The Klingon Imperial Empire

Discussion in 'Star Trek: The Next Generation' started by Amaraen, Nov 23, 2015.

  1. Amaraen

    Amaraen Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Am I the only one who winces when Captain Picard says this? (Sorry just saw this episode recently)
     
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  2. Kilana2

    Kilana2 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Someone has mentioned this recently somewhere else.

    We need a monitor for non-sequiturs.
     
  3. Paradise City

    Paradise City Commodore Commodore

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    Nah, this is just JLP giving credit were credit is due.

    Some "Empires" don't put any effort into being "Empires". They are kind of ho-hum, meh, boring "empires". They are "empires" with a distinctly SMALL 'e'.

    What I personally call "No-effort-empires".

    By calling the Klingon Empire, the Klingon Imperial Empire - JPL is commending the Klingon Empire for being a full-on Empire as opposed to the lazy, little dippy, knock-off empires that litter the galaxy and who frankly should be prosecuted under the federation false advertising act.

    So instead of grimacing or wincing or blowing up in abject rage we should gently nod with approval that the writers have included for Picard a keen palette in respect as to what truly passes for a genuine bona fide Empire and what are, frankly, cheap imitation "empires".
     
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  4. Kor

    Kor Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    This is the only time in any Trek episode or movie when the term "imperial empire" was used. Perhaps Picard had taken a lot of coursework at Starfleet Academy's Department of Redundancies Department. Seriously, there is no other kind of empire besides the "imperial" kind.

    I've read fan speculation that because of the many competing Klingon factions, Gowron's faction had clearly labeled itself as the "Imperial Empire" as a mark of authenticity and legitimacy.

    In Earth's history, there have been examples of countries that called themselves "empires" but were really nothing of the sort. Nobody gave themselves the formal name of "Imperial Empire" to set themselves apart, though.

    I doubt the writers of the episode were giving it that much thought. It strikes me as a brain fart that nobody bothered to point out throughout the whole production process, for whatever reason.

    Kor
     
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  5. The Old Mixer

    The Old Mixer Mih ssim, mih ssim, nam, daed si Xim. Moderator

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    No, you are not.

    When the Enterprise left, did Picard order a course set for the Federated Federation of Planetary Planets?
     
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  6. Maxwell Everett

    Maxwell Everett Commodore Commodore

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    I think what Ronald D. Moore may have had in mind here by adding the seemingly redundant word "Imperial" to Klingon Empire was a nod to what the Japanese called their empire: Dai Nippon Teikoku, literally Greater Japanese Empire.

    There was an infamous Japanese WWII film released in 1982 with that exact title (Dai Nippon Teikoku) which was a defense of Japanese Imperialism. The U.S. title was translated as The Imperial Japanese Empire. It's just a guess on my part, but it's certainly within the realm of possibility that Moore thought of this film (or the translation) while writing the teleplay for "Sins of the Father."

    That specific translation of Dai Nippon Teikoku also appears in the subtitle of the book Downfall: The End of the Imperial Japanese Empire by Richard Frank.

    [​IMG]
     
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  7. Tosk

    Tosk Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I wince a little too, but it's not much worse than United Federation of Planets.
     
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  8. T'Girl

    T'Girl Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Why have both United AND Federation?
     
  9. velour

    velour Commander Red Shirt

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    The only reason that I might wince is because of Picard's odd sounding word order. I wonder why he didn't say "Imperial Klingon Empire". It seems more natural sounding to put the word imperial before the nationality, like Imperial Japanese Empire.
     
  10. Kor

    Kor Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    ...which is an expression used nowhere else by anybody, ever, except for Richard Frank's book and in the English title of the awful movie mentioned above.

    Kor
     
  11. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I think we can clear this all up. Gowron had ordered new stationary for the Empire, but some typist put in "Klingon Imperial Empire" and Gowron couldn't afford to redo it. So, we he sent out letters, that was the stationary.

    This never would have happened if the Klingons hadn't killed all the proofreader readers.
     
  12. Amaraen

    Amaraen Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    It was "Sins of the Father", where K'mpec was the chancellor.

    "Imperial Klingon Empire" would have made slightly more sense, as there the adjective "imperial" is being used for the subject "Klingon". But as it is, the adjective is for "empire", but I guess it would be similar to "The Royal Kingdom"?
     
  13. Maurice

    Maurice FACT TREKKING across the universe... Premium Member

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    The Jet Propulsion Laboratory? ;)
     
  14. Tim Thomason

    Tim Thomason Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    They're overcompensating for the fact that the Klingon (Imperial) Empire has no emperor.
     
  15. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Another question occurs to me: Is there a Klingon Metric Empire?

    Also, in more serious tone, I was researching some old tech style manuals, and a lot of the Klingon uniforms had titles like "Klingon Imperial Fleet uniform. Not sure if that influenced the line or not but I found it interesting. Besides that, I can't think of a single time Klingons had "Imperial" attached as a descriptor.
     
  16. jimbotron

    jimbotron Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Not nearly as bad as Imperious Leader. :lol:
     
  17. section31agent

    section31agent Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    Just so we can call her the USS Enterprise lol. Guess they didnt like the sound of the FSS Enterprise

    I think they should've called themselves the Alliance of Planets. Then every Stafleet vessel would start with the prefix ASS
     
  18. JirinPanthosa

    JirinPanthosa Admiral Admiral

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    In the real world, the more synonyms for 'democratic' you have in your country's official name, the more a dictatorship it is.
     
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  19. Kor

    Kor Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    "The Klingon Kingly Kingdom" has an interesting ring to it.

    Kor
     
  20. Maurice

    Maurice FACT TREKKING across the universe... Premium Member

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    United Federated Republic of Democratic Free Sovereign Planets