T-1000 Makes Ensign

[Captain McBain]

Assuming that the T-1000 could be trusted, would Picard and company consider it to be a more resourceful member of the crew than Data?

Woud Sisko and the gang consider it more useful than Odo?

Would Janeway and friends...more useful than the EMH?

 

[Trekker4747]

Tell the bartender to cut you off.

 

[Captain McBain]

I don't drink.

 

[Pavonis]

Aren't you going to ask whether Data could beat the T-1000?

 

[Silvercrest]

Assuming that the T-1000 could be trusted

You lost me here.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Assuming that the T-1000 could be trusted, would Picard and company consider it to be a more resourceful member of the crew than Data?

Woud Sisko and the gang consider it more useful than Odo?

Would Janeway and friends...more useful than the EMH?

What resources does it have that Data lacks?

What uses does it have?

 

[Quantum_Penguin]

In a 20th or 21st century context, T-1000 would have distinct, fearsome advantages over the average person, and the average mechanoid, which is the basis for much of the dramatic tension in T2. In addition to enhanced strength and the advanced processing capacity of a machine intelligence, he can blend into any situation undetected and is nigh indestructible, unless you have a convenient metal foundry nearby. This would make him seem more useful than poor old copper-skinned Data who can barely pass for "French" in the 19th century.

However, in the 24th century, when everybody has a portable scanning device and is packing enough power to vaporize solid rock, T-1000's advantages over Data disappear. Unlike a founder who has the advantage of being made of organic protoplasm, T-1000 would be conspicuous on a tricorder as a mass of metal, meaning he would be easily tracked. Furthermore, he can't ooze through a forcefield and could be vaporized by a hand phaser. Not that Data would fare any better, but T-1000 would have no advantages over him then. The only exception would be infiltration and observation of a pre-contact culture, but even then all you need apparently is a duck blind, a holosuit and a good sense of balance so you don't knock anything over.

 

[Gaith]

Verily, this question freezeth, shattereth, rebuildeth, and then melteth my brain.

 

[Captain McBain]

Aren't you going to ask whether Data could beat the T-1000?

No. In a H2H fight, with or without prep for Data, and the T-1000 eventually destroys him. If you give prep for Data and weapons then I'd certainly go with him. Even if the T-1000 is also given a phaser I think that Data could dodge his attacks, whereas the T-1000 never showed that sort of ability.

By the way, if you don't like my questions, feel free not to respond.

Assuming that the T-1000 could be trusted

You lost me here.

If the T-1000 couldn't be trusted, then it wouldn't be on these ships/space station to begin with. I wrote the sentence so people didn't write, "Pointless question since the T-1000 would just start killing everyone, and then it'd get beamed into the brig before anyone could evaluate its abilities."

Assuming that the T-1000 could be trusted, would Picard and company consider it to be a more resourceful member of the crew than Data?

Woud Sisko and the gang consider it more useful than Odo?

Would Janeway and friends...more useful than the EMH?

What resources does it have that Data lacks?

What uses does it have?

The T-1000 can shapeshift, is much more durable than Data, and is arguably stronger. Of course, Data, the EMH, and Odo can do things that the T-1000 can't.

In a 20th or 21st century context, T-1000 would have distinct, fearsome advantages over the average person, and the average mechanoid, which is the basis for much of the dramatic tension in T2. In addition to enhanced strength and the advanced processing capacity of a machine intelligence, he can blend into any situation undetected and is nigh indestructible, unless you have a convenient metal foundry nearby. This would make him seem more useful than poor old copper-skinned Data who can barely pass for "French" in the 19th century.

However, in the 24th century, when everybody has a portable scanning device and is packing enough power to vaporize solid rock, T-1000's advantages over Data disappear. Unlike a founder who has the advantage of being made of organic protoplasm, T-1000 would be conspicuous on a tricorder as a mass of metal, meaning he would be easily tracked. Furthermore, he can't ooze through a forcefield and could be vaporized by a hand phaser. Not that Data would fare any better, but T-1000 would have no advantages over him then. The only exception would be infiltration and observation of a pre-contact culture, but even then all you need apparently is a duck blind, a holosuit and a good sense of balance so you don't knock anything over.

Thanks for the good answer.

 

[Trekker4747]

The T-1000 can shapeshift, is much more durable than Data, and is arguably stronger.

I'm going to call a "not so much" in the durability department when it comes to the T-1000. Now, granted, the T-1000 can take a lot more physical damage than Data (it absorbs an impact and is able to instantly repair it) but there's one area in which Data is clearly superior to the T-1000. Cold.

In T2 we see the T-1000 while being doused with liquid nitrogen freezes (something you have to worry about when your mass is made of liquid.) Liquid Nitrogen is at around 320 and 340 degrees below Fahrenheit. We've seen that Data can survive in the vacuum of space. Which is that cold and COLDER. Now there's a lot of quibbles here when we get into temperatures of space, temperatures in a vacuum and such, but overall we see Data surviving in the cold vacuum of space, we see the T-1000 freeze to a solid in LNi. (The freezing, melting and reforming also caused the T-1000 to have errors in his matrix during the climax of the film.) This means that the T-1000 carries with it all of the fallbacks of being a liquid. (In actuality he'd probably be more likely to BOIL in space than freeze.) Which can give Data a pretty good advantage.

Which sort of brings us to the bigger problem.

The T-1000 is, effectively, magic. He was designed purely to "look cool" and to pose a threat greater than the Arnold Terminator (T-800.) He's an effective machine that can morph it's mass into any shape or form it wants but at the same time is a "machine" while also being "alive" enough to time-travel. We could quibble on what he is, nanotechnology delivered in a "living skin" cocoon, whatever. But considering what we see him capable of and doing he's "magic."

