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The UK has a Nationwide Strike!

From what i heard they shipped the workers in with out advertising them first which i thought was illegal under EU law or have i been told wrong?
I am not saying what happening is right but i do wonder what would happen if it was UK workers being shipped in to Italy would they mind?
 
I am not saying what happening is right but i do wonder what would happen if it was UK workers being shipped in to Italy would they mind?

No they wouldn't either, in fact they'd probably be more physically violent about it.

And Mandelson and Brown both offering little else but curt replies about 'protectionism' and buggering off to Europe to find jobs has pissed off people:

Dear Britain: Get Stuffed. Sincerely, New Labour.

To: The Rt Hon. Peter Mandelson esq;

As if we weren’t already going out of our minds in fits of rage at the rampant incompetence, gutter rutting corruption, untrammeled arrogance and utterly diabolic parody of a “government” that currently squats atop this nation like a gigantic dose of piles - the sweating, blubbering, puss filled monstrosity takes a few moments pause from chewing the corpse of Great Britain to open its blood filled mouth and tell us what it really thinks of British workers and the general public.

Apparently, in Marxist/Fabian UK, striking pre-emptively in defence of your economic wellbeing at a time of extreme distress and fear for the future of your family, now qualifies one as a “racist,” an “extremist,” or, worst of all, a dreaded PROTECTIONIST.

In these statements we can clearly sense the abject fear of the serial peeping tom who got caught, yet again, climbing through the window of the girls dormitory, pants around ankles, in a most unseemly and compromising position. Well far be it from us to paint such an unflattering picture of our wonderful “public servants”, after all, they do have our best interests at heart, do they not Mr Mandelson?

Clearly not content simply destroying our currency, armed forces, international reputation, political system and constitution, the laughing hyenas have now taken off those - ever so temporary - woolen jackets and shown themselves to be the fascist Eurocrat wolves that they truly are.

But seriously Mr Mandelson, did it not occur to you that the violent death of the entire system of economics (that you seem intent to defend to the last) is common knowledge now to the “man in the street,” even perhaps the poor sod who has to pluck the remnants of the foie gras and smoked salmon from your new ermine trimmed coat. Perhaps he might give you a lesson in “Buy British” one fine morning while you are busy warming up for another hard day of pontificating for the cameras and making a damn fool of yourself, again …

But anyway, I shouldn’t worry yourself unduly Mr M, there will be plenty of room in that “free trade” coffin for the mass hordes of other “has been” politicians and pundits the world over before we are finally through with this sorry chapter in the history of human folly and hubris.
Surely, any silly idea that the extreme weather would be a good time to stick the boot into British workers seems to have backfired spectacularly, does it not, or is it after all just another part of your grand master plan to bring the country to it’s knees in time for EUROPOL to come and help restore order?

And so, in concluding Mr Mandelson, given that your track record in government is not exactly one which could honestly be described as a testament to a honed ability in handling political crises of ones own making, I have a not so friendly word of advice for you Sir:
You should resign your position in the Lords immediately and without further delay, before the braying mob that you youself have just enraged to the point of violence, pulls you screeching from the building and hurls you into the nearby frozen waters clothed in nothing more than a frilly pink nightie.

In truth, while such an amusing spectacle would afford the vast majority of honest people in this long suffering country a much needed break from the daily misery that you and your henchmen have wrought on us, we prefer to settle these matters peacefully, and without need for any further unnecessary distress on either side of this rapidly escalating crisis.
Do it. Do it now. Get ye gone Sir!
Sincerely,

The UK Column

Link
 
but the bullshit that Total Oil has pulled is intrinsically hostile to the British population and will be unsustainable if it carries on like this throughout the country - why should business executive and shareholders abandon the population that made them wealthy in the first place?

As Deckerd pointed out in TNZ, one thing that seems to have been ignroed in all the xenophobic fun and ranting is that Total is a French company, operating on British soil. By most of the arguments given by the strikers, the company shouldn't even be here and employing any Britons.
 
I am not saying what happening is right but i do wonder what would happen if it was UK workers being shipped in to Italy would they mind?

No they wouldn't either, in fact they'd probably be more physically violent about it.


Actually Radio 4 covered this very issue yesterday - they are quite happy with british labour - not so happy to pay them their pensions when the time comes...
 
