Star Trek: Vanguard

[Little_kingsfan]

I'm in the middle of my (current) reread of this series and I have a couple of questions that aren't quite clear (as of the conclusion of Reap the Whirlwind, but may have been answered in a subsequent book) about various characters' service/timeline:

• When did the senior officers of Vanguard (Cdre. Reyes, Cmdr. Cooper, Capt. Desai, Lt. Cmdr. T'Prynn, Lt. Xiong, et. al.) start their assignments? I know the starbase was ordered to service in 2263 upon the Constellation's discovery of the Taurus Meta-Genome and it was fully operational by the first book (which I believe/was told takes place in approximately October 2265) - and that they were still working out the kinks some three/four months earlier in Distant Early Warning. It was also mentioned in the notes at the end of Reap the Whirlwind that the Ravanar IV outpost was set up in 2264 (I'm assuming the later portions of the year), so were there already personnel assigned to Vanguard at that time?
• Similarly, how long has the Sagittarius been in service? I know that as of Reap the Whirlwind (which takes place in January-February 2266), Senior Chief Razka is the newest member of the crew and Crewman Torvig was just one year out of basic training, but it seemed like the more senior officers and NCOs (Capt. Nassir, Cmdr. Terrell, Dr. Babitz, and MCPO Ilucci) had all been working together for at least a couple of years.
• Was Commodore Reyes promoted immediately from Captain of the U.S.S. Dauntless to the station (and simultaneously Commander Gannon to Captain of the U.S.S. Bombay, which I believe said took place about ten or eleven months prior to Harbinger)?

Anyways, thanks for the help.

 

[Bryan Levy]

@David Mack So, what happened to Cervantes Quinn? He’s just gone? Or is there a reference I’m missing?

 

[David Mack]

@David Mack So, what happened to Cervantes Quinn? He’s just gone? Or is there a reference I’m missing?

T'Prynn gave him a new identity and let him go off to find whatever kind of life he wanted for himself. Part of the lore of Star Trek Vanguard is that, after the events of the Taurus Reach, he was never seen or heard from again.

 

[Bryan Levy]

T'Prynn gave him a new identity and let him go off to find whatever kind of life he wanted for himself. Part of the lore of Star Trek Vanguard is that, after the events of the Taurus Reach, he was never seen or heard from again.

Fine by me. Just making sure there weren’t any stories I was missing. I was expecting a Han Solo-like swoop in at the end, which he either died or lived through, but I can understand him being a man of a certain time and place. Very Sidney Carton of him.

 

[David Mack]

I'm in the middle of my (current) reread of this series and I have a couple of questions that aren't quite clear (as of the conclusion of Reap the Whirlwind, but may have been answered in a subsequent book) about various characters' service/timeline:

• When did the senior officers of Vanguard (Cdre. Reyes, Cmdr. Cooper, Capt. Desai, Lt. Cmdr. T'Prynn, Lt. Xiong, et. al.) start their assignments? I know the starbase was ordered to service in 2263 upon the Constellation's discovery of the Taurus Meta-Genome and it was fully operational by the first book (which I believe/was told takes place in approximately October 2265) - and that they were still working out the kinks some three/four months earlier in Distant Early Warning. It was also mentioned in the notes at the end of Reap the Whirlwind that the Ravanar IV outpost was set up in 2264 (I'm assuming the later portions of the year), so were there already personnel assigned to Vanguard at that time?

The construction of Starbase Vanguard (aka Starbase 47) was part of a larger initiative known within Starfleet as Operation: Vanguard. Commodore Diego Reyes was very likely promoted to take command of this operation in 2263, and he would have been tasked with overseeing the construction of the starbase.

The first personnel on-site would have been engineering personnel, S.C.E. teams, and limited support staff (command and medical, some security).

It is likely that Reyes's former first officer Hallie Gannon was promoted to captain of the Bombay at this time, and that she and her new command were tasked to support the fast-tracked construction of Starbase Vanguard. Reyes likely used his authority to bring Dr. Ezekiel Fisher, his former CMO on the Dauntless, to Starbase Vanguard, and to have the Bombay assigned to his command, as well.

