Stable time loop.
The Flash - Season 1
- Thread starter Agent Richard07
- Start date
Stable time loop.
It's a not a loop.
A loop is when you are stuck going around and around and around.
Young blond Eobard is going to show up end of this season or beginning of next, and (I liked Matt Letscher on Eli Stone, and he was pretty good on Good Morning Miami too.) fight the Flash as Wells looks on. Yes the real Wells might be saved, but also if young Eobard has the wrong face, that could give old Eobard another year of playing Wells without anyone cottoning onto his game.
Wells, 14 years older, although still a bit of a dick, might realize that he was a massive douche nozzle as a young man, consider himself reformed and play a nicer game against his unwitting opponents.
It's just predestination, and it's only predestination (hey? Is postdestination a word or the most flagrant oxymoron ever?) as long as Barry permits it. Someone has to kill his mother, and right now, because last week it was kinda clear that the killer might not have been the Reverse Flash.
If Hank doesn't do it, then Barry has to.
Does Barry have smaller stones than Carl from the Walking dead?
Oh.
Hank kills Nora so Barry doesn't have to?
A loop is when you are stuck going around and around and around.
Young blond Eobard is going to show up end of this season or beginning of next, and (I liked Matt Letscher on Eli Stone, and he was pretty good on Good Morning Miami too.) fight the Flash as Wells looks on. Yes the real Wells might be saved, but also if young Eobard has the wrong face, that could give old Eobard another year of playing Wells without anyone cottoning onto his game.
Wells, 14 years older, although still a bit of a dick, might realize that he was a massive douche nozzle as a young man, consider himself reformed and play a nicer game against his unwitting opponents.
It's just predestination, and it's only predestination (hey? Is postdestination a word or the most flagrant oxymoron ever?) as long as Barry permits it. Someone has to kill his mother, and right now, because last week it was kinda clear that the killer might not have been the Reverse Flash.
If Hank doesn't do it, then Barry has to.
Does Barry have smaller stones than Carl from the Walking dead?
Oh.
Hank kills Nora so Barry doesn't have to?
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Somewhat related, I love the William Messner-Loebs explanation of what happened to Barry during the Crisis.
Barry stopped a tachyon cannon from destroying reality, but he had to run so fast that he began burning up his body while also going back in time. Just as Barry caught the tachyon, his physical form burned away leaving just energy; energy that became the lightning bolt that turned Barry into the Flash. Electricity travels in a circuit, and so did Barry's time as the Flash.
Did Barry have no choice but to sacrifice himself, or would he simply make that choice every time regardless? Can it be a loop if he would honestly always make that choice?
Temporal Guilt.
That show caused me to cringe every time someone said "secret".
Tvline.com had some spoilers about Barry, Joe and Eddie keeping Barry being The Flash from Iris:
Question: Do you have any quality info about The Flash that you can share? —Brandy
Ausiello: Barry and Joe’s decision to clue Eddie in on The Flash’s identity while keeping Iris in the dark is going to cause plenty of disagreement within the trio. “Eddie, as the much more emotionally in-touch character, is like, ‘This is ridiculous. By not telling her, you’re actually putting her in more danger,'” exec producer Andrew Kreisberg previews. “That starts to become the conflict between the three men, because Eddie is not happy with how Barry and Joe have been handling this. It starts to really impact his relationship with Iris.” It’ll also force Barry to take a good, long look at himself — and he won’t like what he sees. Teases Kreisberg: “Barry will go, ‘Wait, when did I become such a great liar? I thought of myself as so innocent and pure.'”
Ausiello: Barry and Joe’s decision to clue Eddie in on The Flash’s identity while keeping Iris in the dark is going to cause plenty of disagreement within the trio. “Eddie, as the much more emotionally in-touch character, is like, ‘This is ridiculous. By not telling her, you’re actually putting her in more danger,'” exec producer Andrew Kreisberg previews. “That starts to become the conflict between the three men, because Eddie is not happy with how Barry and Joe have been handling this. It starts to really impact his relationship with Iris.” It’ll also force Barry to take a good, long look at himself — and he won’t like what he sees. Teases Kreisberg: “Barry will go, ‘Wait, when did I become such a great liar? I thought of myself as so innocent and pure.'”
