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The Jellyfish under construction shot

F. King Daniel

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This shot of the Jellyfish under construction on Vulcan is absolutely amazing. So much effort has been spent on something seen for all of two seconds in the movie. It's a work of art. I love it. It's now my desktop wallpaper:techman:.

How many Vulcans can you spot? I see three.

Two on the platforms on the lower right, and one in the gap at the centre of the Jellyfish's tailfin.
 
This shot of the Jellyfish under construction on Vulcan is absolutely amazing. So much effort has been spent on something seen for all of two seconds in the movie. It's a work of art. I love it. It's now my desktop wallpaper:techman:.

How many Vulcans can you spot? I see three.

Two on the platforms on the lower right, and one in the gap at the centre of the Jellyfish's tailfin.


Just rewatched again this weekend. How is the Jellyfish the Vulcans' fastest ship if they have to build it first?
 
There's a small amount of question as to how linear Spock's mindmeld with Kirk was. The Jellyfish could have been constructed months (or years) prior to the emergency, then chosen to transport the red matter because of it's speed and ability to deploy the red matter.
 
Exactly. The montage makes very limited sense if interpreted linearly - the construction scene would be very ill-thought eye candy in that interpretation. But we can be magnanimous and choose a different interpretation, which also helps us understand what actually happened and to which star and how creating a single black hole might contain the mess...

Timo Saloniemi
 
Just rewatched again this weekend. How is the Jellyfish the Vulcans' fastest ship if they have to build it first?

"Outfitting" does not necessarily imply construction. I think in this case it meant reconfiguring for a particular purpose. So the Jellyfish was an existing ship.

Exactly. The montage makes very limited sense if interpreted linearly - the construction scene would be very ill-thought eye candy in that interpretation. But we can be magnanimous and choose a different interpretation, which also helps us understand what actually happened and to which star and how creating a single black hole might contain the mess...

I don't follow that. Telling a time travel story out of order is questionable anyway, but as far as I could see the mind meld looked linear. I'm not sure how it would make much more sense in a different order? Parts of it certainly were linear and much of what is said implies the supernova had already exploded when various actions were taken. E.g. The star was "exploding" when red matter was mentioned as a solution. Why would they mix the rest up?

By the way, how do you get close enough to a supernova to throw something into it? This is a very strange star.
 
It's possible they had to take the Jellyfish apart and rebuild it around the Red Matter storage. Or that they had a prototype ship almost ready thay just happened to fit the bill for this mission. I'd guess the latter.

The "Art of" book and the tie-ins all say it's a prototype designed to withstand extreme temperatures. The art book postulates that the skin of the ship may have been "grown" over the framework.
 
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^^But the idea of the star already having exploded when Spock launches the rescue mission is an objectionable one: there should be no unpredictable elements remaining, then, and the fate of Romulus should already be sealed at the moment Spock takes off from Vulcan. He knows the speed of the expanding destruction, he knows the top speed of his ship, and if that doesn't allow him to save Romulus, why even bother launching?

If Spock only knows a star is about to explode, then there's an element of uncertainty there, and the mission is worth launching. Also, that way the star can be the homestar of Romulus, which is physically plausible (no FTL waves that mysteriously slow to STL to hit the planet) and depicts a more containable phenomenon.

By the way, how do you get close enough to a supernova to throw something into it?
"It" ought to be a fairly thin shell, through which any starship could punch in a matter of milliseconds. If the solution is to create a black hole in the center of the shell, then Spock could do it to a supernova centered on the Romulan homestar by flying to the Romulan home system.

If the solution is to drop red matter at some random fringe of the phenomenon, though... Then why would Spock pick the Romulan home system for that random fringe? Wouldn't some other fringe be closer in all probability?

This is a very strange star.
It could be a perfectly ordinary star - the strange part is how a black hole can negate or reverse the effects of it going supernova. Or perhaps red matter has some other effects besides/instead of creating black holes?

Incidentally, why is the ship vertical in that image? Wouldn't it be significantly easier to build/modify it when it lays horizontal? Fewer gantries and scaffoldings needed, smaller cranes and a smaller facility overall should suffice, and things should be generally more easily reachable.

Timo Saloniemi
 
Yes Timo, the film and it's writers and it's directors and it's producers are all wrong. Only you know what really happened in 2387:rolleyes:.

Seriously, how did you ever cope with Star Trek before now? The Praxis explosion that affected the Excelsior (and seemingly only the Excelsior) in Federation space? What about the other planets that must have been hit? That shockwave looked slower-than-light too - heck, that was virtually two dimensional! WTF didn't Sulu fly under it? Because it's a MOVIE.
 
Sure it is. But most movies out there are pretty poorly written, in terms of their attempt to portray something realistically or believably. The audience usually has to work pretty hard to get past that, and scifi is more or less the worst of the lot. Doesn't mean the films wouldn't be enjoyable nevertheless.

