STD Future Seasons Shorter?

[Grendelsbayne]

26 is insane. It just doesn't work that way anymore.

Having said that - yeah, 10 is a tight story, but every time I get to the end of Game of Thrones I think 'It's over already?". 13 is a good number. Or even 15 or so, if the story would benefit from it.

In the end, of course, every show is different. Maybe this show really will be better at 10 than 13. It's hard to even guess based on how little we know right now.

 

[Jedi_Master]

Just make the episodes count.

That's the key. Sherlock only has three 90 minute episodes per season, but each is movie quality, and worthy of multiple repeat views.
If Trek were that good, I would be happy to see less episodes.

 

[The Wormhole]

26 is insane. It just doesn't work that way anymore.

Truth be told, even by the mid-90s the Star Treks were the only shows on TV still doing 26 episodes a season. Everyone else had scaled down to 22-24. The fact that Star Trek continued to do 26 episodes a season until 2003 is very unusual.

 

[Ghislaine H. B. BRAEME]

Well, Voyager was composed of 26 episodes from s2 to s7 (only the 1st season was shorter, with 16 episodes) and let's be honest, about half of them was often a total waste, what gave us something like 10 or 13 really interesting to watch (especially all 2 parts episodes, except Endgame -> the first part was watchable and the second one... ). So yes, to make 10 to 13 episodes per season seems a good plan, especially if there is guiding thread around which, the main characters and aliens may be stuck.

Anyway, if you look Fuller's entire work, you will see that on all his shows (4), were composed of 13 episodes. However, all of them were relatively short too: Wonderfalls (2004) ran only 1 season, Dead Like Me (2003) ran 2 seasons like Pushing Daisies (2007) and Hannibal (2013) ran 3 seasons.
It will be interesting to see if Bryan Fuller will manage to meet the requirements of CBS and Paramount... .

One thing is certain. Star Trek: Discovery will be a complete success or a total flop. There will be no middle ground and in accepting to produce Discovery, Fuller
accepted a big challenge: to make something new and modern, in maintaining the spirit of Star Trek and Roddenberry. And with only 13 then 10 episodes, the only special effects risk not to be enough to cover up the inadequacies in script writing of stories, character development and unconvincing performances.

 

[Rahul]

Call me old-schooled, but I would have preffered a "one episode = one story" approach. That's obviously not what they are going for, they are doing the "one season = one story, with cliffhangers at the end of each episode"-approach that all streaming shows tend to do.

I fear we will have a very strong first (and maybe second) season, and then go downhill fast when the producers don't know how to fill a 10-hour story later, as has happened with almost all surprise hits streaming shows...

 

[OpenMaw]

Call me old-schooled, but I would have preffered a "one episode = one story" approach. That's obviously not what they are going for, they are doing the "one season = one story, with cliffhangers at the end of each episode"-approach that all streaming shows tend to do.

They've said each episode will be a contained story with bits that feed into the main arc.

 

[Lord Garth]

Story arcs work. For multiple seasons. The vast majority of episodes have a beginning, middle, and end but there's an over-arching storyline.

Exhibit A. Mad Men
Exhibit B. Breaking Bad
Exhibit C. Better Call Saul
Exhibit D. Orange Is the New Black
Exhibit E. Halt & Catch Fire (less people have seen it but it keeps getting better)
Exhibit F. I haven't seen it (yet) but Game of Thrones (from what I've heard)

On the other hand, when it comes to Battlestar Galactica, I have to cut it off after Season 3.

 

[RJDiogenes]

Unfortunately, later seasons will probably be 10-13 episodes with a story arc, since that's what's fashionable. I'd prefer to see longer seasons with strong standalone stories. That's why the original series became iconic. The variety of ideas and imagery and iconography-- like a set of modern fables.

 

[The Wormhole]

Well, Voyager was composed of 26 episodes from s2 to s7 (only the 1st season was shorter, with 16 episodes)

That depends on how you want to look at it. Voyager's second season really only had 22 episodes written and produced, however, four episodes produced for the first season (The 37s, Projections, Elogium, Twisted) and withheld until the second season. In fact, in some countries the seasons were even broadcast in the manner they were produced, which means they end up with The 37s being the first season finale as opposed to the second season premiere.

 

[Ghislaine H. B. BRAEME]

That depends on how you want to look at it. Voyager's second season really on had 22 episodes written and produced, however, four episodes produced for the first season (The 37s, Projections, Elogium, Twisted) and withheld until the second season. In fact, in some countries the seasons were even broadcast in the manner they were produced, which means they end up with The 37s being the first season finale as opposed to the second season premiere.

Oh thanks for the info, The Wormhole!
I live in France and my comment was based on the content of DVD box set for each season.

 

[The Wormhole]

Oh thanks for the info, The Wormhole!
I live in France and my comment was based on the content of DVD box set for each season.

Sounds like France got the first two seasons in the same way they were broadcast in America. I know Britain had the other way I spoke of, and I think Australia did too.

 

[Shalashaska]

Whatever the people who are making the show thinks is best. In that case, it's 10.

