Star Trek VI: Why did Valeris fall for the court-reporter ruse?

[Timo]

I don't see the "turning off the alarm" trick working any better than the "killing with stun" one. The question would immediately arise why and how the alarm was turned off if entire people started disappearing from the ship, and the person responsible for turning off the alarm would be exposed by Spock's computer expertise, or at least the list of suspects narrowed down by the known clearances and skills of the crew.

In contrast, any villain could perform the kill-with-stun trick. And the more corpses left behind, the better - the idea was to frame Kirk for wrongdoing, and since subtle wasn't working, gross might be needed to do the trick. Leaving the two bodies basically right next to Kirk's cabin, in some sort of an officers-only corridor by the looks of it*, would convince those in need of hammer-on-the-head clues, while circumstantial evidence would already suffice for the subtle-will-do lot. Heck, it was clear already that somebody with access to officer territory was involved, considering where the uniforms were hidden - no doubt another move intended to implicate Kirk.

* None of the crew obviously goes there before Kirk and his officer friends do, and they appear to be heading for Kirk's quarters to let the skipper recuperate. If they were headed for the bridge, they would have taken a direct turbolift, after all.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[dub]

Never underestimate an old fart.

That's right. We're deadly dangerous.

Silent but deadly...dangerous.

 

[cgervasi]

^^Add to that her inability to resist Spock's mind meld interrogation (not rape), and you see the benefit of age and experience.

Never underestimate an old fart.

This bit is really iffy. It certainly violates the right to remain silent.

Let's assume their law works similar to ours.

Spock's coercive questioning was illegal, so any evidence they obtained from it could not be used to prosecute her. The movie doesn't tell us for sure, but it seems once the conspiracy falls apart more evidence, legally obtained evidence, will come to light that will get her convicted. The prosecutors will look the other way from Spock's abusive questioning since the victim turned out to be guilty of murdering officers and a foreign head of state, conspiring to start a war that could have ruined the Federation, and because Spock was a highly esteemed and decorated officer.

 

[Trekker4747]

Here's something.

What if there WAS another conspirator on the ship, one that even Valeris was unaware of other other than knowing he was there, just didn't know who. And setting off the alarm in the galley was a "cover" and signal to the other conspirator to kill the Burke and Samno? Since Valeris set off the alarm in her demonstration the alarm couldn't be set-off elsewhere.

That actually would have been an interesting way to handle things to make their murder that much more mysterious.

I find it odd that a close-range even high-stun would be lethal. I'd think that little flaw would have been worked out of phasers pretty quickly to ensure that no matter the circumstances the stun setting always does just that. (In fact there's many cases where we see a stun at close-range only stuns someone.)

A bigger question for me on why Valeris fell for the announcement is that, is it common for a ship-wide announcement to find the court-reporter for a statement? Isn't it more-likely they'd just page the person directly in their office/duty station instead of calling the whole ship? And why name those giving the statement in the announcement? That should have struck her as odd.

Hell, why is there a court-reporter PERSON? Seems to me the computer could record the statement? And that they're awake and ready to give a statement SHOULD imply they're already awake and talking and that it's likely they've already fessed up and given names and the court reporter is just being called in order to have them restate their confessions for the record.

So, really, Valeris shouldn't have fallen for any of this.

But, really, leaving their dead bodies inside the turbo-car was kind of dumb. She *had* to know they'd be found pretty quickly as people use the turbolifts (just her especially bad luck that very turbo-car was going to be used by the senior staff. It'd make more sense to kill them in their quarters or stash their bodies somewhere where the won't be so quickly found. Stuff their bodies in the a Jefferies Tube or something.

 

[Timo]

And setting off the alarm in the galley was a "cover" and signal to the other conspirator to kill the Burke and Samno? Since Valeris set off the alarm in her demonstration the alarm couldn't be set-off elsewhere.

It could even be that Valeris turned off the alarm, then went to kill the assassins, then turned the alarm back on. Few would notice, and none would suspect, until it was too late.