STXI was written incoherently enough, but it's worth the effort of trying to watch through it. For some, it involves trying to pretend it makes sense. Not for all, of course. As written, it doesn't - as viewed, it might.

Timo Saloniemi
 
This shot of the Jellyfish under construction on Vulcan is absolutely amazing. So much effort has been spent on something seen for all of two seconds in the movie. It's a work of art. I love it. It's now my desktop wallpaper:techman:.

How many Vulcans can you spot? I see three.

Two on the platforms on the lower right, and one in the gap at the centre of the Jellyfish's tailfin.

IMO, the only Vulcan worth counting in that scene (including interior shots) is Jeff Quinn :drool: - even though he is only seen from behind
 
Spock takes off from Vulcan. He knows the speed of the expanding destruction, he knows the top speed of his ship, and if that doesn't allow him to save Romulus, why even bother launching?
And can we briefly return to Nero and what he knows, he has this massive ship, both the Narada and presumable the surface of Romulus have transporters, stuffed in like cord wood, Nero could have removed many tens of thousand of Romulans (INCLUDING HIS FUKKING WIFE) from the doomed world, is there any, and I mean any, reason that you can come up with that he didn't?

If Nero knew enough to know that Spock was coming, was heading toward the location of the supernova, then why wasn't he orbiting Romulus for days and weeks extracting people, instead of hanging in space waiting on Spock?

It's call a plot hole.

I'm not talking about a special effect during TUC and why Sulu didn't fly over said special effect. Special effects, while mildly interesting, aren't truly integral to the plot of a movie.

Nero angst over losing his wife was an large integral portion of the movies plot, given that he again possessed a ship, seemingly in the general area of the planet she was on, and apparently made not the slightest effort to preserve her life drags the movie down.
 
As a still, it totally looks like a [pretty] matte painting. Most CGI does though, I guess.
 
Merry Christmas said:
is there any, I mean any, reason you can come up with that he didn't?
Nero obviously wasn't in the Romulan system at the time of the disaster - if he was he would have been destroyed. He says while torturing Pike that he "was out doing [his] job" when Spock "betrayed" them. Considering Trek moves at the speed of plot, he could have been too far away, mining some dumpy corner of Romulan space, to make it back in time. He could have been racing to save her, and arrived too late. It could have been anything.

Romulus itself was clearly as prepared for this as Earth is every time it comes inder threat.

I'm not talking about a special effect during TUC
I'm afraid that's much mord than a special effect. The Praxis shockwave damaged Kronos' atmosphere and damaged the USS Excelsior. Unless the Excelsior was in the Klingon solar system at the time, which it wasn't, you need to wonder about all the worlds between it and Praxis. Yet was anyone else affected at all?
 
If the TUC wave really was that two-dimensional, then few ships or star systems might have had the phenomenally bad luck of getting in its way...

Also, what harms a few hundred meters of starship might do negligible damage to a planet protected by dozens of kilometers of atmosphere. Except perhaps at point blank range - and some noncanon sources would have us believe that Praxis, "the Klingon Moon", actually orbited Qo'noS.

Nero obviously wasn't in the Romulan system at the time of the disaster

And to be sure, we don't know if Spock was, either. Spock flew to the unnamed location that would allow him to stop the supernova from doing damage. And his goal was to stop more damage than just the bit that would harm Romulus, because he didn't cease his efforts after Romulus was gone. Perhaps he was at the core of the explosion, nowhere near Romulus - but accidentally near Nero?

Nero only says he was off-planet, but not necessarily off-system - he said he "watched" and "saw it happen", and this might have been without the benefit of interstellar-range visual observation devices. So things could go either way. Starships might have been immune to the effects of the supernova, including Spock's tiny ship and Nero's civilian rig.

Timo Saloniemi
 
If the TUC wave really was that two-dimensional, then few ships or star systems might have had the phenomenally bad luck of getting in its way...

Also, what harms a few hundred meters of starship might do negligible damage to a planet protected by dozens of kilometers of atmosphere. Except perhaps at point blank range - and some noncanon sources would have us believe that Praxis, "the Klingon Moon", actually orbited Qo'noS.

Nero obviously wasn't in the Romulan system at the time of the disaster

And to be sure, we don't know if Spock was, either. Spock flew to the unnamed location that would allow him to stop the supernova from doing damage. And his goal was to stop more damage than just the bit that would harm Romulus, because he didn't cease his efforts after Romulus was gone. Perhaps he was at the core of the explosion, nowhere near Romulus - but accidentally near Nero?

Nero only says he was off-planet, but not necessarily off-system - he said he "watched" and "saw it happen", and this might have been without the benefit of interstellar-range visual observation devices. So things could go either way. Starships might have been immune to the effects of the supernova, including Spock's tiny ship and Nero's civilian rig.

Timo Saloniemi
 
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