The Hypothesis of Hidden Subtext

[Triskelion]

Ok, I just finished the run of all seven seasons. Just wonderful. But for a lark, this time, I remember reading somewhere that there was a homosexual subtext running through O'Brien's and Bashir's relationship. Now, that had never occurred to me in previous viewings; but this time I was purposely watching for that. And I must admit, some of their dialogue and situations were pretty funny if one assumed they were having a secret affair. All those references to private time in the holosuites, in which no one else could possibly be invited.... All those references to how Keiko is such an understanding and patient wife.... Why can't she be more like a man.... Funny stuff.

I just think it's in the eye of the beholder, but really it was just an innocent friendship. (Come on, if they were intimate, they wouldn't have such a hard time showing affection, would they)?

Thoughts? Other interesting hypotheses about the show?

 

[Michael]

I think they were just friends. Miles loved Keiko. I never looked at it differently.

 

[Temis the Vorta]

The writers were too obvious about Bashir and O'Brien for it to be subtext. But Bashir and Garak, oh my frakkin gawd, that was subtext up to your eyeballs.

And don't even get me started on Odo and Weyoun.

 

[erastus25]

There's a couple youtube clips of scenes in which Bashir and O'Brien catch themselves being a little too gay for their own comfort. There's one specifically with the chief almost saying he loves Bashir. The videos are accompanied by rather heated debate in the comments section about whether or not the scenes are inherently homophobic. An interesting, if overdramatized debate.

 

[ninetofive]

Since there is absolutely nothing about Keiko to love, we must assume O'Brien was gay. Keiko was just his front. Sort of like when the mob buys a pizza place to use it as an HQ.

 

[JM1776]

The writers were too obvious about Bashir and O'Brien for it to be subtext. But Bashir and Garak, oh my frakkin gawd, that was subtext up to your eyeballs.

And don't even get me started on Odo and Weyoun.

Now, see, I thought the Garak/Bashir interrelationship far more obviously implicative of a pedophilic "Want some candy, little boy?" subtext than anything that occurred between O'Brien and Bashir did homosexuality—though the 'comrades-in-arms at every turn' theme grew tremendously tiresome by season six or so.

Robinson, whether intentionally or not, played Garak in a "fabulous, just fabulous, darling" manner early on, which contributed to this perception.

 

[Navaros]

Bashir might have been gay for O'Brien but there is no way that O'Brien was gay for Bashir.

I agree that there is no way for O'Brien to have loved a battle axe like Keiko, but that doesn't make him gay. Just frustrated.

 

[JM1776]

I agree that there is no way for O'Brien to have loved a battle axe like Keiko...

Of course he loved her.

Real love has little to do with 'like.'

 

[Hofner]

I agree that there is no way for O'Brien to have loved a battle axe like Keiko...

Of course he loved her.

Real love has little to do with 'like.'

Oh, I wouldn't call Keiko a battle axe. I didn't think of her so much of a sharp instrument but rather a blunt instrument, like a bat or a lead pipe.

And yeah, that first scene with Garak and Bashir made me chuckle. Bashir reminded me of a nervous virgin bride on her wedding night. I had the feeling that if Garak had playfully made a lunge in the direction of Bashir's groin, Bashir would've gone running down the promenade covering his jewels and screaming.

Robert

 

[Flying Spaghetti Monster]

In general, there was a subtext about gender role reversals, as the females were presented as the righters (both Dax and Kira were warriors, particularly in "Bload Oath" and "WOTW" respectively)...
-and Velix'pran, who was unseen was a male giving birth
- and in Crossover, there was discussion about a man being physicially assaulted by his wife, prompting Kira to ask, almost in a protective, motherly voice, "Why does he stay with her?" Of course, today this kind of thing happens more than we think, but in TV shows, particularly SF shows, it never is mentioned

 

[PhoenixIreland]

If you really want to you could read gay subtexts into any close male friendship.

 

[nx1701g]

I do remember (I've been watching the series over again too) there is a scene where O'Brien tells Bashir that there are times when he likes Bashir more than Keiko.

As for Garak - Andrew Robinson said in interviews that he played Garak as a bisexual. I think in the relaunch novels (including the one that Andy Robinson himself wrote) that is the case.

 

[PhoenixIreland]

I do remember (I've been watching the series over again too) there is a scene where O'Brien tells Bashir that there are times when he likes Bashir more than Keiko.

As for Garak - Andrew Robinson said in interviews that he played Garak as a bisexual. I think in the relaunch novels (including the one that Andy Robinson himself wrote) that is the case.

Garak definitly had that air about him with bashir.

As for the liking her better comment, woudn't you if you had Keiko for a wife? man she could whine and complain like none other...
The only episode I liked her in was when they nearly lost molly.

 

[DanCPA]

I do remember (I've been watching the series over again too) there is a scene where O'Brien tells Bashir that there are times when he likes Bashir more than Keiko.

It's 2 guy friends... I enjoy it! There are times when I would rather hang out with the guys!

 

[Triskelion]

Between Keiko and Captain Yates, I really feel for those guys. Those characters really liked to squeeze the grapes. And you won't catch me ringing a #$% bell so my wife can indulge her pretensions giving birth.

Give me Jadzia or even Ezri any day. Or Leeta!

Miles wanted to play another holocharacter besides Falcon. He wanted Odo's part, who got the hot blond. Some friend Bashir turned out to be, wouldn't let him!

 

[MeanJoePhaser]

The real love story was Dukat and Damar

Or Kira and Dax.

Or Odo and Quark

Or not...

If you look at the Deep Space Nine couples, the tech-saavy doofus Rom gets the hottie, while Sisko and O'Brien get shrews. And brutish Worf gets the pretty, smart chick but loses her because he was never worthy of her anyway. You can tell the writers were geeks.​

 

[LeadHead]

I don't think there was any hidden subtext of anything beyond them being really good friends. Lots of people see in their friends qualities that they wish their spouses would adopt. Not to mention how sometimes they have activities that they simply want to do without having it have to become a big group scenario.

 

[Triskelion]

The real love story was Dukat and Damar

Or Kira and Dax.

Or Odo and Quark

Or not...

If you look at the Deep Space Nine couples, the tech-saavy doofus Rom gets the hottie, while Sisko and O'Brien get shrews. And brutish Worf gets the pretty, smart chick but loses her because he was never worthy of her anyway. You can tell the writers were geeks.​

Seditious