And yes, we know the stun trick was actually used, but Valeris might still have made doubly sure, and "desensitized" the alarm system and its operators with the "fake" call.

What I also suspect could have taken place there is that Valeris
a) used the very gun that Gorkon was killed with, erasing evidence of previous firings and users, and/or
b) contaminated her own hands with phaser-firing residue, making herself immune to later scrutiny for the murders of Burke and Samno, and/or
c) rattled everybody present with the insanity of her actions, disrupting their rational discussion on the murder plot and prudent courses of action...

I find it odd that a close-range even high-stun would be lethal. I'd think that little flaw would have been worked out of phasers pretty quickly to ensure that no matter the circumstances the stun setting always does just that.

We see the same thing graphically displayed in TNG "Samaritan Snare". IMHO, it's only realistic that all nonlethal weapons properly misused turn lethal. After all, every food is poison, and every muscle movement potentially deadly - it's just a question of dosage.

(In fact there's many cases where we see a stun at close-range only stuns someone.)

That's a single shot, and not at two-centimeter range. Valeris fired repeatedly (after supposedly first downing the victims with a wider, more distant shot).

A bigger question for me on why Valeris fell for the announcement is that, is it common for a ship-wide announcement to find the court-reporter for a statement? Isn't it more-likely they'd just page the person directly in their office/duty station instead of calling the whole ship? And why name those giving the statement in the announcement? That should have struck her as odd.

We fairly seldom hear public announcements aboard starships. Then again, we fairly seldom spend time on the lower decks: the announcements probably would not be heard on the bridge, and it's not the Captain making the announcements in the general case anyway. Quite possibly, message traffic like this bit we heard is very common on starship corridors, and in fact is what Uhura does for a living (muttering quietly into her futuro-microphone), explaining how Kirk's crew knows what is going on even though the Captain basically never tells them.

Hell, why is there a court-reporter PERSON? Seems to me the computer could record the statement? And that they're awake and ready to give a statement SHOULD imply they're already awake and talking and that it's likely they've already fessed up and given names and the court reporter is just being called in order to have them restate their confessions for the record.

True enough. Then again, Valeris could just kill the whole bunch before the records went from the brains of the witnesses to the solid databanks of the ship. Supposedly, the conspirators would wish for her to destroy the entire starship eventually anyway. It's just that she cops out at the crucial moment where drastic action would be called for.

But, really, leaving their dead bodies inside the turbo-car was kind of dumb. She *had* to know they'd be found pretty quickly as people use the turbolifts (just her especially bad luck that very turbo-car was going to be used by the senior staff. It'd make more sense to kill them in their quarters or stash their bodies somewhere where the won't be so quickly found. Stuff their bodies in the a Jefferies Tube or something.

I'd argue it was crucially important that the bodies be found, like, right now. And somewhere that would implicate Kirk, too. Clearly, "subtle" wasn't cutting it in getting Kirk's superiors to condemn and denounce the captain and put a reward on his head. But first hiding key evidence (the uniforms) in officer-only facilities, and then planting dead bodies there, should turn the heads of even the most stubborn hush-uppers in the Admiralty.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Oso Blanco]

A bigger question for me on why Valeris fell for the announcement is that, is it common for a ship-wide announcement to find the court-reporter for a statement? Isn't it more-likely they'd just page the person directly in their office/duty station instead of calling the whole ship? And why name those giving the statement in the announcement? That should have struck her as odd.

My thoughts exactly. It was such an obvious trap that not even a Pakled should have fallen for it. Especially that the names of those two crewmen were announced over the intercom should have warned her off.

 

[Timo]

But there's no "off" available to her. She doesn't have the option to stay out of the trap; she either lets herself be captured or then helps out the conspiracy (and perhaps bails herself out) by gunning down Kirk and his fellow officers. Both of these courses of action require her to march to Sickbay.

