"The Trouble With Tribbles" is the most overrated episode of TOS...
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Re: "The Trouble With Tribbles" is the most overrated episode of TOS..
I disagree here. A Piece of the Action, like I, Mudd, had everyone acting totally out of character for laughs. What impressed me about Tribbles, was that most of the humor was character based. The “tribble pile” was the only overt slapstick in the episode and only Shatner’s delivery (and De Kelley’s wonderful “stop feeding them” line) made it funny. Humor is subjective and jokes get old and less funny over time. But this episode keeps everyone in character and without the jokes is still amusing and interesting. A Piece of the Action is wildly over the top and a real tough haul for me. I Mudd is also far too silly for my taste. I feel the same way about The Voyage Home. For me, a two star film while others apparently loved it.
I disagree here. A Piece of the Action, like I, Mudd, had everyone acting totally out of character for laughs. What impressed me about Tribbles, was that most of the humor was character based. The “tribble pile” was the only overt slapstick in the episode and only Shatner’s delivery (and De Kelley’s wonderful “stop feeding them” line) made it funny. Humor is subjective and jokes get old and less funny over time. But this episode keeps everyone in character and without the jokes is still amusing and interesting. A Piece of the Action is wildly over the top and a real tough haul for me. I Mudd is also far too silly for my taste. I feel the same way about The Voyage Home. For me, a two star film while others apparently loved it.
Re: "The Trouble With Tribbles" is the most overrated episode of TOS..
I didn’t know that and my unfaltering devotion to the Great Bird of the Galaxy just exponentially increased.
If there is one TOS episode I truly detest it’s “I’ Mudd”. I missed this one a couple of times during reruns in the Seventies and when I finally got to watch it I just thought WTF (okay, it had a cool beginning but then it goes south rather fast).
How comes? Taken as a metaphor or analogy to portray the ultimate hypocrite with a holier-than-thou attitude (i.e. Nomad) I think it worked rather well.
Bob
I didn’t know that and my unfaltering devotion to the Great Bird of the Galaxy just exponentially increased.
If there is one TOS episode I truly detest it’s “I’ Mudd”. I missed this one a couple of times during reruns in the Seventies and when I finally got to watch it I just thought WTF (okay, it had a cool beginning but then it goes south rather fast).
How comes? Taken as a metaphor or analogy to portray the ultimate hypocrite with a holier-than-thou attitude (i.e. Nomad) I think it worked rather well.
Bob
Re: "The Trouble With Tribbles" is the most overrated episode of TOS..
Now that is funny. Unlike Star Trek episodes purporting to be so.
Now that is funny. Unlike Star Trek episodes purporting to be so.
Re: "The Trouble With Tribbles" is the most overrated episode of TOS..
David Gerrold's contributions to STAR TREK are way overrated, in my opinion - TROUBLE with TRIBBLES, in particular. But what can you do about who had Gene's "ear" at what time? Like how John Logan with his head rammed up Brent Spiner's ass gave us NEMESIS. Lots of people love that installment, too and rail on about how wonderful that is. The humour in the TRIBBLES episode is just lame, that's all. If it were actually "funny," it would rock. But as it is, it's just cheesey. It's a lot like VOYAGE HOME, in that regard. Nicolas Meyer, for someone who's reputed to be the rebel of STAR TREK, with Oh, such a complete DISS-regard for it's Traditions, and all, the humour of STAR TREK IV is surprisingly neutered and stale. The idea of little fur ball parasites causing Kirk and company alot of grief is interesting and I can see how girls, especially, would think they were cute, but, uh ... this episode does nothing for me.
David Gerrold's contributions to STAR TREK are way overrated, in my opinion - TROUBLE with TRIBBLES, in particular. But what can you do about who had Gene's "ear" at what time? Like how John Logan with his head rammed up Brent Spiner's ass gave us NEMESIS. Lots of people love that installment, too and rail on about how wonderful that is. The humour in the TRIBBLES episode is just lame, that's all. If it were actually "funny," it would rock. But as it is, it's just cheesey. It's a lot like VOYAGE HOME, in that regard. Nicolas Meyer, for someone who's reputed to be the rebel of STAR TREK, with Oh, such a complete DISS-regard for it's Traditions, and all, the humour of STAR TREK IV is surprisingly neutered and stale. The idea of little fur ball parasites causing Kirk and company alot of grief is interesting and I can see how girls, especially, would think they were cute, but, uh ... this episode does nothing for me.
Re: "The Trouble With Tribbles" is the most overrated episode of TOS..
"And the Children Shall Lead" for me.
"And the Children Shall Lead" for me.
Re: "The Trouble With Tribbles" is the most overrated episode of TOS..
