Terminator-217 "Ourselves Alone" - Discuss/Grade <SPOILERS>

[Greg Cox]

I doesn't bother me that Sarah didn't guess Riley was a time traveler. Confronted with evidence that Riley knows something about Judgment Day, which scenario sounds most plausible:

1) My teenage son opened up to his girlfriend.

2) The girlfriend is a time-traveler with a secret agenda.

Occam's razor kind of points towards a teenage boy talking too much to his girlfriend.

 

[Wouter2]

Exactly. And Cameron likely wasn't told (afraid as John and Sarah were about what she would do with Riley), whereas John ... I think he knew for 90% certain and was waiting for Riley to confess.

 

[hyzmarca]

I doesn't bother me that Sarah didn't guess Riley was a time traveler. Confronted with evidence that Riley knows something about Judgment Day, which scenario sounds most plausible:

1) My teenage son opened up to his girlfriend.

2) The girlfriend is a time-traveler with a secret agenda.

Occam's razor kind of points towards a teenage boy talking too much to his girlfriend.

Given how open teenage boys are about their feelings and how common time travelers with secret agendas are getting to be, the second actually sounds more plausible.

 

[nx1701g]

Exactly. And Cameron likely wasn't told (afraid as John and Sarah were about what she would do with Riley), whereas John ... I think he knew for 90% certain and was waiting for Riley to confess.

I think if Cameron had known about Riley's future war origins she wouldn't have hesitated.

 

[hyzmarca]

If Cameron knew about that then Riley would live long enough to enjoy some of Cameron's Jack Bauer Interrogation Techniques. At that point, the need for intel on her plans and her accomplices would outweigh the danger of someone finding a horrifically mutilated girl tied up in their basement.

 

[cbspock]

This show seems to have lost focus. The first season was much better.


-Chris

 

[Samuel T. Cogley]

This show seems to have lost focus. The first season was much better.

Agreed.

I remember thinking, "There's no way Terminator will work as a t.v. series."

And yet season one was so tight, and it really felt like they nailed the Terminator tone.

Now, there's no urgency. Just a group of people taking their sweet time trailing people who seem to have little or nothing to do with Skynet.

They need to up the tension and increase the urgency. Quick.

 

[nx1701g]

Truth is I agree to what's been said about Season Two not being as good, but I also disagree with it.

If we had a series where every lead panned out and had something to do with Skynet each of us has to admit we'd be pretty bored by it. It'd be more formulaic if everyone had something to do with Skynet rather than what we've been getting (some involved, some dead leads, and some just plain out not anything related to it).

The problem with comparing the first and second seasons is that they had to do a lot in the first season very quickly. The producers knew that the strike was coming so they had to put together a storyline that was going to fill the needs of the show and would keep people interested. The first season was shorter - nine were filmed with 13 planned for - whereas season two is a full 22 episode run. It goes back to what I said a few minutes ago. If every source panned out as true it'd get even more boring and Skynet would already be destroyed. In character its still two years until Judgment Day (which means two more seasons if they wanted).

Plus they're doing something that none of the films had a chance to do: exploring the terminator and their actions. Cameron is, in many respects, what the T-800 in T2 was on the verge of becoming. As said elsewhere in this thread Cameron's program may be at odds with itself because she's starting to learn the value of human life, but knows she has to kill threats to John.

A good many of the problems stem from studio interference. The stand alone episodes with only minor arc progression were demanded by Fox if they were to air season two because they wanted people to not have to worry about missing an episode and being lost. The budget was cut to an extent between seasons one and two. Riley was ordered by Fox because they wanted a love interest for John, but they never imagined people wouldn't take to her.

I agree though that the Riley subplot and the Jesse subplots have been pretty boring and detracted from the show. However, I think that Jesse's true mission will be interesting when we find out what it is. Personally, I think that she's not working for the Resistance but that's just my theory.

But I do agree, to an extent, but I also disagree, to an extent.

 

[LutherSloan]

I'm 110% sure that Jesse is AWOL, as was hinted at when she first showed up.

 

[Forbin]

I don't think the writers bothered to even check the laws when they wrote that scene. Nobody needs a carry permit to keep a gun in their own home.

The question Jesse posed to Sarah was about a "concealed carry" permit and not just gun ownership. Try to pay attention before dissing the writers.

Jesse? I was talking about the child welfare lady who came to the house to interview them, which wasn't Jesse. She asked if Sarah carried the gun outside the house, for which she'd need a concealed carry permit. Sarah didn't actually answer that question, she deflected. Try to pay attention before dissing the poster.

 

[Rowan Sjet]

Social Worker: Have you ever carried a weapon outside of the house?
<snip>
SW: I did a little search and couldn't find a concealed weapons permit in your name.
John: Check the state of New Mexico.

