No way STC would start something like that. Rabble-rousing is the opposite of their style.
STC Ep. 7: "Embrace The Winds" speculation and discussion....
- Thread starter Warped9
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It's a damned shame Vic isn't the public face of fan productions.
yup... a class act, through and through. It makes me seriously wonder how any of the horror stories and accusations going around the internet a few years back and the oft mentioned fueds between groups, ever got started to begin with. It doesn't seem like Vic's style at all in any way. Always a total professional. I was a little bit late to the party, but even though most of the drama was implied to be with P2, I almost think there were some actions by Peter's included as well? Not trying to bring up old shit or anything; just wondering if we can retroactively pin the last problem on Peter's as well.
It makes it easier to shut down bad apple's in the future, with a legal precedent. Just because they choose not to go after other's, is entirely their perogatory. Its a slim chance, but its a chance.
I think the very best case we can expect is for Continues to be allowed to release Embrace the Winds, Vic says its finished in the video (even if its not totally finished), I think CBS / Paramount would benefit from letting any productions that are either finished or very late in the process be released, so as not to cause further upset amongst fans towards them.
That is the VERY BEST we can expect, and obviously that extends to all productions, Phase 2 has got at least Bread and Savagery, either in post or ready to release.
They at least went through the trouble of becoming an IRS-approved charity, which means if nothing else it's significantly harder for the people to involved to make any profit off it. (Not that I think Vic & Co. would have tried to anyways).
And, not that it matters, again, but it has the full approval of Roddenberry's kid. It just feels like its in a different ball park. I don't know.
Given that Roddenberry played casting couch games, wrote "lyrics" never intended to be used in order to screw Courage out of royalties, put the IDIC badge in an episode so he could flog the heck out of it in mechandising, etc., being "un-Roddenberry" doesn't necessarily strike me as a bad thing.
Given all the hand wringing Vic's composure gives me a sliver of hope.
Quoting Vic Mignogna from STC's FB page;
"Hi everyone, thank you all for your tremendous outpouring of concern and support. First and foremost, we have the utmost respect for CBS and their right to protect their property as they see fit. As soon as we know for sure how the latest developments will impact STC we will most certainly share it with all of you."
"A CBS representative will be on "Engage" the official Star Trek podcast on June 29. At that time, hopefully many questions will be answered, so let's wait and see before jumping to conclusions. If you wish to ask a question, you can do so on their Facebook page."
Quoting Vic Mignogna from STC's FB page;
"Hi everyone, thank you all for your tremendous outpouring of concern and support. First and foremost, we have the utmost respect for CBS and their right to protect their property as they see fit. As soon as we know for sure how the latest developments will impact STC we will most certainly share it with all of you."
"A CBS representative will be on "Engage" the official Star Trek podcast on June 29. At that time, hopefully many questions will be answered, so let's wait and see before jumping to conclusions. If you wish to ask a question, you can do so on their Facebook page."
this is a very well written "At this time, I have no comment".
I guess you could read the CBS rep being on Engage bit, as him saying he expects / knows there will be some more news, but it could also be a way of saying "please hold your questions, I dont have any answers, maybe this CBS rep will answer them"
This whole thing is absurd.
CBS said "If you follow these guidelines, we promise not to sue you." They said nothing about applying those guidelines to current series... they said nothing about applying those guidelines to everyone at all, frankly. There is nothing - ZERO, NADA - that CBS said which even remotely implies that current fan series in production WILL be shut down if they don't follow all the guidelines.
As for the nonsensical theories about how "CBS has to apply their rules equally to all fan films or Axanar will use it as a defense", please see the case law established in Paramount Pictures v. Carol Publishing, 25 F. Supp. 2d 372 S.D.N.Y. 1998.
(Summary: Copyright holders can pick and chose where, and with whom, they enforce their copyrights. They can give "special treatment" to anyone they choose, and it can't be used against them in court. It's their intellectual property.)
Even Buzzed reported a couple days ago, when asked whether the guidelines would apply to current ongoing fan series in production, CBS wouldn't comment.
Read between the lines, people. I think reports of fan films' deaths are greatly exaggerated.
CBS said "If you follow these guidelines, we promise not to sue you." They said nothing about applying those guidelines to current series... they said nothing about applying those guidelines to everyone at all, frankly. There is nothing - ZERO, NADA - that CBS said which even remotely implies that current fan series in production WILL be shut down if they don't follow all the guidelines.
As for the nonsensical theories about how "CBS has to apply their rules equally to all fan films or Axanar will use it as a defense", please see the case law established in Paramount Pictures v. Carol Publishing, 25 F. Supp. 2d 372 S.D.N.Y. 1998.
(Summary: Copyright holders can pick and chose where, and with whom, they enforce their copyrights. They can give "special treatment" to anyone they choose, and it can't be used against them in court. It's their intellectual property.)
Even Buzzed reported a couple days ago, when asked whether the guidelines would apply to current ongoing fan series in production, CBS wouldn't comment.
Read between the lines, people. I think reports of fan films' deaths are greatly exaggerated.