Yeah well Eddie doesn't know aoubt Eobard yet but I can imagine Barry's reaction.
Barry: Hey Eddie, you don't mind being hit by a train and dying so that my mother won't be killed by your descendant do you?
I said after "Out of Time" aired that once Eobard's secret gets out, I think someone is going to decide that the surest way to defeat him is to kill Eddie and erase Eobard's existence.I think that someone will be Joe. He won't want to do it, but his need to protect Iris, and Barry, will push him towards that decision. I figure Barry will have to stop him and give some "ends doesn't justify the means" speech in order to save Joe from committing murder.
But you personally know that that won't work because of the rules set up by this show, even if Joe thinks that the rules set up by the movie Looper are the real deal?
Hmmm.
Looper vs Leaper.
Would I pay to see that?
Nope.
Hmmm.
Looper vs Leaper.
Would I pay to see that?
Nope.
Yeah well Eddie doesn't know aoubt Eobard yet but I can imagine Barry's reaction.
Barry: Hey Eddie, you don't mind being hit by a train and dying so that my mother won't be killed by your descendant do you?
I said after "Out of Time" aired that once Eobard's secret gets out, I think someone is going to decide that the surest way to defeat him is to kill Eddie and erase Eobard's existence.I think that someone will be Joe. He won't want to do it, but his need to protect Iris, and Barry, will push him towards that decision. I figure Barry will have to stop him and give some "ends doesn't justify the means" speech in order to save Joe from committing murder.
Maybe Eddie will pull a Heroic Self Sacrifice.
But just because we know and understand those rules, doesn't mean Joe does. He'll see a man from the future alongside his own distant relative and figure that killing that relative would erase the bad guy from existence, and probably save Nora along with it. Not to mention that without Eobard's intervention, the particle accelerator won't explode (at least not when it did in this timeline). In Joe's eyes that could mean no dangerous metas, and Barry gets a shot at a normal life.
Seems like Joe might see that as a fair trade.
Yeah well Eddie doesn't know aoubt Eobard yet but I can imagine Barry's reaction.
Barry: Hey Eddie, you don't mind being hit by a train and dying so that my mother won't be killed by your descendant do you?
I said after "Out of Time" aired that once Eobard's secret gets out, I think someone is going to decide that the surest way to defeat him is to kill Eddie and erase Eobard's existence.I think that someone will be Joe. He won't want to do it, but his need to protect Iris, and Barry, will push him towards that decision. I figure Barry will have to stop him and give some "ends doesn't justify the means" speech in order to save Joe from committing murder.
Maybe Eddie will pull a Heroic Self Sacrifice.
Yes, I agree that's just as plausible. Eddie definitely comes across as knoble enough to do that. Especially if he thinks it will save lives, including Iris.
Honestly though, I can't see Eddie actually dying, as Eobard does need to exist, and Barry will likely stop either someone killing Eddie, or Eddie killing himself.
Old Wells Eobard is from a timeline where Nora lived and the particle accelerator exploded in 2020. Any New Young Eobard that shows up will be related to "our" Eddie because he is from the future born from the past that is the present which we are watching, but Old Wells Eobard is related to the Mirror Eddie in a parallel timeline where he is from. If new Eobard tries to go back and get the Flash as a Baby, he'll bump into young Wells Eobard who is a different Eobard from "the original time" in a mirror universe to new Eobard who is from a timeline where the particle accelerator exploded in 2015.
There was no Superboy on Smallville and Chloe didn't figure it out, alicia showed her b y forcing Clark to stop a speeding car.
I know that, but the post was too clunky when I expressed the full facts to an audience who mostly thinks that Smallville is a well used animal toilet.
I'm embracing brevity, after a fashion, and you know that has to lead somewhere better than my usual gig.
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1727317/?ref_=tt_cl_t2
I'm embracing brevity, after a fashion, and you know that has to lead somewhere better than my usual gig.
