREK.

What I should say is lack of strong quality science fiction type of space show. One of the few first run space show on the air right now is "Stargate Universe". I do not believe "V" would go beyond a 2nd season now. A new show would draw in in viewers just because it is Star Trek related. Just has to be good enough to keep people watching.

I am not sure what is the status of the legal agreement is between Paramount and CBS. Paramount still may have control of the copyright. Both companies may have to make an agreement or else its a major lawsuit. CBS will be producing it, but may have to pay Paramount royalties.

A court battle happened with the James Bond franchise in the early 1990s. That's why there's a gap between "License to Kill" and "Goldeneye." Star Trek could end up in that situation if two companies claim franchise ownership.
 
There are not enough Star Trek fans to make a show sustainable on network TV. And that is assuming ALL fans tune in just because it's Star Trek. For a show to work on network tv, it will need a lot more than Star Trek fans. And until you can prove that there are enough space opera fans to make any space show sustainable on network tv, CBS will be happy to keep Star Trek in its back pocket without producing any new content.
 
I never said CBS will produce a Star Trek show and air it on CBS. They can sell programs to whoever they want to. Maybe they can make something and release it directly to syndication. That way it won't have to aired in prime time, where Star Trek shows have done very well in the past. All the CBS affiliates probably get it offered to them first before being sold to other local stations. CBS and Warner still have split ownership of the CW, but the future of CW is uncertain. Not sure how a new Star Trek show will affect the CW if they decided on one.

To be honest, the space opera thing may not work on Star Trek. Yes they can do short story arcs and two part episodes. Having one ongoing story arc for the whole series won't keep it going very long. What worked on past Star Trek shows is going to a new place each week and people probably want to see that in a new show.

I know we all talked about introducing new aliens that become a new threat, but has anyone given thought about the threat coming from within. The Federation is a very big organization with 150+ worlds. What if there's corruption at the highest levels. What if some of those worlds don't agree with Federation decisions and start to slit off.
 
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Look at the list of shows produced by CBS. List. They all air on CBS or CW. The TV landscape has changed. All productions are in house these days.

Also, first run syndication isn't viable. Legend of the Seeker tried it at a fraction of the production cost that Trek would have and it couldn't generate enough ratings to be sustainable. So why would CBS spend even more money on a show that won't make money, and damage a valuable asset at the same time?
 
Also, first run syndication isn't viable. Legend of the Seeker tried it at a fraction of the production cost that Trek would have and it couldn't generate enough ratings to be sustainable. So why would CBS spend even more money on a show that won't make money, and damage a valuable asset at the same time?

Yep.

First run syndication is a market that came and went. A few strong, long-term survivors dominate what's left of it - mainly Oprah.
 
It is hard to say what is going to happen with The CW within the next few years. Their most popular and longest running show, "Smallville" is running far beyond its life. I hope this upcoming season will be its last. "Supernatural" may not go for much longer either. Both shows will be gone by the time the next Star Trek movie hits the theaters and CW would be hunting for new programming. Don't know if they have plans for another super hero show. If Trek 12 does well CBS & CW may try to capitalize on it. That's if The CW is still around after 2012. If CW folds, the syndication market may open back up. All those TV stations will be looking for first run tv shows.

Lets face it, the CW is not doing that well right now and who knows whats going to happen after Smallville and some of their other major shows are gone. We never know, a well designed Star Trek show could save CW.

Remember UPN merged with WB not long "Star Trek Enterprise" got cancelled. It was not all because Enterprise was poorly put together. It was stated that Trek was over saturating the market and was running too long. Too many things were done too quickly and people just got board of it. If a new Trek show comes to light, please let it be the only one on TV until it runs its course (First Run.)
 
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It is hard to say what is going to happen with The CW within the next few years. Their most popular and longest running show, "Smallville" is running far beyond its life. I hope this upcoming season will be its last.
They've already announced that this is Smallville's final season.
 
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