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Star Wars: The Clone Wars 2x15 Senate Murders

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Star Wars: The Clone Wars 2x15 Senate Murders

Morale: "Searching for the truth is easy. Accepting the truth is hard."

Synopsis: When Senator Onaconda Farr dies under suspicious circumstances, Padmé sets out to find the person responsible for the death of her favorite "uncle."

This episode airs Friday March 19, 2010 on Cartoon Network at 9pm.
 
Nice little change of pace episode. The silhouetted assassin in the docks was obviously the Rodian woman though. After this being the first ep in a month after a trilogy of political episodes I'm really chomping at the bit for a proper action episode like "Point Rain", though.
 
Uncle?

It was ok, the story wasn't all that interesting, more of a typical mystery.
 
^^ The uncle was explained in a previous episode.

I was checking the episode guides because I was sure I missed an episode, this one seemed to be part two of something but I guess not.
 
Very good episode. Better than Senate Spy.

Gives you a good look at the Senate here and a strong supporting cast. The Kamino senator was good and I got a kick out of Lt. Divo. He looked like Peter Lorre.

Padme fairs very well here, getting involved the action. The animation of her face during her close-up was quite impressive.

Nice to see Bail Organa get to play such a large role. His character design is excellent.

Suprised to see Satine in this episode. I guess they figured they might use the character again.
 
Interesting episode, it brought up a lot of different issues.

First, Padme looks like an idiot for supporting the Anti-Clone Production Bill. Cutting troop production when you do not have a clear cut victory on the horizon seems idiotic to me. If the episode had added some additional dialogue about the Seperatists willing to negotiate a diplomatic solution in exchange for a cut in clone production it would have made more sense, but that was not said.

Second, the line about the Kamino cloners exchanging their clones for a senate position was very interesting and opens up all sorts of questions. Who gets to be a senator? Does each world get one senator? Does each race get one senator? Does every senator get an equal vote? Etc etc.
 
Very good episode. Better than Senate Spy.
But not by much. If Senate Spy was an confused Notorious ripoff, this is, uh... well I recognize that the detective was a broad parody of a classic actor but can't pinpoint who (I don't think Peter Lorre, personally).

First, Padme looks like an idiot for supporting the Anti-Clone Production Bill. Cutting troop production when you do not have a clear cut victory on the horizon seems idiotic to me. If the episode had added some additional dialogue about the Seperatists willing to negotiate a diplomatic solution in exchange for a cut in clone production it would have made more sense, but that was not said.
It's not a clearly defined position. There are a lot of good reasons Padme could have had for wanting troop numbers cut - one would be a viable peace alternative (which since the Separatists have been consistently portrayed on the show as downright evil seems absurd), a fear that it would give too much power to the executive branch, or maybe simply questioning the ethics behind a massive clone army.

As I observed in the earlier UK thread for this episode, her commitment to peace is a lot like Santine's: A vaguely defined and mostly incomprehensible ideal that idealists have for some reason.

At least it is an episode that suggests corruption within the Republic (and the extension of the soon-to-be-lethal stormtrooper army); as the seeds for its own downfall should be lain during this period.

Second, the line about the Kamino cloners exchanging their clones for a senate position was very interesting and opens up all sorts of questions.
I assumed that Kamino was not part of the Galactic Republic prior to them building the clone army, but have played their hand at being the source of the Republic's military might to join with a degree of influence.
 
Given that Kamino didn't officially exist in the Jedi Archives in AOTC I'd say it definitely wasn't part of the Republic at the time ;)
 
Given that Kamino didn't officially exist in the Jedi Archives in AOTC I'd say it definitely wasn't part of the Republic at the time ;)
It did exist, the planet was purposefully erased from the records.

Though yes, that it could be erased and nobody gave it a second thought does suggest it wasn't in the Republic.
 
First, Padme looks like an idiot for supporting the Anti-Clone Production Bill. Cutting troop production when you do not have a clear cut victory on the horizon seems idiotic to me. If the episode had added some additional dialogue about the Seperatists willing to negotiate a diplomatic solution in exchange for a cut in clone production it would have made more sense, but that was not said.

I totally agree with this. I wouldn't blame Anakin for blowing his top when he learns about it. Unless the Seperatists are willing to cut their production and talk peace, Padme and her hippie senators are insane for even considering this. Being so close to the Jedi, you would think she knows that the Sith are running the war, along with their resident nut General Grievous and aren't going to surrender. Padme and the hippies position could be a little better defined at the very least.

When he was a member of Congress, Abraham Lincoln was an outspoken critic of the Mexican War. But he continued to vote to supply the troops in the field. Even after what she's seen, Padme isn't even willing to do that.

Now, if Padme and her fellow hippies had objected to the creation of more life to use as cannon fodder for the war, I could have completely sympathized with that.
 
I liked this episode. It was a nice character- and dialogue-driven piece, with lots of witty dialogue from Buffy/Firefly veteran Drew Z. Greenberg. Lt. Tan Divo (is that a Corellian name, given its similarity to "Han Solo"?) was a fun character and he got off some good zingers. It was nice to see Bail Organa and Mon Mothma participating as characters, though it was a bit odd to hear Phil LaMarr's voice coming from a character who looked so much like Jimmy Smits.

