"The Enterprise Incident"-Remastered

[James Wright]

When "THE ENTERPRISE INCIDENT" was remastered were scenes changed from what originally appeared when the episode first aired?
I've seen still pictures of the remastered episode and one of the ships that stopped the Enterprise is a bird of prey not a battlecruiser!

JDW

 

[WendellM]

There's one BOP and two D7s in the remastered version. Unfortunately, this is another example of the "remastering" actually changing things:

I understand the need to improve the SFX quality, and I don't mind that or replacing "blobs of light" with ship models (like in "Journey to Babel"). But when the remastering team changes established facts (like replacing a Romulan "Klingon-design" ship with a BOP, or changing what the Aurora looks like in "The Way to Eden", just because they can), I think they've gone too far. But, that's just an opinion. I have my un-tampered-with DVD sets to watch, so I'm not really bothered. I enjoy a lot of the updated effects, and just write off the rest as "fan fiction."

 

[Icy_Penguigo]

I don't really see a problem with adding a Bird of Prey to the mix. There's still Klingon-designed ships there, so it doesn't invalidate Spock's remark. It's kind of cool to see the Romulans using a mixed fleet too. Plus, that Bird of Prey model is cool, and it's good to see it get a bit more use.

 

[22 Stars]

^ I agree, it doesn't contradict Spock's line and it gave us something new to look at, a nice treat for the fans

 

[Timo]

...Also, it might help explain why the Romulans failed to destroy Kirk's ship during the final escape scene. One pissed-off battle cruiser Kirk might well run away from. Three, no way. But if one of the three adversaries was an older ship that couldn't give credible chase, we're back to the "weeeeel, perhaps it's plausible" territory. Perhaps one of the two newer and faster ships was pointing the wrong way when Kirk jumped to warp, so only the other one could keep on his tail, while the older model was left standing still?

I just hope they would have added easily visible bird paint on the Klingon-acquired ships, too.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[WendellM]

You're both right that it doesn't contradict the spoken script, but it does change what was on screen.

So, I might say something like, "how about those Romulans operating trios of Klingon-designed ships" and your reply might be, "no, they only had pairs of them, operating with a Bird of Prey." Right there is a conflict that never existed prior to 2007 (or whenever the altered episode first aired).

In the entire 30-or-so year history of Star Trek, it was clear: the Romulans in "The Enterprise Incident" had three Klingon-designed ships - that was that, and there was no question. But now, thanks to the "restoration" , that's not the case. There can be schisms about how many of what type ship there was in the ep.

So, if I were to ask the board right now, "How many Klingon-designed ships were in The Enterprise Incident?", is the correct answer two or three? For thirty years the correct answer, agreed upon by all of fandom, was "three." Not now, due to some CGI, there's some uncertainly. That's a failing in my book.

 

[WendellM]

I just hope they would have added easily visible bird paint on the Klingon-acquired ships, too.

They did. That's something they did very right, and I give the remastering team full credit for that nice touch:

I don't *hate* the remastered stuff - some of it is great. I just object to contradicting the "facts" of what's been long established. Giving a spiffy Romulan paint job to the D7s is an improvement. Changing one of them to a BOP isn't. All of this is just my opinion, of course.

 

[Icy_Penguigo]

You're both right that it doesn't contradict the spoken script, but it does change what was on screen.

So, I might say something like, "how about those Romulans operating trios of Klingon-designed ships" and your reply might be, "no, they only had pairs of them, operating with a Bird of Prey." Right there is a conflict that never existed prior to 2007 (or whenever the altered episode first aired).

In the entire 30-or-so year history of Star Trek, it was clear: the Romulans in "The Enterprise Incident" had three Klingon-designed ships - that was that, and there was no question. But now, thanks to the "restoration" , that's not the case. There can be schisms about how many of what type ship there was in the ep.

So, if I were to ask the board right now, "How many Klingon-designed ships were in The Enterprise Incident?", is the correct answer two or three? For thirty years the correct answer, agreed upon by all of fandom, was "three." Not now, due to some CGI, there's some uncertainly. That's a failing in my book.

I'm a huge fan of TOS. Modern Trek doesn't get much credit from me(except DS9, which I thought was awesome). I am a big subscriber to the Star Fleet Battles Universe(since I'm the main artist for it nowadays).

According to that lore, the Roms allied with the Klingons and purchased their ships because their old, impulse-powered ships were very inferior. But they could never afford enough Klingon-designed ships to do the jobs they wanted. So a mixed fleet of Klingon and old ships makes perfect sense to me. (The Romulans still purchased a dozen or so aging D4's and D6's so a good number of them were still flying around the Romulan Empire.)

 

[Timo]

Which reminds me that we never get onscreen clarification as to how exactly the Romulans got those Klingon ships.

Alliance? Perhaps - but none is ever referred to on screen, not directly. At most, TNG "Reunion" refers to the possibility of a "new alliance" between Klingons and Romulans, but that doesn't mean there had to exist an old alliance. All onscreen sources speak of animosity only, save for small factions within the empires co-conspiring at times.

Mutual trade despite cold relations? Quite possibly - but what are the Romulans paying with? Earlier on, we might have assumed it was cloaks. But nothing in Trek particularly suggests that Klingon cloaks would be a new thing in the 2260s, or purchased from aboard. Instead, ENT now suggests that Romulans were experimenting on, and Klingons had acquired from alien sources, early invisibility or visual-signature-altering devices in the 2150s. For all we know, Romulans bought their cloaks from Klingons for the "Balance of Terror" attack!

