"Hollywood" is a deeply conservative state of mind. Commercial products, about the only kind available, will reflect the political situtation, not in a narrowly partisan sense necessarily, but the basic world view. That basic world view says that there are monsters out there out to get us and "we" have to be remorselessly violent to save ourselves and win. And this apocalyptic struggle comes out of no policy or decision, it just happens. That's the basic world view. Hence these movies and TV shows.
The appeal of Torture-Porn and Popcorn?
- Thread starter TheMasterOfOrion
- Start date
Guess I should spoiler tag this since everyone seems to sensitive about spoilers lately...
All I want to know is: for a guy who's supposed to be dying of cancer he seems to have a lot of spare energy. What with all the kidnapping of people and running from cops. Not to mention doing torture chamber construction projects it would take Local 242 a year to complete. They should have hired this guy to build the new World Trade Center. He gets more done in a week than I've done in my entire life.
Well he's been dead for the past 4 films... Just turns out he's had accomplices since before the first one even started.
Back in the day I used to like the Halloween and Friday the 13th movies because they were tense, scary, some comedic elements, and had a good, spooky score. Over the years the quality of those movies degraded to just absurd. Jason in Space for example.
It appears to the that the new horror movies are just gore for the sake of gore with little else. Granted, I haven't watched much in the way of torture films but that is my impression based on what I have seen.
It appears to the that the new horror movies are just gore for the sake of gore with little else. Granted, I haven't watched much in the way of torture films but that is my impression based on what I have seen.
Heh. Entertaining stupidity can be fine, unless something that was previously of high quality is dumbed down, like with nu Trek.
I've heard good things about Dexter, but I haven't seen it; I was unable to even get through an episode of The Shield. The point isn't quality, as it's certainly not impossible to create quality within these limitations; the point is that all of these things arise from the same cultural Zeitgeist, just as those examples from the 60s that I gave arose from the same cultural Zeitgeist.
What's your problem with Shield exactly? If anything that's a sanitised version of what the LAPD was like for a long time.
Well, one could argue that Doctor Who is pretty dark, too, at least in its current incarnation. It's told in a light-hearted way but it's really one hell of a tragic tale - a guy who's responsible for the destruction of his planet and his race, who tends to lose most of the people that mean something to him. And for a show aimed at families, it has an extraordinarily high body count, I think.
But yeah, I agree with you. Besides, misery/tragedy has always been a part of entertainment/storytelling. The ancient epics and, of course, the Greek tragedies are full of it. There's plenty of gore in the Illiad and the Odyssey, loads of misery and corruption in various fairy tales.
I honestly just couldn't sit there for more than a few seconds without laughing. The camera bobs and weaves all over the place, zooms in and out pointlessly, and I don't think they ever actually focused on anybody's face as they were actually talking. I think the dialogue was pretty bad, too, but I don't really remember.
Very tragic, and very well done. I don't know if the dark element was included as a requirement to fashion, but they're sure doing it right. That show is positively inspirational, most of the time. It's the textbook example of the right way to revive a classic. And there's nothing wrong with tragedy as a storytelling theme, of course; what's wrong is just wallowing in misery to seem kewl and cynical.
And there are other very good shows that have included fashionable darker & grittier elements, yet have risen above them. Firefly and Lost come to mind, although both have gone over the line at times.
Sorry; I meant to say you never change your mind on any of this stuff (despite any arguments to the contrary), and it got lost in the editing.
No, I knew what you meant. 
But why would I change my mind when there are no arguments to the contrary? I mean, defending it is one thing, but denying it is another. It's a major cultural trend that's been worsening for more than 25 years; it's not exactly subtle.
But why would I change my mind when there are no arguments to the contrary? I mean, defending it is one thing, but denying it is another. It's a major cultural trend that's been worsening for more than 25 years; it's not exactly subtle.
No, I knew what you meant.
Worsening implies it's a bad thing.
Yes, it does.
Yes, television used to be sooo much better; Knight Rider, A-Team, Married With Children, Full House, Baywatch, 90210, Fresh Prince Of Bel-Air, etc.
What is the world coming to when there are shows on television that actually resemble reality and require the viewers to think?!
The end is near!
What is the world coming to when there are shows on television that actually resemble reality and require the viewers to think?!
The end is near!
I'd disagree. Variety in story telling is a good thing, and just because there are more dark, gritty or "realistic" stories now doesn't mean light-heartedness, whimsy and camp, and just plain escapism have disappeared either.Yes, it does.
I loved Pushing Daisies, I love Doctor Who, I didn't particularly like The Wire, and I thought BSG was fantastic at the start then suffered from a lack of direction and making it up on the spot.
I like that stories can go where they need to, whether that be dark and horrible, or light and fluffy.
The torture porn fad was pretty much over by the time this thread was first posted, anyway. Sure, they'll still churn out a Saw movie every year for a while, but the sub-genre itself has more or less died out.