From what i heard they shipped the workers in with out advertising them first which i thought was illegal under EU law or have i been told wrong


Completely legal as far as I am aware - any worker within the EU is considered "local" for employment purposes.

Those jobs wouldn't have been advertised anyway - because they were sub-contracted and then the sub-constractor sub-contracted them to an italian company. Total isn't directly employing those people.
 
Don't worry, soon the IMF will step in & we'll have a 3 day week and we'll be in the 70s instead.

I'm a bit young to remember that but one of my mates already is already on a 3 day week (Just got cut down this week).

Ah, I'm sorry to hear that. Another classic sign of the fag-end of a Labour government...

I never used this particular abbreviation before, but: QFT!

The same for the letter TedShatner quoted.

Does anyone know why we're still putting up with all this off someone like Peter "How many times have I been fired now?" Mandelson (I will NEVER acknowledge his title), or Gordon "I wasn't actually democratically elected by the people or my party" Brown?

This is the guy who held the purse strings for over 10 years, and is still managing to mess everything up. On every front. Incidentally, I'm moving abroad next month, cos I've had enough. I was way ahead of Mandy's suggestion :p

REVØLUCION, anyone? :shifty:
 
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but the bullshit that Total Oil has pulled is intrinsically hostile to the British population and will be unsustainable if it carries on like this throughout the country - why should business executive and shareholders abandon the population that made them wealthy in the first place?

As Deckerd pointed out in TNZ, one thing that seems to have been ignroed in all the xenophobic fun and ranting is that Total is a French company, operating on British soil. By most of the arguments given by the strikers, the company shouldn't even be here and employing any Britons.

That is another reason why extreme globalization and privatisation is unsustainable. You'll just get many of our services and utilities bought out by foreign companies who don't have our interests at heart.
 
Gordon "I wasn't actually democratically elected by the people or my party" Brown?

:vulcan: So how exactly did he become MP for Kirkcaldy and Cowdenbeath?

This is the guy who held the purse strings for over 10 years, and is still managing to mess everything up. On every front. Incidentally,
Erm, I'm no fan of labour's social policy, but for 10 of those 12 years, w ehad the most prosperous times any Britain alive can remember. You may dislike Labour for whatever reason, but we had quite literally never had it so good.

I'm moving abroad next month, cos I've had enough.
Which countires do you prefer, which have significantly different economic polices and a preferable social structure? Anywhere in the EU the employment laws will be the same, if you don't like Labour economics, you won't like the US or Canada...


REVØLUCION, anyone? :shifty:
OVEREACTIØN, anyone? :shifty:


That is another reason why extreme globalization and privatisation is unsustainable. You'll just get many of our services and utilities bought out by foreign companies who don't have our interests at heart.

Erm, Total have always been French. They weren't 'bought out' by anyone. And if you're referring to British-companies-only, BP can't handle the load of the whole country, and monopolies are desirable for no-one, least of all the workers.
 
Gordon "I wasn't actually democratically elected by the people or my party" Brown?

:vulcan: So how exactly did he become MP for Kirkcaldy and Cowdenbeath?

Maybe, but I don't remember electing him as PM. John Major was in a similar situation, and called a general election. It just so happens it worked out in his favour. I'm honestly not sure which way an election would go at present, but obviously he was never confident enough.

This is the guy who held the purse strings for over 10 years, and is still managing to mess everything up. On every front. Incidentally,
Erm, I'm no fan of labour's social policy, but for 10 of those 12 years, w ehad the most prosperous times any Britain alive can remember. You may dislike Labour for whatever reason, but we had quite literally never had it so good.
Yeah...erm... Not really seeing that over the last couple of years to be honest. Pensions have steadily been getting worse, the NHS is in ruins, lending and debt is out of control, and lest we forget the 10p tax debacle in April 2008? Doesn't exactly help with "prosperity", does it?

Which countires do you prefer, which have significantly different economic polices and a preferable social structure? Anywhere in the EU the employment laws will be the same, if you don't like Labour economics, you won't like the US or Canada...
I never questioned employment laws. And neither will I be moving to America or Canada. I'm moving to the Netherlands, who are well known to have pretty decent (and in my opinion, better) social and economic policies (Amsterdam is in the middle of a major growth spurt while the US and UK are in dire straits), and I will be entitled to some tax relief being an ex-pat, so yeah... I'd see that as a sweetener for the deal.