And she will even have time to choose from the two while walking the walk. There would in theory be the third choice, of going to Engineering and blowing up the entire ship, but that wouldn't allow her to prevaricate, and we know she wants to put her own survival above the needs of the conspiracy. If she knows she's exposed, she also knows she will be intercepted no matter what she attempts. Going to sickbay will at least allow her to pretend (to herself and to others) that she meant no harm and always was just coming to hand over her phaser.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Oso Blanco]

She could could have ignored that obvious trap alltogether!

 

[Timo]

How?

If she doesn't go to Sickbay, she's still exposed - even if Burke and Samno died without uttering a word, the very fact that this clumsy trap is so blatantly being laid means that the heroes already know it's one of their own ranks doing the dastardly deeds, and she's the one obvious suspect. Not going would solve nothing, and any delay would only work in the favor of the heroes, who are already well along the way to dismantling the whole conspiracy (the key step being their escape from Rura Penthe).

If Valeris went into hiding instead of Sickbay, what would happen? Kirk would contact Starfleet (not being 100% sure yet that his superiors are crooks) rather than just Sulu, but would still contact Sulu the very next thing after finding out his bosses are out to get him. He would still have the same arguments to present, even if he would have to deduce rather than learn that there's going to be an assassination at Khitomer soon, and Sulu would still buy those arguments. If Valeris tried to interfere, she would burn.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Oso Blanco]

But if she had simply ignored that clumsy trap, they would have had a hard time figuring out who the traitor was. It was illogical to assume that the assassins were still alive, and they were the only connection to Valeris. She could have acted as if nothing happened and nobody would have been able to come up with any hard evidence against her. And I doubt that Spock would have even tried that mind meld based on a vague suspicion.

 

[Timo]

But if she had simply ignored that clumsy trap, they would have had a hard time figuring out who the traitor was.

Which would aid with Valeris' personal survival for a brief while, but would not stop the heroes from crashing the conspiracy. They had escaped Rura Penthe and would now blow the whistle on Valeris-knew-not-what. After that, Valeris would be toast anyway.

She really had two choices: surrender, or protect the conspiracy that in turn would protect her. And she only had a few hours in which to choose, because Kirk would soon start asking questions about the secret meeting and the next assassination:

Kirk: "Time is the problem. You and I are nothing. You heard the judge. The peace conference is on again. Whoever killed Gorkon is bound to attempt another assassination. Unless we can get out of here..."

And they did. Valeris cowering in a corner would not be enough to protect the conspiracy now. Valeris gunning down Kirk would help, so that's what she has to try, even if she doesn't have the guts for it in the endgame. And there she has two choices: snipe at Kirk from behind some corner (or blow up his ship or whatever), or waltz into the obvious trap. She has no problems with killing nasty racist assassin lowlife, but she still looks up to Kirk, so she chooses the latter...

...Not logical, but reasonable for any human. And Valeris is being rather illogically human here, as Spock points out when the phaserpoint wavers. (It's a shame the character couldn't be Saavik, who would have a history of being rather illogically human!)

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Spock's Barber]

She wanted to shed her Star Fleet uniform and pointed ears so she could audition for a hottie part on Sex and the City.

 

[Gassy Man]

That whole scene always seemed hokey to me, starting with the notion of a ship-wide broadcast for the court reporter.

But something the film didn't reveal is exactly how much Burke and Samno knew. They could have been more knowledgeable about the plot than anyone wanted, and in that respect, Valeris would have to kill them to be certain. They were too close to pulling it off. Assume, too, that Valeris was responsible for assassinating them in the first place and had given her word -- would she feel duty-bound as a Vulcan to follow through?

 

[MacLeod]

Ah yes, forgot about that part.

But if Valeris didn't want to leave any evidence or witnesses, she still could have disabled the alarm and vaporized both men. Then she could claim self-defense, since the general consensus would probably be to believe the word of an officer (her) over two enlisted crewmen.

But that would still leave a trace in the computer logs. Sure she might be able to fake somone elses ID or mask that it was her, but I suspect that several officers would have been able to see that trace or faked ID.

Remember as well they were looking for someone who had altered the logs to show the Enterprise had fired those torpedeos.