I'm not sure what you find embarrassing about it, because you don't say, but I find what they did to Uhura in "The Changeling" pretty embarrassing myself, specifically the tortuous reading scene with Chapel forcing her to speak English that's capped by "blue-y".
I could say that any episode with Rand's wig is embarrassing, because that wig was a monstrosity. "Miri" has to make my list of embarrassments for other reasons: Rand's look-at-my-legs line and the classic Kirk line, "No blah blah blah!" On the other hand, that Kirk line is a classic, but I think only because it's so bad.
There are others....
But anyway, getting back to "Tribbles", I agree that it's overrated. I don't find much in it funny any more, but I may have just seen it too many times. The barroom fight, starting with the exchange that sets it off, is still funny to me. I guess Kirk buried almost to his chest in the tribble pile is funny enough, too.
I'm not sure what you find embarrassing about it, because you don't say, but I find what they did to Uhura in "The Changeling" pretty embarrassing myself, specifically the tortuous reading scene with Chapel forcing her to speak English that's capped by "blue-y".
I could say that any episode with Rand's wig is embarrassing, because that wig was a monstrosity. "Miri" has to make my list of embarrassments for other reasons: Rand's look-at-my-legs line and the classic Kirk line, "No blah blah blah!" On the other hand, that Kirk line is a classic, but I think only because it's so bad.
There are others....
But anyway, getting back to "Tribbles", I agree that it's overrated. I don't find much in it funny any more, but I may have just seen it too many times. The barroom fight, starting with the exchange that sets it off, is still funny to me. I guess Kirk buried almost to his chest in the tribble pile is funny enough, too.
Re: "The Trouble With Tribbles" is the most overrated episode of TOS..
Maybe I shouldn't have mentioned in this thread, but The Changling is my vote for I wish that episode never happened.
That's a very close second, very close.
I would enjoy at length discussion, but in a quick answer:
1. It's shots have the power of 90 torpedoes, Enterprise doesn't even flinch for 2 hits.
2. They shoot it with one torpedo and Kirk acts like it's the most unbelievable thing he's ever heard.
3. It kills Scotty, and then revives him after Bones can't do anything.
4. The whole Uhura thing as mentioned, with the line, "It's a conflicting mass of emotions." "That's a woman."
(I realize that's not exact quotes.)
5. Even though Kirk talked/reasoned 4 separate computers to "death" this one just seems too pat. They telegraphed it with the Roykirk name too much, although that's the least of these problems.
While I did think it was funny about Kirk saying my son the doctor at the end, it seemed a bit too silly after all of the billions it killed, but that one can be said about a few episodes.
Maybe I shouldn't have mentioned in this thread, but The Changling is my vote for I wish that episode never happened.
That's a very close second, very close.
I would enjoy at length discussion, but in a quick answer:
1. It's shots have the power of 90 torpedoes, Enterprise doesn't even flinch for 2 hits.
2. They shoot it with one torpedo and Kirk acts like it's the most unbelievable thing he's ever heard.
3. It kills Scotty, and then revives him after Bones can't do anything.
4. The whole Uhura thing as mentioned, with the line, "It's a conflicting mass of emotions." "That's a woman."
(I realize that's not exact quotes.)5. Even though Kirk talked/reasoned 4 separate computers to "death" this one just seems too pat. They telegraphed it with the Roykirk name too much, although that's the least of these problems.
While I did think it was funny about Kirk saying my son the doctor at the end, it seemed a bit too silly after all of the billions it killed, but that one can be said about a few episodes.
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Re: "The Trouble With Tribbles" is the most overrated episode of TOS..
If you read David Gerrold's writings from the '70s you can see that this is his take on Star Trek and one Gene Coon liked. But you can also see that it diverges from Roddenberry's take and that of DC Fontana and Robert Justman. "Shoreleave" from Season 1 is more the kind of humour that Roddenberry, Fontana and Justman found appealing. In that the humour is contextual rather than outright situational. If the Klingon menace had felt somewhat edgier than what we got in TTWT then I think the humour would have balanced out better. Having someone other than William Campbell's portrayal of Koloth could have helped, too.
"The Trouble With Tribbles" is an amusing episode, but not a truly funny one. It has some nice moments, but again it's not hilarious. I do prefer it over the embarrassment of "I, Mudd."
If you read David Gerrold's writings from the '70s you can see that this is his take on Star Trek and one Gene Coon liked. But you can also see that it diverges from Roddenberry's take and that of DC Fontana and Robert Justman. "Shoreleave" from Season 1 is more the kind of humour that Roddenberry, Fontana and Justman found appealing. In that the humour is contextual rather than outright situational. If the Klingon menace had felt somewhat edgier than what we got in TTWT then I think the humour would have balanced out better. Having someone other than William Campbell's portrayal of Koloth could have helped, too.