Colonization efforts might also have been fast-tracked, along with the placement of research outposts, in order to establish a Federation claim on systems of interest to Operation: Vanguard.

I suspect that the scout vessel Sagittarius, its crew, and A&A officer Lt. Ming Xiong all were assigned to O:V in 2264, and that Capt. Desai arrived on SB47 in mid-2265, along with other command and support staff.

• Similarly, how long has the Sagittarius been in service? I know that as of Reap the Whirlwind (which takes place in January-February 2266), Senior Chief Razka is the newest member of the crew and Crewman Torvig was just one year out of basic training, but it seemed like the more senior officers and NCOs (Capt. Nassir, Cmdr. Terrell, Dr. Babitz, and MCPO Ilucci) had all been working together for at least a couple of years.

The Sagittarius was described in book one, Harbinger, as "nearly new." My thinking was that the ship had likely been commissioned into service with the rest of her class in 2263, and that the Sagittarius and her crew were immediately tasked to Operation: Vanguard. It's possible they lost a person or two on early missions, leading to the arrival of replacement personnel, such as Torvig and Razka, in 2265-2266.

• Was Commodore Reyes promoted immediately from Captain of the U.S.S. Dauntless to the station (and simultaneously Commander Gannon to Captain of the U.S.S. Bombay, which I believe said took place about ten or eleven months prior to Harbinger)?

Anyways, thanks for the help.

As I noted earlier, it seems likely that Reyes used his new billet and the power that came with it to get Gannon assigned to his sector command.

I suspect there might have been a gap between his command of the Dauntless and his assumption of command of Starbase Vanguard. And yes, Gannon had taken command of the Bombay at either the end of 2264 or the start of 2265; she had not been in the captain's chair very long at all in Harbinger. I don't recall whether the text of the novel specified that the Bombay was Gannon's first command.

 

[Little_kingsfan]

The construction of Starbase Vanguard (aka Starbase 47) was part of a larger initiative known within Starfleet as Operation: Vanguard. Commodore Diego Reyes was very likely promoted to take command of this operation in 2263, and he would have been tasked with overseeing the construction of the starbase.

Actually, as it turns out, according to Open Secrets, Cdre. Reyes was first briefed on Operation Vanguard just under a year before his court-martial and assigned to the station two months later, putting the date he was assigned sometime in early- to mid-2265. Now whether or not that got ret-conned later or that itself was a ret-con from the earlier stories, I can't say (yet).

That's the nice thing about this particular reread for me: although I know the broad strokes of how it goes, all the little details are just ripe for me to learn. For example, I knew going into this series that Cdre. Reyes was divorced and that his ex-wife dies in Reap the Whirlwind (which was the catalyst for him allowing Tim Pennington to release his story and thus getting himself court-martialed), I did not know/had forgotten that he was married for 11 years, divorced eight years earlier and hadn't seen Jeanne in seven years prior to RTW.

Two more quick questions:
1. How old is Ambassador Jetanien? In Open Secrets, he mentions that he was mentored as a young diplomat by an Earth-Romulan War veteran (who shows up in one of the Rise of the Federation books) and now he's the seasoned statesman and probably analogous to a human in his 50s-70s (at least, that's how I read him).
2. I've been wondering about this one for three and a half books now: how exactly is Ganz's ship and/or criminal empire set up? Obviously, the Omari-Ekon doesn't have the same kind of organizational structure as any of the other ships we've ever seen in Star Trek, either on screen or the page, considering it's a ship designed around criminal activity, but it's probably still got engineers, pilots, etc., not to mention bosses/underbosses for the various services provided (gambling, liquor, contraband, slaves, assassins & mercenaries, and everything else).

 

[David Mack]

Actually, as it turns out, according to Open Secrets, Cdre. Reyes was first briefed on Operation Vanguard just under a year before his court-martial and assigned to the station two months later, putting the date he was assigned sometime in early- to mid-2265. Now whether or not that got ret-conned later or that itself was a ret-con from the earlier stories, I can't say (yet).