Industrial espionage or outright theft? Both seem a bit unlikely. If it were espionage, why create such carbon copies when partial imitation would probably have better fit the Romulan industrial capabilities? If it were theft, it must have been one hell of a war (hot or cold) between the two for even a pair or trio of top-rate cruisers to have fallen in Romulan hands near-intact. And are these two or three supposed to be the only such vessels in Romulan use? (They might just as well be - SF Intelligence might have sent Kirk specifically to penetrate the RNZ at the spot where they knew these new ships were operating.)

Timo Saloniemi

 

[maryh]

The Romulan use of Klingon ships was done simply because they were on such a tight budget and the BOP has been destroyed. A quick fix was to simply use the Klingon ships and find an excuse. If I had the chance to go back and redo errors I made in the past, I would. I wouldn't worry about tradition or continuity, I go ahead and correct my errors. If it were me, I'd change ALL the ships back to BOP's and cut out Spocks line. I'd also cut Spocks smile out of The Menagerie and other goodies like this. Some people take continuity too seriously and still try to reconcile smiling Spock to one he became after they rescripted the character. Same with BOP's appearing in the Enterprise Incident.

 

[Outpost4]

Now this is taking remastering too far, maryh. Where would you stop? Shall we digitally place Chekov in the first season because Kahn says he remembers him?

Just as you can argue that continuity is overrated, I can argue that Trekkies are too anal. Frankly, I think I'll win that argument.

In fact, I'd argue, with your desire to correct the smiling Spock and make the ships warbirds (they weren't BOP), you are the one who is being overly concerned with continuity.

And back on topic, I have no problem with changing the registry of one of the Romulan ships in this episode. In fact, I thought it was cool.

 

[maryh]

Now this is taking remastering too far, maryh. Where would you stop? Shall we digitally place Chekov in the first season because Kahn says he remembers him?

Just as you can argue that continuity is overrated, I can argue that Trekkies are too anal. Frankly, I think I'll win that argument.

In fact, I'd argue, with your desire to correct the smiling Spock and make the ships warbirds (they weren't BOP), you are the one who is being overly concerned with continuity.

And back on topic, I have no problem with changing the registry of one of the Romulan ships in this episode. In fact, I thought it was cool.

I wouldn't care about the smiling Spock and just chalk it up to the rescripting of the character done between pilots but there are too many continuity nuts out there who need to reconcile the two and come up with all kinds of nutty explanations. They even think Spock in this new movie has to shout and smile!! Still, I like the BOP more than Klingon cruisers so if they replaced them all it wouldn't bother me. It wouldn't effect the excellent plot and characters that this TOS episode is famous for. Star Trek does James Bond.

The first time I saw a ship disappear in ST I thought "Wow, that is impossible, pure science fiction fantasy". But it looks like I was wrong:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,401101,00.html

 

[James Wright]

Actually, the Romulans made a trade with the Klingons, cloaking technology for designs specifications of the D-7 battlecruiser.

JDW

 

[James Wright]

To keep the piece among Star Trek fans who ever made the changes to TOS episodes should have included the original scenes along with the remastered scenes.
I've yet to see the remastered episodes myself!

JDW

 

[Timo]

Actually, the Romulans made a trade with the Klingons, cloaking technology for designs specifications of the D-7 battlecruiser.

In that case, they either are very fast builders, or then they sold the cloak before they themselves had tested it operationally...!

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Maurice]

To keep the piece among Star Trek fans who ever made the changes to TOS episodes should have included the original scenes along with the remastered scenes.
I've yet to see the remastered episodes myself!

JDW

Piece of what?

 

[Wingsley]

There's one BOP and two D7s in the remastered version. Unfortunately, this is another example of the "remastering" actually changing things:

<SNIP>

I understand the need to improve the SFX quality, and I don't mind that or replacing "blobs of light" with ship models (like in "Journey to Babel"). But when the remastering team changes established facts (like replacing a Romulan "Klingon-design" ship with a BOP, or changing what the Aurora looks like in "The Way to Eden", just because they can), I think they've gone too far. But, that's just an opinion. I have my un-tampered-with DVD sets to watch, so I'm not really bothered. I enjoy a lot of the updated effects, and just write off the rest as "fan fiction."

I do not see the remastered Aurora as revisionism.

The "original" Aurora was a Tholian ship with nacelles. It looked ridiculous. The nacelles aside, it did not look Federation.

The risk with the "remastered" Aurora is that the new design looks a little too TNGish for my tastes, especially the pylons.

 

[Jimmy_C]

I do not see the remastered Aurora as revisionism.

The "original" Aurora was a Tholian ship with nacelles. It looked ridiculous. The nacelles aside, it did not look Federation.

The risk with the "remastered" Aurora is that the new design looks a little too TNGish for my tastes, especially the pylons.

The Aurora doesn't look anything like TNG. In fact, it looks like SpaceShipOne! Want to tell Rutan that the ship his team designed looks too futuristic and too much like TNG?

 

[Nedersong]

That remastered Tholian ship does not look TNG at all. But I still prefer the original design, although without the Nacelles.

 

[James Wright]

There is another possibility as to how the Romulans aquired the Klingon Battlecruiser, as a war prize after a border skirmish?

JDW