Star Wars and faster than light travel

[fireproof78]

I think light skipping bugs me as much as it does because I actually saw it coming in a sense once TFA pulled that "jumping out inside a planetary shield" nonsense. Whenever you bend the rules, you're essentially creating a precedent that gives the next story permission to bend them a little more . . . then a little more . . . and so on and so forth until the rule is meaningless.

If you can jump from atmosphere without consequence, then why not just jump from the ground? Why bother even taking off at all? Why even use ships when they're just fancy, needlessly complicated teleport pods? You see what happens when such things are eroded? The internal logic breaks down and the story becomes meaningless.

I mean, I don't actually. One, the rules that are being tossed around are not something I recall as part of the films. All Han says is "Without precise calculations we could fly right through a star or bounce too close to a supernova, and that’d end your trip real quick, wouldn’t it?”

That's it. That's the rules. Precise calculations. That's what they do in TFA. Now, I'm not saying lightspeed skipping isn't bending the rules, but, well, I won't see the erosion or meaninglessness as you do, at least as far as a fictional universe goes.

There was no plot reason why it needed to happen in either instance, they just did it because they felt like it, which is shitty storytelling. The whole third act of TFA is a needlessly contrived scenario. Starkiller Base didn't need to even exist. It could have been just that one Star Destroyer from the beginning that they were rescuing Rey from. It didn't need to be a planet killing planet. It didn't need to have that crazy hyperspace move. It added nothing because it cost nothing. It's all part of that same pattern of behaviour that crippled the ST; style over substance, every time.

Ok. Well, again, agree to disagree and I look forward your rewriting of the ST

I'll go one further than that; not only should Poe have stayed dead, they should have recast him with someone else and given Oscar Issac a whole other Star Wars movie to himself, because he was wasted in that role . . . and if I'm honest, that's probably true of most of the cast.

Nah. Just kill him off and move on. Use Finn more. Everything in TLJ and TROS with Finn could have had more substance. He has such great little moments that show growth that I find enjoyable but it isn't fleshed out enough for my liking.

 

[YellowSubmarine]

The problem with the lighspeed skipping scene is not that it is actually a thing that is possible. Not even the fact that some people can practically do it with seemingly less risk to their persons than there should be. It was how it was done that.

I don't actually recall the atmosphere rule being explicitly laid out on screen, except it being implied indirectly prior to TFA and directly implied in TFA, therefore there is no clear idea of what the limit actually involves. We know you need calculations, it's implied atmosphere makes the travel and/or the calculation more difficult, and we have mapped out hyperspace lanes that are neither here nor there in regards to this argument. It's also implied that in all eras, hyperspace pilots aren't familiar with the complete nature of hyperspace, and the rules are there because of their current understanding and/or ability, and not necessarily the physical limits.

By this alone, I would have never been bothered if a Force user did this, not even if another Force user followed them. I wasn't bothered when a non-Force user, and an ancestor of the old man in TFA was suggested to have abilities that should allow this, not even when she was able to provide the information to others to perform hyperspace stunts reminiscent of it. I wasn't bothered when Han jumped into an atmosphere. I wouldn't have been if he started lightspeed skipping. Poe, even as a great pilot, is somewhat coming out of nowhere with incredible hyperspace feats, but I'll still take it. The fact that it was presented as a skill taught in their group like it was swimming was pushing it, but still wasn't a deal-breaker.

Now, when all the TIE fighters follow them and do lightskipping themselves is when it totally lost me. I'm unsure if it's the question of how*, the question of why they didn't half blow up doing it, or what the scene added when they remained equally pursued during it so the direction could have chosen to have them pursued without adding magic stunts. Whatever it was, with the TIEs following, the scene becomes one serious WTF for me.


* ETA: I know the ability of tracking someone through hyperspace was introduced in the previous film, but even with that, if that means that they can track and follow someone lightspeed skipping, I cannot contrive a reasonable limitation preventing them from lightspeed skipping directly. And then to anyone just doing with with no limits.

 

[Skipper]

Well, compared to BSG TOS, Star Wars is almost hard sci-fi.

 

[fireproof78]

Now, when all the TIE fighters follow them and do lightskipping themselves is when it totally lost me. I'm unsure if it's the question of how*, the question of why they didn't half blow up doing it, or what the scene added when they remained equally pursued during it so the direction could have chosen to have them pursued without adding magic stunts. Whatever it was, with the TIEs following, the scene becomes one serious WTF for me.

Everyone has their line. The TIES keeping up was more interesting to me because it showed the First Order's capabilities, and recognizing that ability made Poe's efforts a bit over the top for the situation. The limits appear to be the hardware and the strain it puts on the equipment, which tracks given that the Resistance has less resources and the First Order has more.

 

[Reverend]

Yeah them all jumping together takes something that already didn't make any sense, and cranks it all the way up to 11.
They would have to both know *exactly* where the Falcon was going ahead of time (like, down to the centimetre!), AND activate their drives at *precisely* the same moment. It's so incredible it's dumb.

Moreover, just just doesn't *look* right. We've seen plenty of jumps before. We've even seen multiple ships jump as a group. But it's always show to be a process. You wait for the navicomputer to calculate the coordinates, *slowly* push the lever forwards, and you're away. If other ships are departing on the same course, they each still jump independently, they don't all just go and arrive at once, and it all has to be closely coordinated. It's not something that can just be done at the drop of a hat, much less in rapid succession.

It's all just style over substance nonsense, it dropped me right out of the story in the very first sequence of the movie, and it was only the first of several times the movie did something like that. It makes it very hard to care about, much less enjoy what's going on.

 

[Christopher]

Well, compared to BSG TOS, Star Wars is almost hard sci-fi.

I'd say they're about the same. Star Wars is maybe a little better about whether starships need lightspeed and what the definition of a galaxy is, but that's about it.

 

[Ithekro]

We see in The Mandalorean that you can follow another ship in hyperspace fairly closely. That Slave 1 came out of hyperspace just behind an Imperial shuttle isn't even questioned by the Imperials.

 

[fireproof78]

Well, I'll probably be in the minority of people who liked the lightspeed skipping sequence for a variety of reasons. That the First Order is able to track through hyperspace just adds credence for my part because hyperspace lanes are shown (in the Mandalorian) to be established already, meaning nav computers have some limits that can be bypassed, if needed. Tracking might even allow them to see probably destinations based upon their orientation to the galatic axis. So, they track them through hyperspace, and drop out when they do. Like matching speed in a police chase.

But, ultimately, it comes down to entertainment. And it was a damn entertaining scene, and one of my favorites from the film.

 

[Ithekro]

On one level it would make sense that the Empire/First Order would research how to quickly and accurately track and follow ships through hyperspace. Rebel hit and fade raids and smugglers were two of the banes of the Imperial Navy.

Having the means to run down smugglers or track Rebels to their base would greatly aid the Empire.

 

[Tuskin38]

Series of maps based off the latest canon map showing where various places in the new movies and shows are
https://numidianprime.wordpress.com/2023/02/07/star-wars-story-maps/

 

[Set Harth]

On one level it would make sense that the Empire/First Order would research how to quickly and accurately track and follow ships through hyperspace.

And of course we know the Empire was already researching hyperspace tracking at the time of Rogue One, they just hadn't worked it out yet.