Starship, the proposed 1970s Series

Discussion in 'General Trek Discussion' started by Doctor Jeffrey, Aug 23, 2019.

  1. Maurice

    Maurice Admiral Premium Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2005
    Location:
    One ferry ride from Starfleet HQ
    I thought the whole idea of the I.Q. score was a range from 0 to 200 with the mean average being 100. But then my recollection could be faulty.
     
  2. Lord Garth

    Lord Garth Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    May 7, 2011
    Location:
    Aug 10, 1999
    I've tried looking up information about Starship in the past, ever since I found out Andromeda was a cross between Genesis II and Starship but to no avail. All I know is that Rommie came from Starship. In turn, I figured Zora in "Calypso" (from the Discovery Short Trek) is a new version of that character.

    Then there's a lot of other stuff here that has nothing to do with Starship whatsoever.
     
  3. Doctor Jeffrey

    Doctor Jeffrey Lieutenant Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2019
    The only connection between STARSHIP and ANDROMEDA is a ship controlled by a sentient computer and the idea that the ship is, therefore, alive.

    Have a look at BLAKE'S 7 and then back at ANDROMEDA.
     
  4. Doctor Jeffrey

    Doctor Jeffrey Lieutenant Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2019
    I should have said that, based on what any of us have read about STARSHIP, and knowing what we do about GENESIS II and PLANET EARTH, the only connection between STARSHIP and ANDROMEDA appears to have been the sentient computer/starship. There might have been more developed for STARSHIP in the 70s that made its way into ANDROMEDA, but have a look at BLAKE'S 7 and then decide.
     
  5. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2001
    More likely an independent creation, since of course there have been quite a few sentient ship computers in science fiction. HAL in 2001: A Space Odyssey was clearly an influence on the depiction of Zora as an internally illuminated, disc-shaped camera eye.
     
  6. Professor Zoom

    Professor Zoom Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2004
    Location:
    Idealistic
    Stephen Jay Gould wrote a book regarding tests of intelligence and other qualities. It was called The Mismeasure of Man.

    He held a dim view of IQ tests and scores.
     
  7. Lord Garth

    Lord Garth Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    May 7, 2011
    Location:
    Aug 10, 1999
    I agree with him. You can't reduce someone to a number and let that define them.
     
  8. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2001
    Yeah, that was pretty much it. As discussed earlier in the thread, Majel Roddenberry was developing a separate Starship project for animation contemporaneously with Andromeda, so they were mostly separate concepts.
     
  9. 1001001

    1001001 I Like the Nightlife, Baby! Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2001
    Location:
    The Great Wide Open
    Well, his book was about deliberate fraud committed during tests of minorities and women.
     
  10. Professor Zoom

    Professor Zoom Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2004
    Location:
    Idealistic
    Well, I wouldn't say just deliberate fraud, as I recall, it was also cultural and sexist bias, intentional or not.
    But, it's been awhile since I read it.

    Ultimately, the book isn't in favor of using a single number to describe something as complex as intelligence.
     
    1001001 likes this.
  11. Maurice

    Maurice Admiral Premium Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2005
    Location:
    One ferry ride from Starfleet HQ
    Starship seemed like a super thin concept. Perhaps there was more to it than what we’ve seen, but what we have seen is little more than a basic premise with a ship design attached to it.
     
    Lord Garth likes this.
  12. Lord Garth

    Lord Garth Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    May 7, 2011
    Location:
    Aug 10, 1999
    I'd think after four or five decades, more would've come out about this concept by now if more had been developed.
     
  13. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2001
    We know a good deal of development was done on the animated version(s) with Mainframe and Stan Lee Media in the late '90s and early '00s before it fell through. According to the articles quoted in post #106 of this thread (which I linked to in my previous post), John Semper (showrunner of the classic '90s animated Spider-Man TV series) wrote a full treatment that he developed with Majel Roddenberry. The first iteration of the animated project got at least as far as having animation tests, character models, and production designs, although apparently they were abandoned when Stan Lee and Leiji Matsumoto got involved, with the show being retooled to feature more nonhumanoid characters. That version got at least as far as having storyboards, according to Roddenberry.