REVØLUCION, anyone? :shifty:
OVEREACTIØN, anyone? :shifty:
That was intended to be light-hearted, no need to go overboard with your Acme Sarcasm Ray© :rolleyes:
 
Gordon "I wasn't actually democratically elected by the people or my party" Brown?

:vulcan: So how exactly did he become MP for Kirkcaldy and Cowdenbeath?

Maybe, but I don't remember electing him as PM. John Major was in a similar situation,

Every PM has been in that siuation. We elect the party, not the man, in Britain. Who the party then choose as leader is entirely up to them. And they can pick it by 'eenie-meenie-minie-mo' if they want. And they can change leaders every week, if they want.


Yeah...erm... Not really seeing that over the last couple of years to be honest. Pensions have steadily been getting worse, the NHS is in ruins, lending and debt is out of control, and lest we forget the 10p tax debacle in April 2008? Doesn't exactly help with "prosperity", does it?
Lowest unemployment in years, average wage through the roof, and the NHS is not in ruins (the Daily Express saying something doesn't make it true). From 1997-2007, Britons enjoyed their most prosperous decade since the war; arguably ever, in fact. As I said, I don't support Gordon Brown on social grounds (42 day detention, etc) and many aspects of his handling of the economy over the last year or two have been poor. But it is simply dishonest to say that Britons suffered economically under the first 10 years of Labour.
 
:vulcan: So how exactly did he become MP for Kirkcaldy and Cowdenbeath?

Maybe, but I don't remember electing him as PM. John Major was in a similar situation,

Every PM has been in that siuation. We elect the party, not the man, in Britain. Who the party then choose as leader is entirely up to them. And they can pick it by 'eenie-meenie-minie-mo' if they want. And they can change leaders every week, if they want.


Yeah...erm... Not really seeing that over the last couple of years to be honest. Pensions have steadily been getting worse, the NHS is in ruins, lending and debt is out of control, and lest we forget the 10p tax debacle in April 2008? Doesn't exactly help with "prosperity", does it?
Lowest unemployment in years, average wage through the roof, and the NHS is not in ruins (the Daily Express saying something doesn't make it true). From 1997-2007, Britons enjoyed their most prosperous decade since the war; arguably ever, in fact. As I said, I don't support Gordon Brown on social grounds (42 day detention, etc) and many aspects of his handling of the economy over the last year or two have been poor. But it is simply dishonest to say that Britons suffered economically under the first 10 years of Labour.

I don't argue that introductions such as the minimum wage were nothing but a good thing, but I do think there's been an awful lot of manipulating figures: No nurse shortages in the NHS - because a lot of hospitals closed, unemployment figures don't count this person for one reason, that person for another, etc. True, every government does that, but I don't think anybody's really tried it as much as we've seen recently.

I concede that the first couple of years were a feel-good time for everybody, but I was a student for four years from 2002, and going through the university system was a very tough time for me with various small, but noticeable changes made with regards to financial aid. And now I'm in a position where, among other things, the student loan repayments I'm making are less than the total monthly interest, so I'm technically in infinite debt.

Maybe that's just my experience, and everybody else had a much more prosperous time, but I can't really comment from that side of it... So, agree to disagree? ;)
 
British jobs for British workers!
Family always comes first, who would you give a job to who needs one? a member of your family such as your brother or son or a complete and utter stranger from two towns over?

Exactly, at the end of the day you look after your own first, you don't kick you daughter out of a house and onto the street and give the house to a stranger. It just doesn't work that way.

As far as i'm concerned globalisation can kiss my back passage.

Britain is a 'home' and British people together are a 'family'. Family sticks together. I'm not going to send my daughter to her room without food and invite a stranger in to eat her food instead.

Would you open your front door and just let anybody into your house? no you flaming well wouldn't, well that's exactly what is happening with the freedom of Migration within the EU.
It's like saying "please come into my house mr stranger and feel free to use my electric and gas and sleep in my bed, i'll just sleep on the floor"
 
^ I thought you were a fan of the EU, the Euro, etc, etc.

The issues in this thread are all secondary functions brought about by how the EU works. Under the treaties we've signed, our "home" & "family" aren't the UK any more, but the EU. As JoeZhang correctly points out, these "foreign" employees are all legally local, under EU law.

