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Surely the alternate timeline begins before Nero arrives?

But if Spock Prime isn't "our" Spock, it totally kills the whole point of his cameo. Leonard Nimoy playing an old Spock that isn't the same Spock he played from "The Cage" through to STVI and "Unification", but is actually a totally different guy? I don't think so.
 
It's all Star Trek. There is no "time line" and no "alternate timelines." The events of one series do not flow historically from previous series. Events and designs are created as the current movie or series demands and worked in with previous versions to the extent deemed desirable or necessary.

There is, of course, a chronology of years in which the various stories are asserted to take place. The years in which JJTrek are supposed to take place are simultaneous with the years in which other events in earlier shows and movies are supposed to have taken place, and appear to contradict some of those events. An explanation is offered within the movie: the fictional "timeline" has been changed by contamination from the fictional future. Every viewer is entitled to take that as seriously as they like, or ignore it altogether.
 
The obvious intent of the movie is for the Prime Universe to remain unchanged; for Old Spock to be "the" Spock we all know and love; and for the new universe to be a playground for future stories that has enough similarities to the Prime U that we'll care about what happens, and enough differences to keep things fresh and unexpected.

Crab all you want, but that's what happened.
 
Any connection between the 09 movie and the old continuity is just window dressing. For all intents and purposes, the movie is a reboot. Don't try to fit it into the old Star Trek's framework because it simply can't fit and isn't supposed to.
 
Dennis said:
Set Harth said:
Dennis said:
The events of one series do not flow historically from previous series.
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They're meant to. TNG was meant to be in the same continuity as TOS.
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We're meant to accept these stories as taking place within an historical framework. They do not. They're television shows, and previous continuity can be and has been ignored.
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Aww come on now, Dennis! Same can be said for two episodes in the same series. Heck, it can be said for two scenes in the same episode.
 
Oso Blanco said:
Dukhat said:
Er, no. Enterprise took place in the Prime timeline and wasn't an alternate universe (as much as I would like to think it was...).
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According do Brannon Braga it was set in an alternate timeline. In the original timeline, Zefrem Cochrane didn't have help from the future and there was no Borg Sphere burried under artic ice ... and no "Regeneration".

In the original timeline - the one where Cochrane didn't know anything about the future - the NX-01 probably had a different name and a different design. At least that would explain why we had never ever heard of this Enterprise before.
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Braga's "aternate timeline" excuse for Enterprise came about after the second season when too many continuity errors were stacking up, so he used this to try and wipe the slate clean and explain the recent Borg episode Regeneration. Also, some believe it was also an attempt at creating drama for the Xindi storyline in the coming third season by making the audience believe "anything could happen." I doubt it was the original intention that Enterprise was supposed to be an alternate timeline, and certainly by the time Manny Coto took over in the fourth it became very clear that he considered it the same timeline as the other shows.

Besides, if Enterprise were an alternate timeline, than TATV (a Braga co-written episode) wouldn't have been possible, and if the Borg's presence in the 21st century had any impact on the timeline, there should have been a noticeable difference in the DS9 and Voyager episodes which aired after First Contact's theatrical release.
 
The Wormhole said:
Braga's "aternate timeline" excuse for Enterprise came about after the second season when too many continuity errors were stacking up, so he used this to try and wipe the slate clean and explain the recent Borg episode Regeneration. Also, some believe it was also an attempt at creating drama for the Xindi storyline in the coming third season by making the audience believe "anything could happen." I doubt it was the original intention that Enterprise was supposed to be an alternate timeline, and certainly by the time Manny Coto took over in the fourth it became very clear that he considered it the same timeline as the other shows.

Besides, if Enterprise were an alternate timeline, than TATV (a Braga co-written episode) wouldn't have been possible, and if the Borg's presence in the 21st century had any impact on the timeline, there should have been a noticeable difference in the DS9 and Voyager episodes which aired after First Contact's theatrical release.
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TATV was an alternate timeline alright. Didn't you see how fat everyone had become all of a sudden?
 
JarodRussell said:
The Wormhole said:
Braga's "aternate timeline" excuse for Enterprise came about after the second season when too many continuity errors were stacking up, so he used this to try and wipe the slate clean and explain the recent Borg episode Regeneration. Also, some believe it was also an attempt at creating drama for the Xindi storyline in the coming third season by making the audience believe "anything could happen." I doubt it was the original intention that Enterprise was supposed to be an alternate timeline, and certainly by the time Manny Coto took over in the fourth it became very clear that he considered it the same timeline as the other shows.

Besides, if Enterprise were an alternate timeline, than TATV (a Braga co-written episode) wouldn't have been possible, and if the Borg's presence in the 21st century had any impact on the timeline, there should have been a noticeable difference in the DS9 and Voyager episodes which aired after First Contact's theatrical release.
Click to expand...

TATV was an alternate timeline alright. Didn't you see how fat everyone had become all of a sudden?
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Yeah, and the fact that TATV didn't fit into the events of "The Pegasus" pretty much AT ALL.:) ALTERNATE UNIVERSE!!!:p
 
Pretty soon we'll be at the "I don't like line 239 of episode 105, it's an alternate universe!" stage.

Oops - never mind;).
 
ChristmasDaniel said:
Pretty soon we'll be at the "I don't like line 239 of episode 105, it's an alternate universe!" stage.

Oops - never mind;).
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Hey dude, Spock never wore a Christmas hat or had a Christmas tree on the bridge. Don't make me say that you're from an ALTERNATE UNIVERSE!!! too...:p
 
Dukhat said:
ChristmasDaniel said:
Pretty soon we'll be at the "I don't like line 239 of episode 105, it's an alternate universe!" stage.

Oops - never mind;).
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Hey dude, Spock never wore a Christmas hat or had a Christmas tree on the bridge. Don't make me say that you're from an ALTERNATE UNIVERSE!!! too...:p
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If course it did! It's a clip from the rarely shown Star Trek christmas special!! Don't you know anything heathen! ;)
 
Capt_Pickirk said:
Dukhat said:
Hey dude, Spock never wore a Christmas hat or had a Christmas tree on the bridge. Don't make me say that you're from an ALTERNATE UNIVERSE!!! too...:p
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If course it did! It's a clip from the rarely shown Star Trek christmas special!! Don't you know anything heathen! ;)
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Wouldn't you know it. You buy the remasted DVD box sets and the Christmas special is missing! ;)

You had me worried Daniel. For a minute there I thought a Christmas tree was commanding the Enterprise!
 
-Brett- said:
Don't try to fit it into the old Star Trek's framework because it simply can't fit and isn't supposed to.
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Even though its approach to time travel could be seen as some kind of "reboot", it is supposed to otherwise fit with the previous film/series continuity.

Dennis said:
We're meant to accept these stories as taking place within an historical framework
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Then maybe we should do what we're meant to do.

Dennis said:
They do not.
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Are you telling me Star Trek isn't real? WHY DIDN'T SOMEONE TELL ME THIS YEARS AGO??????? AAAAAUUUUUUUGGGGHHHHHH!!!!!!!:scream:
 
Set Harth said:
They're meant to. TNG was meant to be in the same continuity as TOS.
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There was a strong movement in 1980 where fans tried to convince other fans that ST:TMP, with its different uniforms, new aliens, new ship, drydock, a Spock who'd turned his back on humanity, bony-crested Klingons, a Kirk who accepted promotion to a desk job and McCoy leaving Starfleet, was set in an alternate universe.
 
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