The Klingons

[johnnybear]

Could be one reason why they hated him so much I guess?
JB

 

[UnknownSample]

samurai biker vikings

Egad, I embrace that characterization. Well done. But, maybe Samurai Biker Pirates?! When I heard Frakes say that Klingons are really basically just pirates, I hit forehead as if desirous of V8 (nearly making self a Klingon via blunt force trauma, luckily I'm puny), and wondered why I'd never thought of that...

 

[UnknownSample]

Of course, it's always better to have these inconsistencies tidied up. Here's the problem with Enterprise, though-- it wasn't that their Klingon explanation was so bad, but that supposed "Star Trek" (Enterprise) only had going for it these attempts at fixing continuity. The whole four seasons consisted of dull, uninspired writing. They didn't have anything to say. Filling air time with barely watchable stuff that managed to qualify as Star Trek seemed to be their only mission.

I'd love to think of Manny Coto as a sort of savior, but his being a fan, a believer in Trek more than Berman/Braga, didn't help. His heart may have been in the right place, but instead of focusing on finding vital human stories or SF ideas, it was instead just sort of: "There, filled in that continuity gap!"

 

[Kor]

Yes, while I thought ENT S4 was more enjoyable than the rest of the series, I also thought there wasn't much substance beyond all the self-referential fanboyism.

Kor

 

[Lieut. Arex]

Or have a two parter in TNG where both appear, simply have a socio-political problem within the Empire where they forced the older Klingons into submission after TOS in some internal coup. It would have added the diversity to Klingons and more than the singular honour driven modern versions.

using both would have been the optimum choice in my opinion just have one of the original ones mixed in with the Imperials , the show wouldn't have had to go into the weeds and explain the whats and wherefores as the Human-fusion/augment) flavored Kilingons are seen as being more devious let Duras be one of them

 

[Lance]

I'm of the view that the changes didn't need an explanation. I was blissfully happy to just accept that the TMP-onwards Klingon makeups were what they 'really' looked like all along. And it wasn't until the DS9 Tribble episode that it was even raised as a in-universe 'thing' (for example, the three TOS Klingons who reappear in DS9 are all seen with the new makeup without explanation, and frankly I don't think any explaination was necessary.)

Even with forehead ridges, it's not like the post-79 Klingons looks that radically different to the 60s ones. Not in ways that can't be explained away by us simply assuming we're seeing more detail. Their uniforms for example are plausibly the same, battle armor, even though they obviously look different in other ways.

It's like the TOS aesthetic in general. It's my view that the movies were generally trying to present a 'more plausible' version of the look, not that the look itself was necessarily meant to be different. It wasn't until later spin-offs that the TOS aesthetic became an actual historical part of the Trek universe as we know it.

 

[C57D]

Egad, I embrace that characterization. Well done. But, maybe Samurai Biker Pirates?! When I heard Frakes say that Klingons are really basically just pirates, I hit forehead as if desirous of V8 (nearly making self a Klingon via blunt force trauma, luckily I'm puny), and wondered why I'd never thought of that...

Yeah maybe you are right -Vikings at least had a societal reason for their raiding, while for pirates it was pure greed and a dose of "wronging those who have wronged me".

TNG onwards Klingons seem juvenile compared to John M Fords version. So busy worrying about being "dissed" and showing everyone how much of "a big man" they are, it's a wonder they found the time or the intelligence to run a star empire.

Ford's had a multilayered culture, society and psychology, a far more interesting tool for storytelling than the childish idiots we ended up with.

Truly a missed opportunity IMHO.

 

[C57D]

As an addendum to my post above.

Maybe we have got it wrong all these years.

Maybe Ford's Klingons are the real original ones! Sneaky, Machiavellian, manipulative, driven to achieve and totally in control of the Komerex Klingon.

And USING the juvenile brainless "Biker Vikings" as mere figureheads, but letting them think that they run the show.

Allow the idiots to fight and pout and make themselves look big and important, while the true people of Klin (spirit) get on with the real job of running an empire!

 

[Marsden]

Well, Vikings was a culture and Pirates are not, but I've heard of Vikings referred to as "pirates" in historical texts, so there's some overlap there, the analogies work.

I think it's the "die in battle" turned up to 11 that makes someone think of Vikings, although I doubt the real people that have been labeled that wanted to die so much.

How could the Klingons win any wars when they are so busy dying in battle. They should be more concerned about making some other poor bastard die in battle.

 

[johnnybear]

Forget the head ridges! Why did they have to change their glittery pants for a Conquistador style costume as well?
JB

 

[UnknownSample]

I wasn't being so serious about it. The general image they project is very pirate-y.

 

[Kor]

IIRC, for a while there was an idea that Klingon ships were run more like privateer vessels. I can't remember if that came from the early novels, or what.

Kor

 

[Warped9]

IIRC, for a while there was an idea that Klingon ships were run more like privateer vessels. I can't remember if that came from the early novels, or what.

Kor

It was mentioned in The Making Of Star Trek that Klingon ships were often run like privateers.