See, this is why someone needs to put all this stuff into Memory Beta. With so many hands working in the kitchen, it becomes difficult to keep track of all the little details.

That's the nice thing about this particular reread for me: although I know the broad strokes of how it goes, all the little details are just ripe for me to learn. For example, I knew going into this series that Cdre. Reyes was divorced and that his ex-wife dies in Reap the Whirlwind (which was the catalyst for him allowing Tim Pennington to release his story and thus getting himself court-martialed), I did not know/had forgotten that he was married for 11 years, divorced eight years earlier and hadn't seen Jeanne in seven years prior to RTW.

Two more quick questions:
1. How old is Ambassador Jetanien? In Open Secrets, he mentions that he was mentored as a young diplomat by an Earth-Romulan War veteran (who shows up in one of the Rise of the Federation books) and now he's the seasoned statesman and probably analogous to a human in his 50s-70s (at least, that's how I read him).

I have no idea. I don't recall if we ever gave a specific age for him. He was meant to be our "Jed Bartlett" character, an elder statesman type.

2. I've been wondering about this one for three and a half books now: how exactly is Ganz's ship and/or criminal empire set up? Obviously, the Omari-Ekon doesn't have the same kind of organizational structure as any of the other ships we've ever seen in Star Trek, either on screen or the page, considering it's a ship designed around criminal activity, but it's probably still got engineers, pilots, etc., not to mention bosses/underbosses for the various services provided (gambling, liquor, contraband, slaves, assassins & mercenaries, and everything else).

Honestly, I couldn't tell you. There are probably "little people" to do the jobs that need doing, but the hierarchy is that of a mafia family, or maybe a band of pirates. A code of honor of some kind, but no formal ranks. This might be best left to the imagination.

 

[USS Firefly]

Man now I want a Vanguard like saga, in the lost Era timeline or to end the current novels.

 

[Little_kingsfan]

Just finished my reread of Storming Heaven, the final book in the Star Trek: Vanguard series proper (at almost 2 in the morning!), and I'm left with a question:

Spoiler: Casualties vs. survivors

I'm assuming that any character not explicitly killed (from my count, that's Cmdr. Cooper, Lt. Dunbar, Lt. Cmdr. Cannella, Dr. Fisher, CPO Vulmenko, and Lt. Xiong on the station; on the ships, casualties included Lt. Cmdr. Mog and the Endeavour engineering staff, and Capt. Nassir and Lt. Sayna on the Sagittarius) was beamed off the station and survived, especially a lot of the lower deck-level characters; however, there are certain characters whose fate(s) I'd like to confirm, including Lt. Haniff Jackson, Lt. Isaiah Farber, Dr. Gonzalo Robles, Andorian dentist Thelex (hey, they let Dr. Fisher stay even after he'd retired, and they did put out a "every doctor, nurse, medic, EMT, or experienced first-aid provider" request just before the battle started), and Lt. Cmdr. Dohen.

That's all my brain can come up with at the moment, and I'll see if I have any more questions in the morning. Also, if I've forgotten anybody from either Vanguard or the ship(s) or messed something up, please let me know.

 

[Little_kingsfan]

I have no idea. I don't recall if we ever gave a specific age for him. He was meant to be our "Jed Bartlett" character, an elder statesman type.

How long do Rigellian Chelons usually live? I think it was Precipice or maybe What Judgments Come that said that Jetanien was brand new to the Federation Diplomatic Corps likely in the 2160s-2170s, as Ambassador Rosen (who was said to have negotiated at the end of the Earth-Romulan War and was shown in Rise of the Federation) mentioned him in her back-channel correspondence with Senator D'tran, and I can't imagine the two of them kept in touch for the remainder of her life (although it is possible).

Also, as of Storming Heaven, I think Jetanien said that he was no longer an active Ambassador since the events of What Judgments Come, but the majority of the upper echelon of the Federation and Starfleet knew he was the guy to conduct back-channel diplomacy to both Qo'noS and Romulus - and Tim Pennington told Diego Reyes when he tracked the former commodore down that last he'd heard, Jetanien was still on Nimbus III. Am I correct, or did I miss something?