We also don't know if that log was altered by someone onboard or even before the Enterprise left spacedock. It would be a risk to alter the log again to disable the alrams or hide the fact that you had.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Ah yes, forgot about that part.

But if Valeris didn't want to leave any evidence or witnesses, she still could have disabled the alarm and vaporized both men. Then she could claim self-defense, since the general consensus would probably be to believe the word of an officer (her) over two enlisted crewmen.

But that would still leave a trace in the computer logs. Sure she might be able to fake somone elses ID or mask that it was her, but I suspect that several officers would have been able to see that trace or faked ID.

She could erase that too.

Valeris was *sloppy* in ST VI, because she apparently didn't know that altering the torpedo records wouldn't do any good when those torpedoes were still sitting in the bay, unfired. She was probably just betting that they wouldn't take the time to inspect the entire torpedo bay by hand.

 

[Timo]

The whole mess should have been over long before there was time to inspect the torpedo hold: hot war would have been raging, and the discovery that Kirk actually did not fire anything (assuming he or enough of his ship survived to enable such a discovery) would only add gasoline to the flames on both sides. "He was innocent and we can prove it!" and "More vile lies from the cowardly Federation!" would both serve the cabal's best interests.

That part of the plan simply wasn't engineered for the sort of robustness it eventually came to need. Kirk surrendering made Chang hesitate, so all the blame lies on Chang. He should have started firing at Kirk despite the surrender, martyring the Captain and launching the war; betting that a humiliation at a courtroom would suffice was an incredibly bad bet.

Why not fire? Since when have Klingons respected surrender, or considered it dishonorable to kill a surrendered opponent? The shame should be on the coward who surrenders.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Memory Alpha]

The business of the torpedoes is a big issue for me, and it's just dropped, evidently. I mean, the actual evidence against Kirk and McCoy of all people is so weak as to be non-existent. Forget the Klingons. Starfleet just sacrifices them? That would have been an interesting angle instead of this whodunnit riddled with plot holes and oddities like the phaser alarm.

As to Valeris, at that point, she should have stayed as far away from sickbay as possible and denied everything. It would have been her word and her superiors' word against two low level stooges.

She reacted impulsively, which is un-Vulcan I suppose. And of course I'm analyzing too much. Fact is, they set her up and she fell for it, and that's a good story!

 

[Timo]

Starfleet just sacrifices them?

Well, that was the only thing that saved the universe from the UFP/Klingon war. The people who chose not to speak let alone act on Kirk's behalf were the real heroes of the movie... But it was also a heroic move of Kirk to set himself up for such a sacrifice. And he certainly expected no rescue, other than the one he had planned with Spock.

I really have more issue with that part. Spock has a supply of these tracer patches readily available? He thinks they will be of help when Kirk beams aboard a ship full of bloodlusty Klingons? He has those parts of the complex rescue scenario worked out days in advance of the actual operation (or even in advance of the actual incident necessitating the operation!), but the maneuver needed to penetrate Klingon space involves panicky rummaging of old books?

The viridium patch could have been slapped on at the E-A transporter room rather than the bridge for greater plausibility - more time for Spock to plan, a more logical stash for the patches. Spock could refer to his diplomatic experience with Klingons for his conviction that Kirk will be captured rather than killed. And the need for books could have been as per the novelization - Valeris desperately tries to stop the operation by sabotaging the UT, so it is at the very last moment that our heroes find out that books are needed to compensate. Oh, well...

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Shat Happens]

I never questioned Val'eris' methods until reading this thread.

I don't like it very much that the only way for the Klingons to have Kirk's audio recording in the trial was the reason for Val'eris' incriminating (another of VI's scoobydooisms).

What about this: heroes discover the goons' bodies. McCoy determines they were stunned by phaser (not lethal) then injected with 100cc pure cordrazine (or triox? insert TOS homage here) and comments "a merciful kill, actually. They never felt any pain". Then Spock's eyebrow raises.

 

[Ithekro]

Be funny if Valeris was actually the ship's court-reporter and she was suppose to show up. They were just betting on if she's have a phaser or not.