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1727317/?ref_=tt_cl_t2
Okay, suddenly I really like Eddie.
By the way, the reason I don't think the situation with Iris is the same as something like Batman and Robin keeping Aunt Harriet in the dark or Wonder Woman keeping Steve Trevor in the dark is that they, like most superheroes in those days, kept their secrets from everyone. Only Alfred knew the Dynamic Duo's identity. Nobody in Man's World knew Wonder Woman's identity (at least, no regular characters). Nobody knew Superman's identity once his parents died (or, in post-Crisis, nobody knew except his parents). And so on. No one person was being singled out as especially in need of "protection" from the truth. What's different here is that Barry has been revealing his identity to more and more people all through the season, but he and Joe have conspired to keep Iris as the exception to the rule. It's just not a healthy or sensible way of treating her, and it sounds like the characters are finally going to figure that out.
You're actually making the case for us -- you're just like Joe, a human being who is really passionate about defending what he cares about
We all think that normally, you're a very thoughtful writer/ TrekBBS poster with some great wisdom, and lots of compassion. But one particular point, you seem to be overly defending something that isn't necessarily needing that defense.
As a watcher of Batman & Wonder Woman on MeTV, you know Steve Trevor is pretty much getting the same treatment as Aunt Harriet. And again, Iris is a COMMON SCI-FI/Superhero Trope.
In the modern age, Captain Lance on Arrow has been getting the same treatment on Arrow (Isn't he the only regular at this point who also doesn't know the hero's secret?). In fact, it's probably worse, since he's a cop, who is a little better equipped to handle things (and willing & trained the make the needed sacrifice).
I would type more , but Spring Break is starting, since i don't want to be a "crappy father", i'm going to spend time with my daughters, rather than making extensive arguments on the internet. (At least for the moment
)
I've really liked Eddie for awhile. He's consistently been kind and caring in general, and very understanding regarding Iris' relationship with Barry once he knows how Barry feels. The whole "must find the Flash and expose him" thing seems out of character now, and the one time he did come across as needlessly aggressive in punching Barry, Barry had just finished making Iris feel like shit. And then he profusely apologized later when he was fed the "lightning psychosis" nonsense.
If it were up to me (it's not) Eddie would stay with Iris, Barry would get over her, and he'd get together with Caitlin. Or Linda (again).
That's a nonsensical comparison, because I'm not patronizingly keeping secrets from a grown woman. All I'm doing is expressing a different point of view, openly and without deceit. I don't care what the religious bigots in Indiana may claim, you cannot oppress someone simply by disagreeing with them.
As I said in my previous post, she would be IF Barry were keeping his secret from everyone. But that's not the case. We've reached the point where everyone in the main cast except Iris is in on the secret, and there is no reason Iris is being kept out of the loop except that Joe insists on treating her like a child.
And if you've read the above spoiler, it sounds like the show's writers actually agree with me that Joe and Barry's treatment of Iris is problematical and needs to be addressed. So I'll just let the show speak for me from here on.
If it were up to me (it's not) Eddie would stay with Iris, Barry would get over her, and he'd get together with Caitlin. Or Linda (again).
If they were really bold, they'd have Barry get together with Cisco...
I wonder if we're supposed to assume that the characters in this show are flawed.
In an Arrowverse show?! The hell you say! 
Has anybody actually disagreed that Joe and Barry keeping her in the dark is a problem?
Has anybody actually disagreed that Joe and Barry keeping her in the dark is a problem?
Joe and Eddie are cops, Barry is the Flash so they are trained to protect themselves. Iris is no weakling but she is not trained like the others so they want to keep her safe and away from the whole situation, not too mention the whole she is a reporter.
If I was fighting a powerful enemy, I would deffo not tell the person I loved anything that could get her killed or put her in danger and Joe is pissed scared because her life was threatened by the Reverse Flash once already.
If I was fighting a powerful enemy, I would deffo not tell the person I loved anything that could get her killed or put her in danger and Joe is pissed scared because her life was threatened by the Reverse Flash once already.