13 is fine though, I guess. It's not too short as 10 episodes can feel, but it's not stretching it too thin. I would still prefer 10-episode seasons from now after season 1 though.

 

[JayTheTrekkie]

13 episodes is fine with me. A little better than 10 episodes.

26 episodes was a lot. Took too long for a season with 26 episodes to finish.

I would have voted more than 13, less than 26 but I voted for 13.

15 would be ok too and perhaps 18 or up to 20 would be fine too.

 

[Borgminister]

Any episodes at all is nice, but were it up to me, somewhere between 15 and 18, since I think the level of quality and interest can be held to that point.

 

[m.lp.ql.m]

"..then shalt thou count to ten, no more, no less. Ten shall be the number thou shalt count, and the number of the counting shall be ten. Eleven shalt thou not count, neither count thou nine, excepting that thou then proceed to ten. Twelve is right out."

 

[Hugo Rune]

Anyone that thinks that 10 episodes is not enough didn't pay close enough attention to Stranger Things. It's all about structure and pacing. 8 episodes long, each one incrementally adding to the depth of the characters whilst still pushing the story forward.

So far I think from Fuller's Ouvre, Hannibal would have been a great format to follow - for the first two seasons each episode was (mostly) singular stories, slowly pushing out an arc as it ran for it's 13 episodes. Each episode had meaning to developing the characters and each episode drove the overall narrative one step further. And given how he has described it thus far, I would suggest this is how the show will run, for its first season at least.

Personally I would prefer the likes of S3 Hannibal. Not to say that each of the two stories told were as successful as each other, but I liked how two distinctive styles and tones were played with, longer more involved separate stories, building and paying off at the end. Cross-pollinate that with what Manny Coto tried to do with Enterprise S4, longer stories interspersed with stand-alones and I think they could have a winning forumla (for me).

10 episodes, 3 "two-parters" to make the show feel bigger and four singular episodes, palate fresheners - where experimental, more traditional Trek stories could be told.

But I think we'll get the S1-2 Hannibal format. Which is fine by me because it worked beautifully.

Hugo - more excited that Fuller has another show on the air than it being a Star Trek show

 

[JoeP]

I want there to be as many as Fuller feels is necessary to tell the stories he wants to tell. If it means the number differs from year to year, so be it.

 

[Rahul]

They've said each episode will be a contained story with bits that feed into the main arc.

That would be nice! Where did you hear that? I only remember a comment à la "it's one big story, and each episode is akin to a chapter in this story".

I think 13 episodes is a bit too much for a single story, 10 (or even less) would fit much better. For an overarching plot with a few filler-episodes 13 or even more would fit perfectly.

I really liked to episode structure of Enterprise S3 and S4. An since traditionally Star Trek was almost exclusively single, unconnected stories, I think it's much easier to have unconnected "filler" episodes or plots inbetween, or maybe even a 3-episode arc within the larger season arc, where the crew has to deal with a single plot or event before it can move on.

One thing I really like is that apparently each season will have a different larger plot. One thing I noticed with "Lost" or "Battlestar Galactica" (or even Game of Thrones and literally any other "one-story"-television series) is that at one point the creators will run out of ideas and try to forcefully continue a plot that has run it's natural course. This "season-arc" approach allows them to tell a tight story, finish it, and then start the next, completely different story, that is mostly unconnected from the first one, except that it still has the same main characters and ship. Sounds interesting if that's the way they choose.

 

[Four Lights]

No less than 13, but 26 is too much.

I'd rather have two Star Trek series on at the same time. Discovery with 13 episodes and a post-Nemesis show with 13 episodes. Would make 26 Star Trek episodes a year, just like it used to be.

As a lover of trek my instinct would be to say I want as much of it as possible.

If Fuller is the creative genius we all hope he will be, and loves the franchise as much as he says he does, he should seriously consider giving up the other show he is is working on now "American Gods" as soon as possible, in order to dedicate himself fully to Star Trek.

He is essentially doing 26 episodes of work a year already, it's just that it's split between two different products.
With the free time created we could have a second show on air in the same year with the 13 eps as you talking about,
Fuller would be in charge, but there would be different writing and story people for a second show to keep it fresh.

Quality is very very important of course, but 39/42 weeks of the year without any new trek episodes seems a bit much.
Especially when there is a plausible solution to hand that could solve the problem.

 

[kguru]

The number of episodes should be enough to provide new episodes during much of the fall and spring portions of the year. Its probably OK to be around 16 to 18 episodes because there are holiday periods and other time periods where fewer people will be watching. A 16 to 18 episode season would also allow for a few stand alone episodes. Alternatively if the binge model were to be adopted, having a 10 episode season every 6 months would work well, and 6 months later either have a new season, or run a different series. I don't think they should have 2 series arriving on Netflix on the same day, as it would reduce hype and viewing, but there is no reason why at 10 episodes a season, a fall and spring arrival of Star Trek Discovery and some other Star Trek series would work. The idea of 2 seasons a year could also be used to cover more time in universe than in the production world.