Re: "The Trouble With Tribbles" is the most overrated episode of TOS..
Did anyone read that William Campbell was going to be optioned to be Koloth in up to 13 episodes?
I think that colors his performance, he was going to be an adversary but not an out and out "enemy" like Kang or Kor. As if either of those would have killed Kirk given the chance, Koloth may have just lorded his victory over him and left him alive. But maybe I'm reaching too much.
Did anyone read that William Campbell was going to be optioned to be Koloth in up to 13 episodes?
I think that colors his performance, he was going to be an adversary but not an out and out "enemy" like Kang or Kor. As if either of those would have killed Kirk given the chance, Koloth may have just lorded his victory over him and left him alive. But maybe I'm reaching too much.
Re: "The Trouble With Tribbles" is the most overrated episode of TOS..
From what I understand the idea of Koloth being a recurring villain was floated and Gene Coon liked the idea, but Roddenberry wasn't for it. Apparently his reasoning was in a vast galaxy where the Enterprise was crossing fantastic distances it beggared belief that Kirk could keep running into the same adversary over and over again.
This also ties into why TOS wasn't one to revisit places and characters it had encountered before (save semi-recurring crew characters aboard ship). The idea was the Enterprise was going forward, not backwards.
And with this in mind this was one of the things I didn't care for in TNG because I felt it was counter to the idea of the starship going into new territory. It's also something I'm not really keen on seeing in licensed Trek novels, comics and fan productions because it's something we likely wouldn't have seen TOS do, until TAS that is.
I quite like Star Trek Continues, but in three rather good episodes so far they've done two revisits we likely never would have seen on TOS. That said I do think they were generally well done, but I do hope they don't over indulge in the practice.
From what I understand the idea of Koloth being a recurring villain was floated and Gene Coon liked the idea, but Roddenberry wasn't for it. Apparently his reasoning was in a vast galaxy where the Enterprise was crossing fantastic distances it beggared belief that Kirk could keep running into the same adversary over and over again.
This also ties into why TOS wasn't one to revisit places and characters it had encountered before (save semi-recurring crew characters aboard ship). The idea was the Enterprise was going forward, not backwards.
And with this in mind this was one of the things I didn't care for in TNG because I felt it was counter to the idea of the starship going into new territory. It's also something I'm not really keen on seeing in licensed Trek novels, comics and fan productions because it's something we likely wouldn't have seen TOS do, until TAS that is.
I quite like Star Trek Continues, but in three rather good episodes so far they've done two revisits we likely never would have seen on TOS. That said I do think they were generally well done, but I do hope they don't over indulge in the practice.
Re: "The Trouble With Tribbles" is the most overrated episode of TOS..
I loved this episode when I was a teenager, for three reasons:
Scotty. Klingons. Bar Fight.
Uhura and Chekov also get some well deserved attention in this episode, and I loved when Spock is caught petting a Tribble, "fortunately I am immune to its effect.."
Though Stanley Adams as Cyrano Jones is great, this really should have been the episode where Harry Mudd returns, instead of the dreadful I, Mudd.
I loved this episode when I was a teenager, for three reasons:
Scotty. Klingons. Bar Fight.
Uhura and Chekov also get some well deserved attention in this episode, and I loved when Spock is caught petting a Tribble, "fortunately I am immune to its effect.."
Though Stanley Adams as Cyrano Jones is great, this really should have been the episode where Harry Mudd returns, instead of the dreadful I, Mudd.
Re: "The Trouble With Tribbles" is the most overrated episode of TOS..
In TTWT, they actually cast Patty Duke's TV father (William Schallert) as the Administrator...now THAT is comedic!...
...I never took TTWT too seriously, and I remember finding it very funny at the time...in the scheme of things, IMHO, it is not the best OR the worst...
...funny, years later now, as part of my Hallmark collection of ST and SW ornaments, is included a TWT creation, consisting of Kirk in a clear plastic chamber that recreates then the tribbles tumbling down on him when he opens the grain hatch...there is a push-button bladder that allows you to blow the tribbles around...it is the I dumbest and coolest thing ever!...
In TTWT, they actually cast Patty Duke's TV father (William Schallert) as the Administrator...now THAT is comedic!...
...I never took TTWT too seriously, and I remember finding it very funny at the time...in the scheme of things, IMHO, it is not the best OR the worst...
...funny, years later now, as part of my Hallmark collection of ST and SW ornaments, is included a TWT creation, consisting of Kirk in a clear plastic chamber that recreates then the tribbles tumbling down on him when he opens the grain hatch...there is a push-button bladder that allows you to blow the tribbles around...it is the I dumbest and coolest thing ever!...
Re: "The Trouble With Tribbles" is the most overrated episode of TOS..