True. However, whenever someone says "If you do X, we promise not to sue you" that usually carries an unstated but very strong implication of "And if you don't do X, we very likely will sue you". And I think the context the guidelines were issued in makes that implication even stronger.
Time will tell if any longtime Trek fan film producers are interested in testing your legal theories regarding these new guidelines.
When the lawsuit first came down on Axanar a lot of us predicted that all the major shows that had taken in big crowdfunding would also get lawsuits or at least a C&D. Now some fans are interpreting that non-action amounts to silent consent? Well, it's much harder to view it that way in lieu of the guidelines. They are living on borrowed time and the only way I'd proceed if I were in their shoes is if I got some sort of official reassurance from CBS/P.
Which could be happening quietly behind-the-scenes or some discussions to that effect.
Copyright or trademark law hasn't changed in any way after CBS/P released their guidelines. Sometimes I get the feeling, this is how those guidelines are received.
Those guidelines are just made transparent now, it's not as if there is anything surprising for anyone with gray matter instead of thin air (or $ signs) between his or her ears.
They had to be made public, so that any Axa-Supporter would understand, why Axanar, the great fully-professional, independent Star Trek movie never will be made. Pity, those guidelines are seen now as crashing waves against the firmament - because, they are not.
Cautious producers of other fan films had either known or listened carefully before when being contacted by CBS/P what can or can't be done. They won't just have to vanish into thin air by the strong will of the IP holders. Those rightful IP holders still reserve their right of what can continue and what can not. No more, no less.
Crowdfunding fan films have always been at risk with their ventures, and Cawley, Mignogna and others have played accordingly. The harm was done by this one guy, who jumped the shark willfully to create his own business. The lawsuit came but it didn't stop the arrogance and ignorance of this one guy who thinks, he can play above the rule (while hiding behind the "but we're no diffenerent than other Elvis impersonators or Voice Actors" argument). So the message had to be sent loud and clear for everyone on the internet. And the internet transports messages very fast.
The whole crowd just has to understand, what really happens here instead of blaming CBS/P for bringing down the fan film community. It's just not what those guidelines mean. It's rather the loudest voices in the crowd (with a certain shark-jumping guy enforing this) who want to tell all the others, CBS/P is the big bad guy in this story, while CBS/P (almost) silently awaits the lawsuit to reach its goal.
I predict, this ship of future fan films productions like STC hasn't sailed, yet. Mr. Cawley, I believe, has closed his shop due to the drama going on behind the scenes of fan film producers. he simply didn't want to waste his time, at least at the moment. He has a professional life, too, besides family and friends.
And re: The STC petition? That's exactly not anything, STC itself would do. They know how to sail through uncertain waters and that such action would do more harm than good to them. The worst case scenario would be that some axaturds would like to provoke the closing of other fan productions by doing exactly that. But that's also just hypothetical, like my whole post.
tl;dr?
Let's wait for the real outcome instead of the outcry.
(But that wouldn't fill our threads, would it? ;-) )
Those guidelines are just made transparent now, it's not as if there is anything surprising for anyone with gray matter instead of thin air (or $ signs) between his or her ears.
They had to be made public, so that any Axa-Supporter would understand, why Axanar, the great fully-professional, independent Star Trek movie never will be made. Pity, those guidelines are seen now as crashing waves against the firmament - because, they are not.
Cautious producers of other fan films had either known or listened carefully before when being contacted by CBS/P what can or can't be done. They won't just have to vanish into thin air by the strong will of the IP holders. Those rightful IP holders still reserve their right of what can continue and what can not. No more, no less.
Crowdfunding fan films have always been at risk with their ventures, and Cawley, Mignogna and others have played accordingly. The harm was done by this one guy, who jumped the shark willfully to create his own business. The lawsuit came but it didn't stop the arrogance and ignorance of this one guy who thinks, he can play above the rule (while hiding behind the "but we're no diffenerent than other Elvis impersonators or Voice Actors" argument). So the message had to be sent loud and clear for everyone on the internet. And the internet transports messages very fast.
The whole crowd just has to understand, what really happens here instead of blaming CBS/P for bringing down the fan film community. It's just not what those guidelines mean. It's rather the loudest voices in the crowd (with a certain shark-jumping guy enforing this) who want to tell all the others, CBS/P is the big bad guy in this story, while CBS/P (almost) silently awaits the lawsuit to reach its goal.
I predict, this ship of future fan films productions like STC hasn't sailed, yet. Mr. Cawley, I believe, has closed his shop due to the drama going on behind the scenes of fan film producers. he simply didn't want to waste his time, at least at the moment. He has a professional life, too, besides family and friends.
And re: The STC petition? That's exactly not anything, STC itself would do. They know how to sail through uncertain waters and that such action would do more harm than good to them. The worst case scenario would be that some axaturds would like to provoke the closing of other fan productions by doing exactly that. But that's also just hypothetical, like my whole post.
tl;dr?
Let's wait for the real outcome instead of the outcry.
(But that wouldn't fill our threads, would it? ;-) )
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This. A thousand times, this.
Further clarification from the other thread related to this topic ^
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