My one problem was that C-3PO was mute here. He didn't have a single line. Probably that means Anthony Daniels wasn't available, but it's just out of character for C-3PO to be speechless.


First, Padme looks like an idiot for supporting the Anti-Clone Production Bill.

On the contrary, she looks prophetic. Let's keep the bigger picture in mind: Palpatine/Sidious engineered the entire Separatist movement and Clone Wars in order to build the power base he eventually used to overthrow the Republic and establish the Empire. The breeding of a vast clone army is a key part of Palpatine's scheme to seize power. And I think Amidala was already suspicious of Palpatine's ambitions back in Attack of the Clones, which preceded this series. I think she, Farr, Organa, and Mothma recognize that there may be an ulterior danger in allowing the Clone Army to become too large.

Cutting troop production when you do not have a clear cut victory on the horizon seems idiotic to me.

Maybe the existing troop levels were already large enough according to military analysts, and the request for additional production was seen as an unnecessary waste of resources. After all, the sponsor of the bill to increase troop production was a Kaminoan, a member of the culture that creates the clones. It's no different from a US senator trying to get a plum military contract for a defense contractor in his state, getting hundreds of millions of dollars poured into his state's coffers to produce million-dollar widgets that the military doesn't actually need and that you could get for a buck fifty at the corner hardware store. It's pork-barrel spending. I'm sure the argument of Farr and Amidala's bloc was that Kamino was more interested in its own profit than in the actual military need. And pouring too much money into troop production could've diverted necessary funds from other parts of the war effort such as ship construction, medical aid, refugee aid, etc.
 
It's possible that you're right about troop levels being large enough. I just wish they would have clarified that a little in the story.

Didn't realize that about Threepio but you're right. He didn't say a word.
 
First, Padme looks like an idiot for supporting the Anti-Clone Production Bill.
On the contrary, she looks prophetic.

Nope, she still seems idiotic. It's what I alluded to in my post; you could give her a good reason, but the reason she's in favour of - a vague notion that not increasing troop amounts will allow a peace treaty to be brokered with the Separatists - is dubious in the extreme.

Being right for the wrong reasons still means your reasons are wrong, as it were, and she's prophetic just because the plot is constructed so that she is.
 
Nope, she still seems idiotic. It's what I alluded to in my post; you could give her a good reason, but the reason she's in favour of - a vague notion that not increasing troop amounts will allow a peace treaty to be brokered with the Separatists - is dubious in the extreme.

I don't think that's a correct reading of her position. She wasn't saying that keeping troop sizes down would magically bring peace; that's a straw-man interpretation. What she was saying was that the Republic should allocate the funds in question to greater diplomatic efforts rather than squandering them on pork-barrel funding for the Kaminoan clone factories. What might promote peace would be those heightened diplomatic efforts -- efforts that would be left unfunded if Senator Burtoni got her pork. Burtoni was nothing more than a war profiteer. Her push for more clone troops wasn't motivated by the good of the Republic or the strategic needs of the military. She was just exploiting the Senators' fear to make her world richer. Farr, Amidala, and their bloc were the only ones who saw through the scam.
 
Nope, she still seems idiotic. It's what I alluded to in my post; you could give her a good reason, but the reason she's in favour of - a vague notion that not increasing troop amounts will allow a peace treaty to be brokered with the Separatists - is dubious in the extreme.

I don't think that's a correct reading of her position.
I'm not even reading it. I'm basically stating it, rather baldly. She says several times she wants peace, and when she elaborates, she means a negotiated settlement with the Separatists. This is why her concern for peace seems much like Santine's - a vague notion it's okay to respect people having but which doesn't work because the people you want peace with are evil (not really a very pleasant notion to put into a cartoon, but there you have it.)

Accepting that her position makes sense would need one to believe that the Separatists have an issue that can be settled with negotiation, and nothing we the audience have seen or Padme the character has seen seem to point to that - and she should know well now of the dubious character of the Separatist leader, Count Dooku.

And considering we've just done yet another arc which portrays the Separatists as, well, cartoonish villains (apt that) it definitely seems off.

Could it make sense? Sure. Does it? No. The text militates against it seeming like anything other than pious nonsense.

Burtoni was nothing more than a war profiteer. Her push for more clone troops wasn't motivated by the good of the Republic or the strategic needs of the military.
This is true, and obviously so. The deceased Senator who with oily superiority questions Padme's patriotism is cut from the same cloth; but then, the problem isn't that the villains aren't villainous and don't have sensible villain motivations (which they do).
 
I think Padme's best course of action would be to try to find Seperatist worlds that want to return to the Republic fold (there has to be some of them) and work with them. She would weaken the enemy and bring the war closer to being over.
 
It would be marvelous if the show remembers the opening scrawl from Revenge of the Sith and the mention of, "Heroes on both sides," and presents some sympathetic Seperatists, Mon Calamari or Bothans perhaps.

And just as an aside I was thrilled about Mon Mothma being in this episode, until I realized it was Satine.
 
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