That's true, they're back to slashers and gross out movies. I think the signs that Saw's on it's way out are about too, they're going with a 3D one for 7, which is gonna be nothing but a gimmick in a saw movie, and the past few have cost more and made less than the previous ones.
I'm a big horror fan, but I have to admit I've never seen a Saw movie. I don't have any kind of big stance against it; I've just heard that the movies aren't very good.
Some horror reviewers have said that the irony about Saw 6 having a lackluster performance is that it's the best of the films in terms of plot. But I still don't think I'll bother.
I'm fine with slashers and gross-outs, as long as the movies themselves are entertaining. I enjoyed Daybreakers, which had its messy moments, though it kind of lost its steam in the third act.
Horror fans' opinions are all over the place in regards to what makes a good movie. (I realize the same could be said for fans of any genre, but the spectrum seems especially wide in horror.) You have fans who can't stand splatter movies, preferring to build dread based on atmosphere, then you have fans who think cutting away is a cop-out.
Horror sites were bitterly divided over Paranormal Activity (as were audiences, really). It relied solely on atmosphere, and some people appreciated it, while lots felt ripped off.
I'm easy. Sometimes I want a thoughtful, slow-burn horror flick, and sometimes I want something splatter-y. I just watch whatever my mood calls for.
Some horror reviewers have said that the irony about Saw 6 having a lackluster performance is that it's the best of the films in terms of plot. But I still don't think I'll bother.
I'm fine with slashers and gross-outs, as long as the movies themselves are entertaining. I enjoyed Daybreakers, which had its messy moments, though it kind of lost its steam in the third act.
Horror fans' opinions are all over the place in regards to what makes a good movie. (I realize the same could be said for fans of any genre, but the spectrum seems especially wide in horror.) You have fans who can't stand splatter movies, preferring to build dread based on atmosphere, then you have fans who think cutting away is a cop-out.
Horror sites were bitterly divided over Paranormal Activity (as were audiences, really). It relied solely on atmosphere, and some people appreciated it, while lots felt ripped off.
I'm easy. Sometimes I want a thoughtful, slow-burn horror flick, and sometimes I want something splatter-y. I just watch whatever my mood calls for.
^Same here, with pretty much everything. Sci-fi sometimes I want something deep and interesting, sometimes I want something that's fun and action-y.
Horror never really scares me, but sometimes I want atmosphere, other times a bit of gore and humour.
Saw had an interesting thing going on, it was basically a sadistic game, and had you guessing who was actually playing the game, which was fun for the first film. Then the second one did something similar but added a bit more plot to it, and this is where the problems start for me. They keep piling ever more complicated twists and backstory in to it. Which makes it impossible to believe this one guy planned all this stuff that's continued on for 4 films after his death.
Horror never really scares me, but sometimes I want atmosphere, other times a bit of gore and humour.
Saw had an interesting thing going on, it was basically a sadistic game, and had you guessing who was actually playing the game, which was fun for the first film. Then the second one did something similar but added a bit more plot to it, and this is where the problems start for me. They keep piling ever more complicated twists and backstory in to it. Which makes it impossible to believe this one guy planned all this stuff that's continued on for 4 films after his death.
Beats me. When it happens, let me know.
I agree with you about variety, and that's part of my point; I don't see the variety out there that there used to be. Pushing Daisies was fantastic, but didn't last long; Doctor Who is a great exception. I'm not familiar with The Wire, but everything I ever saw of nuBSG was dismal dreck. If there was more variety out there, it wouldn't be so bad. But instead the D&G disease seems to be spreading, so that now it's infected Star Trek and Stargate, possibly Sherlock Holmes, as well as comics and so on.I'd disagree. Variety in story telling is a good thing, and just because there are more dark, gritty or "realistic" stories now doesn't mean light-heartedness, whimsy and camp, and just plain escapism have disappeared either.Yes, it does.
I loved Pushing Daisies, I love Doctor Who, I didn't particularly like The Wire, and I thought BSG was fantastic at the start then suffered from a lack of direction and making it up on the spot.
I like that stories can go where they need to, whether that be dark and horrible, or light and fluffy.
Maybe, but there's still that whole cultural Zeitgeist thing.
Yeah, that's me, too. As long as there's quality (or entertainment value) and the thing is true to itself, I can enjoy anything from Carnival Of Souls to Dawn Of The Dead.
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people like those movies thats why it is being made continuously...whether you become mad or insane, its up to you and mind it these flicks are having their own audience..
I appreciated enduring Antichrist but generally these movies aren't for me, but I sort of understand the appeal.
Deep Space Nine has been off the air for ten years, Nemesis bombed, and the optimistic and hip Abrams Trek is clearly where the franchise will be for the next couple of years.
Deep Space Nine has been off the air for ten years, Nemesis bombed, and the optimistic and hip Abrams Trek is clearly where the franchise will be for the next couple of years.