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The Prime Minister in "Terror of the Zygons"

Count Zero

No nation but procrastination
Moderator
So, in that 1975 serial, the Prime Minister is a woman but we don't learn her name and don't get to see her. Who was it? Is there anything known about who the writer envivioned it to be and why they made this step away from the reality of the day? (Yeah, I know, there was also a very successful space program with a trip to Mars shown earlier in the 70s but you know what I mean.)
 
Thatcher was already a big muckety muck during the 1970s, so it might not seem so speculative and "out there" given her role as oppositon leader during Callaghan's time as Prime Minister.
 
I wonder if that's supposed to mean that the story is set in the future from the audience's point of view. From the Brig's reactions and answers during the phone call, it could very well be Thatcher. ;)
 
From what I understand, different episodes from the UNIT era seem to have been written with differing assumptions as to when those episodes took place relative to the audience's "present-day." But I think the idea was that by alluding to a female Prime Minister, that particular serial was supposed to be seen as taking place in the near future.

Personally, I just say wibbly-wobbly-timey-whimey and let it all be. :)

ETA:

To digress just a little bit...

One of the things I thought was hysterical about RTD-era Doctor Who was that, every season, they'd manage to kill or overthrow the Prime Minister or surrogate. The Slitheen killed Tony Blair in Series One; the Doctor overthrew Harriet Jones in "The Christmas Invasion" and the Cybermen killed the President of the People's Republic of Great Britain in the alternate universe in "Rise of the Cybermen;" the Master was elected Prime Minister, assassinated his entire Cabinet, and then was killed by Lucy in "Last of the Time Lords." And the Daleks killed Harriet Jones and shot down the sitting Prime Minister's plane in "The Stolen Earth."

And then, during the specials year, Prime Minister Brian Green was forced to resign at the end of Children of Earth while the Master took over President Obama's (and, presumably, Green's successor's) body in "The End of Time, Part One."

It was just such a great running gag, and I'm kind of sad no Prime Ministers or substitutes were harmed during Series Five. ;)
 
I wonder if that's supposed to mean that the story is set in the future from the audience's point of view. From the Brig's reactions and answers during the phone call, it could very well be Thatcher. ;)

I recall her being named as "Mrs Williams" but I think that might have been in a novel rather than on screen.

Oh and I gather from the Memoir/biography that Nicholas Courtney did for the Big Finish, he wasn't particular rapt in Thatcher.
 
In response to Sci:

Well, there are some obvious discrepancies between the Whoniverse and the real world in earlier UNIT stories, e.g. the space program I mentioned above, and they never really mention a date, but on the other hand, apart from what is needed for the particular story to work there's never a hint at it being set in the future, as far as technology, fashion and the general setting are concerned.
Oh well, I don't want to overthink this. I hust thought that maybe there's some background story to it. I couldn't find anything on the TARDIS wiki and thought people here might have some info.
 
While I typed my post, other posts were squeezed in and expanded upon, so sorry for the double posting.

I recall her being named as "Mrs Williams" but I think that might have been in a novel rather than on screen.

Must have been in the book, then. There's a novelisation of the serial, of course.


Oh and I gather from the Memoir/biography that Nicholas Courtney did for the Big Finish, he wasn't particular rapt in Thatcher.

Well, who was? :lol: It is sort of funny to think of this unnamed PM as Thatcher, given the later history of the writers and producers with her, i.e. the rather candid criticism of her policies in the McCoy years.
 
While I typed my post, other posts were squeezed in and expanded upon, so sorry for the double posting.

I recall her being named as "Mrs Williams" but I think that might have been in a novel rather than on screen.

Must have been in the book, then. There's a novelisation of the serial, of course.

Sorry I didn't mean directly in the Terror of the Zygons but in another Doctor Who story.
 
According to Lance Parkin's Ahistory, this was established in Paul Cornell's No Future, and reiterated in Lawrence Miles's Interference.
 
Yes No Future had Shirley Williams as PM of a Labour government whose cabinet included Tony Benn.
 
Yes No Future had Shirley Williams as PM of a Labour government whose cabinet included Tony Benn.

That derives from "Jeremy" being PM in the Green Death - a reference to Liberal MP Jeremy Thorpe. Shirley Williams was one of the Gang Of Four who quite Labour to found the SDP in 1981, which then merged with the Liberals to form the Lib Dems round about 1987...

But that's not who's intended in Zygons, cos there was no connection between Thorpe and Williams in 1975!

The production team definitely intended it as a reference to Thatcher, who had just become Leader of the Opposition, and Tom Baker confirms this on the Tom Baker Years video.
 
I had totally forgoten about the Prime Minister in The Green Death. Maybe he had to step down for his involvement in this affair and that's how Thatcher got into power early? No wonder Yates thought there was no point in saving the current crop of humanity later on. :p
 
I had totally forgoten about the Prime Minister in The Green Death. Maybe he had to step down for his involvement in this affair and that's how Thatcher got into power early? No wonder Yates thought there was no point in saving the current crop of humanity later on. :p

I've mentioned it already in the About Time Books thread, but it bears repeating here:

ABOUT TIME 3 has an excellent essay called "Who's Running the Country?" and in it, author Tat Wood gives we yanks the backstory to Britain's woes during the 1970s; the actions of Wilson, Heath, and Callaghan are all recalled as well as "kingmaker" Jermy Thorpe--the PM is named "Jeremy" in the Pertwee story, "The Green Death"-- as well as the botched assassination(!) of one of Thorpe's ex-lovers. Anyway, this apparently ties in with how government was represented on Dr Who. However, the real-life happenings are infinitely more interesting--and insane.
 
Thanks for the info. The About Time books sound very interesting. I might get the one about the Pertwee era sometime.
 
Thanks for the info. The About Time books sound very interesting. I might get the one about the Pertwee era sometime.

You're welcome. Thanks for starting a classic Dr Who topic! Seems like the board's been swarmed to excess with chatter about the current series.
 
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