Whether or not it's overrated, I can well appreciate having seen the show too many times. The many years of watching Trek have made me feel the series is overrated by die hards. It's a fun show which I enjoy much more than the later TV incarnations as none of the other series had the Trinity. But the 60's had plenty of other shows that I can enjoy just as much, if not more, since I don't have them so ingrained that a half second in the whole episode has replayed in my head.
Re: "The Trouble With Tribbles" is the most overrated episode of TOS..
This. I hate the placement of the episode so high on "best of" lists; I hate its prominence.
I don't really hate the episode itself. Heck, I've always loved the scene after the bar fight, where Kirk gets to the bottom of how it started. But I hate something that it spawned: this persistent idea in a big segment of nerdy, smirky fandom; that the "soul of Star Trek" is its humor, exemplified in this episode. I disagree completely. The "soul of Star Trek" is tragedy; or sober optimism & adaptability in the face of tragedy. This comes right from the pilots: Vina has to stay on Talos IV forever, Kirk has to kill Gary Mitchell. So when Tribbles appears high on lists, it reflects people valuing other aspects of Trek, that what seems most important to me.
Tribbles marked the decline of TOS. All of the best episodes were before Tribbles; the worst (except for Alternative Factor) were after. Before Tribbles, most of the episodes were good; after, there were more bad than good.
So I resent the episode a little bit. That's not really its fault, I guess: the ep itself is not bad, certainly has its moments. But it always bothers me to see it rated so highly.
This. I hate the placement of the episode so high on "best of" lists; I hate its prominence.
I don't really hate the episode itself. Heck, I've always loved the scene after the bar fight, where Kirk gets to the bottom of how it started. But I hate something that it spawned: this persistent idea in a big segment of nerdy, smirky fandom; that the "soul of Star Trek" is its humor, exemplified in this episode. I disagree completely. The "soul of Star Trek" is tragedy; or sober optimism & adaptability in the face of tragedy. This comes right from the pilots: Vina has to stay on Talos IV forever, Kirk has to kill Gary Mitchell. So when Tribbles appears high on lists, it reflects people valuing other aspects of Trek, that what seems most important to me.
Tribbles marked the decline of TOS. All of the best episodes were before Tribbles; the worst (except for Alternative Factor) were after. Before Tribbles, most of the episodes were good; after, there were more bad than good.
So I resent the episode a little bit. That's not really its fault, I guess: the ep itself is not bad, certainly has its moments. But it always bothers me to see it rated so highly.
Re: "The Trouble With Tribbles" is the most overrated episode of TOS..
If you look at it in production order, "Journey to Babel", "Obsession", "Return to Tomorrow" and "The Ultimate Computer" all were made after "Trouble..."
I actually find quite a bit to like about season two after "Trouble..." Then with season three, you had different people running the show.
If you look at it in production order, "Journey to Babel", "Obsession", "Return to Tomorrow" and "The Ultimate Computer" all were made after "Trouble..."
I actually find quite a bit to like about season two after "Trouble..." Then with season three, you had different people running the show.
Re: "The Trouble With Tribbles" is the most overrated episode of TOS..
And yet it was okay to keep running into parallel Earths. Such reasoning.
And yet it was okay to keep running into parallel Earths. Such reasoning.
Re: "The Trouble With Tribbles" is the most overrated episode of TOS..
But there was an actual reason for that: to make the series more affordable. I'm not sure Star Trek would've ever made it to air without them.
But there was an actual reason for that: to make the series more affordable. I'm not sure Star Trek would've ever made it to air without them.
Re: "The Trouble With Tribbles" is the most overrated episode of TOS..
Except it's a mixed bag, right? A capital ship like the Enterprise had a lot of duties. Often they were doing deep exploration, going where no mad had gone before. But just as often they were running medical supplies to beleaguered planets, checking on colonies that had fallen out of contact, touching base with scientists on research outposts, etc.
They spent a lot of time in Federation space; not always in remote unexplored space.
Except it's a mixed bag, right? A capital ship like the Enterprise had a lot of duties. Often they were doing deep exploration, going where no mad had gone before. But just as often they were running medical supplies to beleaguered planets, checking on colonies that had fallen out of contact, touching base with scientists on research outposts, etc.
They spent a lot of time in Federation space; not always in remote unexplored space.
Re: "The Trouble With Tribbles" is the most overrated episode of TOS..
The only ones of those that I like are Obsession and Computer. (Return to Tomorrow is terrible.)
Anyway, even if all 4 were good, that wouldn't be inconsistent with there being more bad episodes than good after Tribbles.
The only ones of those that I like are Obsession and Computer. (Return to Tomorrow is terrible.)
Anyway, even if all 4 were good, that wouldn't be inconsistent with there being more bad episodes than good after Tribbles.
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