    So there was definitely a lot of material that hasn't been made public, at least in the '90s/'00s iteration of the concept. Perhaps the Roddenberry family/production company has held onto it in hopes of taking another stab at making a series out of it someday. Or maybe a lot of the material just fell into limbo when Stan Lee Media went bankrupt.
     
    Lord Garth likes this.
  14. Maurice

    Maurice Admiral Premium Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2005
    Location:
    One ferry ride from Starfleet HQ
    Possibly. As GR was keen to make a buck if there was more to it I suspect it would've been for sale on Star Trek Lincoln Enterprises.
     
    Lord Garth and Serveaux like this.
  15. Spot261

    Spot261 Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2013
    Location:
    spot261
    IQ = intellectual age (as determined by population mean)/chronological age x 100

    Ergo the average score will always be 100 by definition.

    Scores over 200 are possible although exceedingly rare (as in recorded as being in single figures)

    Oh, small detail, the whole thing's bullshit but generates money for psychometric test publishers and MENSA.
     
  16. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2001
    As I recall, when Majel Roddenberry was making her big push to sell GR's concepts in the '90s and early '00s, she was drawing on everything from fully realized pilots and series outlines to cursory notes and half-formed ideas. So Starship may have been closer to the latter.

    Still, if it was far enough along that he'd hired Jefferies to design the ship and tech, it's hard to believe there wasn't a more substantial proposal written down. Unless maybe the design came first and GR tried to build a show around it.
     
  17. Doctor Jeffrey

    Doctor Jeffrey Lieutenant Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2019
    Christopher. I remember your first point, too. Back around the turn of the century Majel Roddenberry said something to the effect of "drawing on everything from fully realized pilots and series outlines to cursory notes and half-formed ideas." And, that the ideas of her new shows were all taken from ideas Gene had been forming in detail in the 70s (although I'm not sure that this was completely true). She adding that if she was stealing, she was "stealing" from Gene, and, therefore, had permission. I do recall her using the word stealing, but using it lightheartedly.

    Your second point might be valid, too. In the 70s there was some discussion that the ring ship was an early design for the Enterprise, and we say that not only in ST TMP, but there are plenty of renderings on the net showing a larger scale ring ship with ENTERPRISE printed on the side of the ship, several levels of windows, and a hanger for a couple of shuttles.

    My own thought is that after Trek Roddenberry liked the idea of a smaller scale show with a small crew on a star ship. Dusting off the ring ship design and adding the Metaflier sphere and the maintenance trolley, meant that the ship design part of the show development was (relatively) inexpensively on its way. If the show was to be about environmental trouble shooters as the one pager stated (and the designation of Enviro-Pod, or E-Pod, on the blueprint indicates), and if the show was intended to follow a path that King Daniel defined so eloquently a few days ago, then the ring ship design would have fit that premise.

    As Christopher said insightfully, "maybe the design came first and GR tried to build a show around it." When the premise was not make into a pilot in the early 70s, GR might have marketed the blueprints and renderings either to make a buck in the mid 70s, or to stoke interest in creating a new series in the late 70s, or both. However, the ecological trouble shooters idea was more in tune with the early 70s than the later 70s and beyond, which was likely a factor in Majel making extensive changes 20 years ago. With climate change and other ecological issues being a big part of current concerns, the ecological trouble shooters portion of the original premise might be timely again.
     
  18. Delta Vega

    Delta Vega Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2011
    Location:
    The Great Barrier
    We built this city
     
  19. Spot261

    Spot261 Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2013
    Location:
    spot261
    On sausage rolls
     
  20. Maurice

    Maurice Admiral Premium Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2005
    Location:
    One ferry ride from Starfleet HQ
    Part and parcel with producing for TV is brainstorming a bunch of show pitches, and most of those are throwaways. You toss them out there and see what sticks. I bet this was just one of many Roddenberry concocted trying to get a network to bite.

    Irwin Allen successfully sold a lot of shows but had quite a few that were little more than pretty pitch decks of concept drawings.