And Carmen may or not be a key.
The Clara Conundrum (SPOILERS And Speculation)
- Thread starter StCoop
- Start date
And Carmen may or not be a key.
Exactly.Christopher said:
As I said in another thread, I'm betting that the actress appears in several episodes, as very similar but individual characters, before finally being introduced as Clara. And they won't be the same character at different points in her own time-stream ala River Song. They'll be totally separate characters who, impossibly, look and act exactly the same, even though they're apparently from different regions of time and/or space. And the fact that this seems impossible, and doesn't make a whole lot of sense, is kinda the whole point.
See,the fact that the Doctor is suddenly encountering multiple versions of this same girl, regardless of where he is in time and space, is a mystery that he won't be able to resist. He'll want to know how and why there are multiple versions of this individual, and it'll be at least one of the reasons he opts to invite Clara along for the ride in the first place.
The How/Why of these multiple incarnations will be the basis of Clara's arc.
Last edited:
I think it's worth noting that, according to Caroline Skinner, Coleman was cast first as the companion, and then Moffat decided to cast her as Oswin.
This could make sense of why Moffat was two months late with the Christmas script -- when he decided to use the same actress in two roles, he had to revise the Christmas script to tie them together.
Something else to consider, wasn't there a rumour a few weeks ago that Jenna-Louise Coleman was going to appear in all five episodes as a mysterious character?
Yea, it almost makes you want to respect his dedication to tying it all together in quality, rather than raging against him being so late with the Christmas Script.
(Or something 
)
I am greatly curious to see how they are tied together. A part of me wants her to be the same character, so we can see how the Doctor deals with a former Dalek. I think that would be incredibly fascinating, and better than Coleman playing just another girl he happens to pick up along the way.
Not necessarily. Adeola had no connection to the upcoming companion Martha until Freema was cast. They added the throw away line about the characters being cousins after the fact. Similarly, Jenna could have just made an impression.
No, Caroline Skinner (co-ep) said at the NYC Q&A that she was cast as the new companion first then Moffat decided to put her in this episode.
Windows OS (sorry, couldn't resist) told the Doctor to remember who she was.
So all he has to do is jump in a crack and remember her and viola - instant Clara.
So all he has to do is jump in a crack and remember her and viola - instant Clara.
As mentioned above, Jenna-Louise Coleman was cast as Clara first, and then Moffat decided to have her play Oswin. This combined with the fact that the Christmas special has been repeatedly delayed due to re-writes (possibly to accomodate this casting) suggest there is a connection between Oswin and Clara. Also, Clara's last name is supposed to be Oswin, there's no way that's a coincidence.
I am, of course, aware that Agyeman was cast as Martha after playing Adeola -- and that Nicholas Courtney was Bret Vyon before he was the Brigadier, Jean Marsh was Princess Joanna before she was Sara Kingdom, Peter Purves and Ian Marter both played guest roles before becoming companions, Lalla Ward was Princess Astra before becoming Romana, Colin Baker was Maxil before becoming the Doctor, Eve Myles was Gwyneth before she was Gwen Cooper, and Karen Gillan was the Pompeiian Soothsayer before she was Amy. And David Tennant did a couple of Big Finish audios before he became the Doctor.
But in this particular case, it was strongly suggested by the storyline and dialogue that Oswin was specifically intended to be a character we'd be expected to remember, one who might reasonably be expected to have some later significance to the season arc. So it wasn't just the casting issue that led me to that conclusion. (I believe Katy Manning said in the recent Radio Times article linked elsewhere in this forum that she guessed Oswin would have later significance based purely on the story, before she even recognized that it was Coleman.)
And of course, as others have pointed out, this situation is the reverse of those, since she was cast as the "different" (?) character after she was cast as the companion.
But in this particular case, it was strongly suggested by the storyline and dialogue that Oswin was specifically intended to be a character we'd be expected to remember, one who might reasonably be expected to have some later significance to the season arc. So it wasn't just the casting issue that led me to that conclusion. (I believe Katy Manning said in the recent Radio Times article linked elsewhere in this forum that she guessed Oswin would have later significance based purely on the story, before she even recognized that it was Coleman.)
And of course, as others have pointed out, this situation is the reverse of those, since she was cast as the "different" (?) character after she was cast as the companion.
Win(dows) OS...er OSWin may have been a red Herring, just to mess with our minds, but, considering they went to the extent of her practically "Breaking the 4th Wall" and telling the Audience to "Remember", IMHO, that's going too far with a Red Herring, you generally don't hang a spot light on a Red Herring like that. So, I'm believing Oswin and Clara, gotta be connected
Picking up for just a moment on that word "Remember"...When the Doctor, Amy, and Rory stand before the Parliament, Amy asks him what they should do, and the Doctor says "Make them remember you." By the end of the story, Oswin has made the Daleks forget them. Oswin also constructed a "dream" in order to forget the truth of what happened to her on the planet. So, there's something going on around the concept of memory here.
Ohh, memory's been a major theme in Moffat Who for a long time. The Crack in Time making everyone forget people and things, the Doctor coming back from oblivion because he got Amy to remember him, the Silence being forgotten as soon as you look away... and arguably in his earlier stories, like River remembering the Doctor before he met her, or Reinette (like Amy) remembering the Doctor as an imaginary friend from childhood. Even Captain Jack, whom Moffat created, had a gap in his memory that he was trying to fill, although that thread was never picked up by RTD.
Jack was actually created by RTD, Moffat simply got the honour of writing the episode which introduces him.
Anyway, the whole thing with Jack forgetting two years of his life wasn't part of RTD's backstory for the character. That was something Moffat inserted to make him seem more interesting. RTD's attitude is that since it was Moffat's idea, it's his responisibility to tell that story. Which is why the idea has never been touched in any of Jack's other DW appearances or in Torchwood.
^Okay, thanks. So Jack came from RTD, but the memory angle came from Moffat, which means my point still works. Yay!
Interesting. Matt Smith in that interview also seems to hint (before Skinner shuts him down) that we'll be seeing more of the TARDIS interior this season...
Here's my possibility:
First, the woman/Dalek that "trapped" The Doctor was not Oswin's mother.
During the Christmas episode, the doctor runs into Clara Oswin. Remembering the name, he finds out (not known to us) that she is Oswin's mother/grandmother/whatever, but works best as mother. He decides to have her travel with him to keep an eye and possibly change Oswin's fate. (Added Even not being born is better than the fate she has in store.
First, the woman/Dalek that "trapped" The Doctor was not Oswin's mother.
During the Christmas episode, the doctor runs into Clara Oswin. Remembering the name, he finds out (not known to us) that she is Oswin's mother/grandmother/whatever, but works best as mother. He decides to have her travel with him to keep an eye and possibly change Oswin's fate. (Added
Even not being born is better than the fate she has in store.
Here's my possibility:
First, the woman/Dalek that "trapped" The Doctor was not Oswin's mother.
During the Christmas episode, the doctor runs into Clara Oswin. Remembering the name, he finds out (not known to us) that she is Oswin's mother/grandmother/whatever, but works best as mother. He decides to have her travel with him to keep an eye and possibly change Oswin's fate. (Added
At least for the moment, The Doctor is content with Daleks not knowing who he is. So while he can rewrite Oswin's timeline, I don't think he's in a hurry to do so.
Similar threads
