Supergirl - Season Four

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by Unaired Kai "the spy" TV Pilot, Jul 17, 2018.

  1. Ovation

    Ovation Vice Admiral Admiral

    I’ve used it in class. Very effective at generating discussion across a host of topics.
    It’s satire, not a documentary. :rolleyes:
     
  2. JD

    JD Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I think it was one of those cases where it was best to not think about it to much, and just go with it.
    To give you an idea of the approach it took, there was one segment that was basically a slavery version of QVC with the hosts discusses the slaves like they do the products on there, and another was a Cops style show where they chase down escaped slaves.
     
  3. Charles Phipps

    Charles Phipps Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Most likely if the South had won they would have either become the North Korea of their time or created a racial caste system that wasn't slavery but still horrific racial brutality.
     
  4. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    If it's presenting itself as a faux documentary rather than pure fantasy, then that implies an obligation to depict its subject as authentically as a real documentary. If it's just making up random, bad history instead of using alternate history to provide insights into real historical patterns and processes, then it's just empty sensationalism and I have no interest in "going with it."

    I mean, the single most basic thing about the Confederacy is that they wanted to be separate from the rest of the US. They saw themselves as a distinct culture and the Northern states as outsiders. So if someone doesn't get that they wanted to split from the US rather than conquering the whole thing, then they've misunderstood one of the most basic facts about the CSA and the reasons for the war, and that renders the entire exercise invalid from the start.
     
  5. Samurai8472

    Samurai8472 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    "Captain Girl?"
    "Super Marvel?"


    [​IMG]


    Looks like that coffee cup found work after Game of Thrones lol
     
  6. JanewayRulz!

    JanewayRulz! Vice Admiral Admiral

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    The alien amnesty act was repealed, so legal aliens like Dreamer's mom would no longer be legal. Brainy even feared what would happen to his friends and fellow aliens if Lockwood got his hands on the alien registry.

    Lockwood was also guilty of making up crimes in order to arrest Dreamer.



    Lockwood: You are guilty of using an illegal and seditious broadcast to incite violence.

    James: All I see are journalists exercising their right to freedom of speech and doing their duty to uphold the freedom of press.

    Dreamer: S'mores are my favorite desert but I will always choose salty over sweet. :shrug:



    Yup... thats pretty seditious. And while claiming to be a Griffindor may not incite people to violence, being of the house Stark might. :cool:

    Aliens... refugees. Its all in your POV.



    Refugee or not, Monitor or Anti-monitor, this is what intrigues me for season 5 and what it portends for Lena and Kara.



    Even if we lose Lena and Kara... at least we have Kara and Alex again.



    Always. :bolian:

    As for RL politics, :brickwall:

    2018

    Department of Homeland Security Secretary Kirstjen Nielsen said at a June 18 press briefing: “The Obama administration, the Bush administration all separated families. … They did — their rate was less than ours, but they absolutely did do this. This is not new.”

    Nielsen went on to explain that there is indeed something new, as we wrote in another article on this topic. Under a “zero tolerance policy” on illegal immigration announced by Attorney General Jeff Sessions in early April, the administration is now referring all illegal border crossings for criminal prosecution. By doing that, parents have been separated from their children, because children can’t be held in detention facilities for adu
    lts.


    https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...tion-separate-families-immigration/728060002/
     
  7. Jason Voorhees

    Jason Voorhees Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Well they were sort of following the mirror universe concept you see on Trek were the world despite changes still sort of feels like a more twisted version of our reality than a whole new thing. I wouldn't say it was empty sensationalism but it does want to entertain people but with some relevant social commentary added into it.

    Jason
     
  8. theenglish

    theenglish Vice Admiral Admiral

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    But the difference is that the current administration is using it as a selling point and bragging about it. White Nationalism rhetoric is used throughout this administrations speeches. And immigrants are identified as evil hordes and invaders based on where they come from and the color of their skin.

    Throughout U.S. history, whenever the country (probably most countries but I couldn't say that without doing my research) has turned inward and protectionist like this, it has led to dire consequences. What we are living through now is history repeating itself because of an ignorance of the past.
     
  9. theenglish

    theenglish Vice Admiral Admiral

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    It would have been interesting but it might have been a disservice to. Following the Civil War the U.S. was on the verge of true progressive change until the Jim Crow laws were implemented. This lead to decades of cruelty and horrofic actions institutionalized in the culture that we have never escaped from. In many ways, what the U.S. is dealing with today is the result of what happened in the twentieth century rather than the nineteenth century.