There's a disconnect between public perception and legal reality in terms of what powers the UK Government has left that is only going to become more obvious as the years pass.
 
^ I thought you were a fan of the EU, the Euro, etc, etc.

I am all for the EU except for the freedom of migration. I'm not happy with the millions of people coming here for jobs especially when we've got rising unemployment.


And all the brits in France, Belgium, Spain etc. should come home? What's the limit? If they have worked there for more than 4 years can they stay?

What about me? I spend half of my time here and half in Brussels and my business is in both places, which half of the business should I layoff? Should I lay off the brits (some of whom are in Brussels) and move the business lock, stock and two barrels to Brussels (where the money is for my type of work).

How would the EU work with restrictions on the mobility of labour?
 
If all the British people working in the EU were forced to come back to Britain, which is what Tacky is insisting should happen, the unemployment numbers would be much higher than they are now. I suppose this has been pointed out several times but it bears repeating.
 
And all the brits in France, Belgium, Spain etc. should come home? What's the limit? If they have worked there for more than 4 years can they stay?

What about me? I spend half of my time here and half in Brussels and my business is in both places, which half of the business should I layoff? Should I lay off the brits (some of whom are in Brussels) and move the business lock, stock and two barrels to Brussels (where the money is for my type of work).

How would the EU work with restrictions on the mobility of labour?

We shouldn't throw out the baby with the bath water by slamming up Britain's drawbidge and working abroad seems to be the only option available to many British people now, but what Total Oil did was totally unnecessary and systematically damaging, with no consent from any of the workers involved (both local and foreign). And what about the other big box corporations sending away IT, phone services, administration, and manufacturing in recent years for the sake of being more 'dynamic'?

I agree with cultcross that the Tories are no better than Labour and in some ways markedly worse, but in the last twenty years they've become so similar to each other as to render the democratic process entirely meaningless and they've now become little else but a strange representative board for big business.
 
^ I thought you were a fan of the EU, the Euro, etc, etc.

I am all for the EU except for the freedom of migration. I'm not happy with the millions of people coming here for jobs especially when we've got rising unemployment.

Well like it or not, the ultimate goal of the EU is federalisation. This isn't some half baked conspiracy theory, it is the stated long term goal of moves such as the abortive EU constitution. So the EU is taking us down the road that will lead to us becoming states in a vast nation, which in some limited sense, we already are. So your xenophobia suddenly becomes the same as not giving a job in Boston to someone from Oregon because they're from out of state.
Already, our economies are tied inextricably together; it is stupid, counter-productive and mutually damaging to attempt to practice nationally segregated workforces in a deeply economically integrated alliance. To practice labour or trade protectionism will cause many many more losses of business and jobs than you're worried about the immigrants taking.
 
I don't have anything of substance to contribute, but I want to thank the participants here. I've learned a great deal about both sides of the issue.
 
^ I thought you were a fan of the EU, the Euro, etc, etc.

I am all for the EU except for the freedom of migration. I'm not happy with the millions of people coming here for jobs especially when we've got rising unemployment.

And I am definitely unhappy with locking away the opportunities for people to go wherever they wish, work in whatever employment they desire, or live/settle down wherever they want to.

Essentially what you are proposing is keeping everyone within their own borders and limiting their freedoms in the long run.
I'm sorry, but I detest those kinds of limitations and in the end, you'd be condemning millions of people to misery.
The visa system and the requirements the governments have in place are already bad enough.

I agree there has to be some kind of a limit to prevent an overflow ... but at the same time, foreigners should have equal opportunities and not being exploited either simply because they were born outside of a specific country.
I also agree with the premise that British workers shouldn't be excluded when it comes to finding jobs in their own country ... but at the same time, a lot of foreigners are working on jobs that British natives don't want to work on because for the most part, wages are too low, or there is some other reason.
If a foreigner is barely able of getting a job that no one wants, they are hardly stealing it from British people.
The government should devise a better plan in this regard to provide equal opportunities for everyone while having a better system in order to prevent an overflow of workers.

If you make a decision to eliminate jobs for foreigners in UK, then equally, British people who work and live elsewhere would/should lose their ability to work in other countries (in effect, it would happen either way as it's a double-edged sword),and you can bet that those people who'd be forced to return to UK (potentially to nothing if they settled in a new country) ... you'd have a large number of angry British natives at your hands as well.
 
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