Compare this to Data who is very much "advanced technology" he has circuits, motors, servos, pistons, pumps and has to run off some sort of "fuel." He's a more "real world" device -much like the T-800.

Which is the one problem I have with T-2 the "memeticalloy" the T-1000 is a bit too much to accept. It was handled a bit better in T3 where it was used more of a "skin" over an actual machine which makes more sense and is a tad easier to accept.

So it's hard to really say who would win-out here in any contest. The T-1000 was very much designed to be capable of almost anything (short of mimicking bombs or guns) in order to drive the suspense of the plot. He's a fucking ball of goo that can spread himself out incredibly thin in order to make a seamless transition on a linoleum floor while also keeping the properties of that material (The officer's shoes squeak on the T-1000 like he was actually made of linoleum) and then able to make an incredibly sharp, metal, stabbing weapon. He's actually one big blob made of MacGuffinium.

Love T2, but you have to admit, the T-1000 makes no sense, thankfully the movie is good enough to make up for that.

Data, however, as inconsistent as his abilities could be was still a machine and at least had those limitations that were held mostly consistent.

 

[Captain McBain]

The T-1000 can shapeshift, is much more durable than Data, and is arguably stronger.

I'm going to call a "not so much" in the durability department when it comes to the T-1000. Now, granted, the T-1000 can take a lot more physical damage than Data (it absorbs an impact and is able to instantly repair it) but there's one area in which Data is clearly superior to the T-1000. Cold.

In T2 we see the T-1000 while being doused with liquid nitrogen freezes (something you have to worry about when your mass is made of liquid.) Liquid Nitrogen is at around 320 and 340 degrees below Fahrenheit. We've seen that Data can survive in the vacuum of space. Which is that cold and COLDER. Now there's a lot of quibbles here when we get into temperatures of space, temperatures in a vacuum and such, but overall we see Data surviving in the cold vacuum of space, we see the T-1000 freeze to a solid in LNi. (The freezing, melting and reforming also caused the T-1000 to have errors in his matrix during the climax of the film.) This means that the T-1000 carries with it all of the fallbacks of being a liquid. (In actuality he'd probably be more likely to BOIL in space than freeze.) Which can give Data a pretty good advantage.

Which sort of brings us to the bigger problem.

The T-1000 is, effectively, magic. He was designed purely to "look cool" and to pose a threat greater than the Arnold Terminator (T-800.) He's an effective machine that can morph it's mass into any shape or form it wants but at the same time is a "machine" while also being "alive" enough to time-travel. We could quibble on what he is, nanotechnology delivered in a "living skin" cocoon, whatever. But considering what we see him capable of and doing he's "magic."

Compare this to Data who is very much "advanced technology" he has circuits, motors, servos, pistons, pumps and has to run off some sort of "fuel." He's a more "real world" device -much like the T-800.

Which is the one problem I have with T-2 the "memeticalloy" the T-1000 is a bit too much to accept. It was handled a bit better in T3 where it was used more of a "skin" over an actual machine which makes more sense and is a tad easier to accept.

So it's hard to really say who would win-out here in any contest. The T-1000 was very much designed to be capable of almost anything (short of mimicking bombs or guns) in order to drive the suspense of the plot. He's a fucking ball of goo that can spread himself out incredibly thin in order to make a seamless transition on a linoleum floor while also keeping the properties of that material (The officer's shoes squeak on the T-1000 like he was actually made of linoleum) and then able to make an incredibly sharp, metal, stabbing weapon. He's actually one big blob made of MacGuffinium.

Love T2, but you have to admit, the T-1000 makes no sense, thankfully the movie is good enough to make up for that.

Data, however, as inconsistent as his abilities could be was still a machine and at least had those limitations that were held mostly consistent.

Yeah, T2 is fiction, so it's not surprising that one of its characters is capable of doing fantastic things. The T-1000's abilities are similar to a changeling's, the differences being that the changeling's shapeshifting prowess is more impressive, and the changeling is organic.

Maybe I missed something, but do you also consider changelings to be "magical?"

 

[Trekker4747]

Maybe I missed something, but do you also consider changelings to be "magical?"

The Changelings being an organic being lessens the "magic" to some degree, but not 100%. There's all forms of organic life, even gooey, jelly-like organic life. So it's not too much a stretch there.

But the "technology" of the T-1000 strains things a bit because it raises a LOT of questions, whys and hows. Especially given the likely limitations of technology in a post-apocalyptic world. What, in the span of maybe a few years the "machines" in the Terminator future go from making mechanical machines covered in living tissue to making a "living" semi-solid alloy that can take any form it wants and precisely emulate the properties of any material it wants? Ehhhh....

 

[Nerys Myk]

What resources does it have that Data lacks?

What uses does it have?

The T-1000 can shapeshift, is much more durable than Data, and is arguably stronger. Of course, Data, the EMH, and Odo can do things that the T-1000 can't.

How does that impact on the job Data does on the Enterprise?

 

[Trekker4747]

What resources does it have that Data lacks?

What uses does it have?

The T-1000 can shapeshift, is much more durable than Data, and is arguably stronger. Of course, Data, the EMH, and Odo can do things that the T-1000 can't.

How does that impact on the job Data does on the Enterprise?

Wellm the T-1000 could have more than one hand and operate the console faster.

 

[Neroon]

I think you've had enough fun with these fluff kinds of threads haven't you? We're all for creativity, but this really doesn't seem to be it. The next time you want to start a topic try putting something more into it that the usual random loose association of TNG characters with whatever other characters are within reach.