    Now, wouldn't it be interesting to see a show about what would have happened if the Crow Era had not occurred?

    As far as television series based on books go, I think it is interesting that we don't see attacks on The Handmaid's Tale when it is very much speculative fiction about what could happen quite easily in the current political climate. It is interesting that even Pat Robertson, who was one of the inspirations for the novel, is saying the recent abortion decisions have gone too far.
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2019
  10. Jason Voorhees

    Jason Voorhees Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Having some Jim Crow laws still in place is what I think the show would have looked like in the show. It wouldn't be about plantations and all that stuff. I think for example people would have freedom of movement of some sort. You would see civil rights groups. I also kind of wondering if some of this stuff is actually going to be explored in this new "Watchmen" show on HBO. It's a show that from the feeling I get is going to be tackling racism. I think HBO kind of wants one these very topical type of shows and when the alternate civil war show fell through they then went to this new "Watchmen" idea.

    Jason
     
  11. theenglish

    theenglish Vice Admiral Admiral

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    That's interesting about the new Watchmen series.

    I think what surprises me about the reaction to Supergirl is all the people that say politics has no place in a science fiction show. That's like up here in Canada a few years ago. Neil Young was protesting the tar sands fields (politically name changed to oil sands the same way global warming became climate change) and the government was saying that musicians should stick to music and not get involved in politics. I mean this was Neil Young! whose entire career is based on political statements.
     
    Greg Cox likes this.
  12. Charles Phipps

    Charles Phipps Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Maybe Neil would have liked the Nobel Prize more than Bob Dylan.
     
  13. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    In the lap of squalor I assure you.
    If the registry was beyond top secret, then how did the Aliens who gained Amnesty prove that they had Amnesty and they weren't just holding fraudulent paperwork and lying about their immigration status?
     
  14. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Now, that would be a much better alternate history. The problem with "What if the South had won?" is that, in many ways, they did. They lost the immediate fight and had to give up slavery, but after Lincoln's assassination, Johnson reversed a lot of the intended reforms, the powerful and wealthy Southern families all recovered their status within a generation, Jim Crow was put into place to keep black Americans oppressed, and an extensive propaganda campaign was successfully waged to rehabilitate the South's image and make their rebellion and treason in the name of slavery seem like a romantic struggle for sovereignty. And now we have an overt white supremacist president in the White House. The Confederacy lost the war, but won the aftermath.
     
  15. Charles Phipps

    Charles Phipps Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Slavery is still gone but I think every American needs to be reminded the Statue of Liberty was gifted to us because of its destruction.

    It's very much a symbol of the world giving us a cookie for that.
     
  16. Jason Voorhees

    Jason Voorhees Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I always think the issue with politics is only when they get heavy handed and preachy. Having politics or anything that gives a show some meaning is always good. I also think people prefer it when you see a show provide insight into both perspectives in a fair way. Clearly a show is going to always favor a side and it will usually be the liberal side but people do notice strawman arguments. Even if a writer doesn't agree with something it's always best if they at least try and justify the other augment for the sake of good drama.

    The writers who can go heavy handed and still be great are few. Not everyone is on the level of Aaron Sorkin for example. He gets away with it because his characters are always smart and witty. Half of the fun is just listening to them talk and the quick exchanges between characters. His walk and talks on "West Wing" were always brilliant. Not to mention speeches and monologues. Only person as good at giving a speech than Picard back in the day was President Bartlett.


    Jason
     
  17. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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  18. Charles Phipps

    Charles Phipps Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I recommend the documentary on Netflix.

    I'm well aware of the abuses of the prison system but I think downplaying the changes worked is also a huge disservice to those who fought and died for it.
     
  19. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    I think it's a greater disservice to pretend the fight is over. Many people are still dying from institutional racism every day.
     
  20. Greg Cox

    Greg Cox Admiral Premium Member

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    Exactly. DC has a big new "Leviathan" event coming up that, as far as I know, has nothing to do with Talia. So I wouldn't necessarily expect a connection to ARROW's Talia. Chances are, SUPERGIRL is taking its inspiration from the new Leviathan in the SUPERMAN comics rather than an old BATMAN storyline from several years ago.