 

[Sephiroth]

my money is on Jesse having a chip in her head

 

[Wouter2]

I don't think so. Jesse is, I think, who she says she is: a resistance member who isn't that fond of John Connor (or at least his recent reprogramming policies) anymore, and who is dead set against metal in any form.

 

[nx1701g]

I don't think so. Jesse is, I think, who she says she is: a resistance member who isn't that fond of John Connor (or at least his recent reprogramming policies) anymore, and who is dead set against metal in any form.

Spoiler: Unless

She has been converted into an I-950, which is possible.

 

[Sephiroth]

I don't think so. Jesse is, I think, who she says she is: a resistance member who isn't that fond of John Connor (or at least his recent reprogramming policies) anymore, and who is dead set against metal in any form.

I disagree, how do you think she got back in time in the first place? John only had the one time machine, and I doubt he'd send anyone back he didn't trust in any paralelle timeline

 

[Ryan8bit]

I don't think so. Jesse is, I think, who she says she is: a resistance member who isn't that fond of John Connor (or at least his recent reprogramming policies) anymore, and who is dead set against metal in any form.

Spoiler: Unless

She has been converted into an I-950, which is possible.

No. Jesse is without a doubt neither of those. People always theorize about her wanting to kill John, but I think that if she wanted that it would've already happened.

 

[Tim]

I don't think so. Jesse is, I think, who she says she is: a resistance member who isn't that fond of John Connor (or at least his recent reprogramming policies) anymore, and who is dead set against metal in any form.

Spoiler: Unless

She has been converted into an I-950, which is possible.

No. Jesse is without a doubt neither of those. People always theorize about her wanting to kill John, but I think that if she wanted that it would've already happened.

I think Jesse's mission has always been to turn John against the machines, starting with Cameron. What better way than to get John to love Riley and then either drive Cameron to kill Riley or off Riley herself and let Cam take the fall? It all seems consistent to me.

 

[Ryan8bit]

I don't think so. Jesse is, I think, who she says she is: a resistance member who isn't that fond of John Connor (or at least his recent reprogramming policies) anymore, and who is dead set against metal in any form.

I disagree, how do you think she got back in time in the first place? John only had the one time machine, and I doubt he'd send anyone back he didn't trust in any paralelle timeline

Have you even been watching this show? Future scenes showed that Jesse picked Riley from one of the resistance hideouts. If she was an terminator sent by Skynet, it's unlikely that she would've infiltrated the base, taken Riley back to Skynet, and then time traveled. I realize her being friends with one of the TDE technicians and secretly using the TDE does sound implausible, but it's just the lack of thought put into things by the writers, not proof that she's a terminator.

Plus, there's no way that Riley choking Jesse would've affected her at all, and if Jesse were a terminator, the fight would've been over in two seconds.

I'll never get why people have this strange desire to think everyone is a terminator, especially on a show that is so largely transparent about the behavior of terminators.

 

[Sephiroth]

I don't think so. Jesse is, I think, who she says she is: a resistance member who isn't that fond of John Connor (or at least his recent reprogramming policies) anymore, and who is dead set against metal in any form.

I disagree, how do you think she got back in time in the first place? John only had the one time machine, and I doubt he'd send anyone back he didn't trust in any paralelle timeline

Have you even been watching this show? Future scenes showed that Jesse picked Riley from one of the resistance hideouts. If she was an terminator sent by Skynet, it's unlikely that she would've infiltrated the base, taken Riley back to Skynet, and then time traveled. I realize her being friends with one of the TDE technicians and secretly using the TDE does sound implausible, but it's just the lack of thought put into things by the writers, not proof that she's a terminator.

Plus, there's no way that Riley choking Jesse would've affected her at all, and if Jesse were a terminator, the fight would've been over in two seconds.

I'll never get why people have this strange desire to think everyone is a terminator, especially on a show that is so largely transparent about the behavior of terminators.

yes, actually, I did miss a good chunk of this season due to a move and Dish being douches, and I never said she was metal, just that she was under SKYnet control

 

[Ryan8bit]

Ok, but even having a chip in her head just really seems beyond what's going on here. Jesse's reasoning and actions don't seem far-fetched enough to think that she has a chip in her head from Skynet. Since Skynet's mission has always been one of killing John, Jesse could have done that at any time. Or Riley could have done it for her. It's pretty clear that she is just psychologically manipulating people to try and make John less sympathetic to the machines. That way not as many of her friends and comrades would have died when a terminator malfunctioned. It seems like a pretty strange reason to travel through time for, but the writers don't really dwell on that kind of thing.