Of course, in the book, having made the choice of Luthien, Arwen chooses to die at Cerin Amroth in the year 121 of the Fourth Age, one year after Aragorn dies.
The missing link between middle earth and known history
- Thread starter Unimatrix Q
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they died out. Middle earth is supposed to be a fictional prehistoric europe, but take whatever interpretation suits you.
Morgoth "burnt it down" by toppling the great lamps at both ends of Middle Earth. The planet was 'remade' in a new form that was easier to let spin on it's own.
So yeah it's really not Earth.
Except that the Red Book of Westmarch is then difficult to explain away.
If LOTR were our past is there any canonical explanation for how magic ceased to exist? Is the fading of magic a consequence of destroying the ring?
Also if LOTR were our past shouldn't everyone be black?
Also if LOTR were our past shouldn't everyone be black?
Except that the Red Book of Westmarch is then difficult to explain away.
A Wizard did it. Prove me wrong.
Wasn't there also a mention that Hobbits are still around, just really rare and they actively avoid the noisy, stupid humans? I always assumed that was meant to be a reference to the various "little people" of European folklore like gnomes, fairies, pixies, brownies etc.
I think JirinPanthosa's second question pertains to the fact that if LOTR was sufficiently far back in the past, there would be no ethnic diversity and everyone should be black. However, from what others have said in this thread, the Middle Earth sagas are set close enough to our own era that there are white and other people in Europe.
The Silmarillion covers the creation myth - it's relationship to the 'reality' of Middle Earth than the Bible does to real reality...
Not really, we're being told what happened in the early days of their universe. The lore is supported by the fact the eldest of Elves remember these things as having happened and signs of the events still etched in Middle Earth.
The stumps of the great lamps are meant to be there as cracked mountain ranges, the gods and Valar may have ironed out the wrinkles from Morgoths wrath, but not entirely fixed it.
Religions still claim physical evidence for their myths. The Silmarillion is only different from the Bible in that there are beings that remember that far back. Which is, admittedly a pretty big difference.
I can only assume that JRR intended the 'in world' explanation to be that his 'history' was simply an alternative to the Christian, old English and Norse myths that are the background to British storytelling. We are being asked to (at least for the sake of the narrative) accept it as our true history.
The point it that the Silmarillion is an external observation of what "happened" told to the reader, it doesn't exist as something inside the LOTR universe, it's for our benefit only. The Bible exists within our universe as a series of mythological tales put together by one culture that don't tell a real story to being with.
The only real way it could be similar is if a godlike race watched our universe and wrote a scientific journal charting it's progress from the Big Bang and published it in their universe, that we never got to see.
The only real way it could be similar is if a godlike race watched our universe and wrote a scientific journal charting it's progress from the Big Bang and published it in their universe, that we never got to see.
I wonder if Sauron is re-forming, even in a very reduced form post ring destruction...
IIRC he can never be tangible again as the part of him that was destroyed with the ring can never been reformed. He is instead doomed to drift, aimless and powerless until the end of time.
Melkor could make a comeback though and he was always a much more substantial threat the Sauron ever was.
Melkor could make a comeback though and he was always a much more substantial threat the Sauron ever was.
There's a school of thought in Tolkien fandom that by melting the Ring in the lava of Mount Doom that Sauron's evil "infected" the magma and became present throughout the Earth. The power of the Ring would be so diffuse that he couldn't reform, but his evil would have been everywhere.
The Devil made me do it.....
Wait? Is that Homeopathic Sauron?
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