One more quick thing: was my casualty vs. survivors count (listed above) accurate? Thanks for all the notes.

 

[David Mack]

How long do Rigellian Chelons usually live? I think it was Precipice or maybe What Judgments Come that said that Jetanien was brand new to the Federation Diplomatic Corps likely in the 2160s-2170s, as Ambassador Rosen (who was said to have negotiated at the end of the Earth-Romulan War and was shown in Rise of the Federation) mentioned him in her back-channel correspondence with Senator D'tran, and I can't imagine the two of them kept in touch for the remainder of her life (although it is possible).

Also, as of Storming Heaven, I think Jetanien said that he was no longer an active Ambassador since the events of What Judgments Come, but the majority of the upper echelon of the Federation and Starfleet knew he was the guy to conduct back-channel diplomacy to both Qo'noS and Romulus - and Tim Pennington told Diego Reyes when he tracked the former commodore down that last he'd heard, Jetanien was still on Nimbus III. Am I correct, or did I miss something?

One more quick thing: was my casualty vs. survivors count (listed above) accurate? Thanks for all the notes.

The most truthful answer to all of your queries is, "I don't know off the top of my head."

We never locked down a specific age for Jetanien, but since sea turtles can live a long time, let's figure that Rigelian Chelons can, as well. And yes, the idea at the end of the saga was that Jetanien remained on Nimbus III, in an effort to keep "back channels" open for diplomacy when all other avenues failed.

As far as the casualty count, assume anyone not explicitly stated as having been killed is alive until stated otherwise. Some of them might be MIA, but who knows? It's been over eight years since I wrote Storming Heaven, and I've written many more novels since then. I don't really retain line-by-line recall of my novels. Maybe if someone who has the time and inclination wants to research this, you might obtain more definitive answers.

 

[Little_kingsfan]

Hey, guys, I'm updating my personal files on various Star Trek characters and was wondering, specifically, how old some of the characters in Vanguard/Seekers are.

The ones I know/have a strong hunch about include:

• Diego Reyes - Age: 50s, which puts his date of birth in between 2210 and 2215 (Memory Beta says 2215, which would make him 50 years old in Harbinger); however, MB also says that he graduated from Starfleet Academy circa 2235. Now, while it is possible that he did actually graduate that year at the age of 20, assuming the 2215 birth year is accurate, but it's equally possible he was born in 2213 (making him 22 in 2235) or graduated in 2237.
• T'Prynn - Life dates given explicitly as 2191-2349, so her age during Vanguard is not in question.
• Ezekiel Fisher - Like Reyes, Fisher is only confirmed to be in his 80s and a fifty-plus-year veteran of Starfleet; MB gives his year of birth as 2185 and I believe that to be accurate.
• Rana Desai - Her age is given as late 30s/early 40s, but her backstory has her in Starfleet since approximately 2242 (14 years in Starfleet Security and SCIS before joining the JAG Corps in 2256). Assuming she graduated from the Academy at the age of 22 in 2242, her birthday would be circa 2220 and her age in Harbinger would be 45.
• Adelard Nassir - The only specific clue about his age is that he's past his pheromone prime, but I seem to recall (but am not certain) that he was described as being on the latter side of middle age (if he were human, I'd say in his late 50s to early 70s, but I'm not sure how comparable Deltans' ages are).
• Lisa Babitz - Likely in her late 30s to early 40s, which would make her around the same age as Dr. McCoy on TOS.
• Sorak - Specifically said to be 118 years old in Reap the Whirlwind (2266) and 120 in Seekers (2269), which would put his birthday in 2148/2149.
• Sayna zh'Firro - I have no idea, but probably sometime in between 2225-2235, which would put her in her 30s during Vanguard
• Vanessa Thieriault - Again, this is approximate, but I'd say she was in her early/mid-20s during Harbinger and Reap the Whirlwind, which would put her birthday in the early 2240s.
• Razka - Another character who's life years were explicitly given as 2231-2379 in one of his appearances; again, not worried about him.
• Mike Illucci - Given that he's been an enlisted man in Starfleet for almost 30 years as of 2269, I'd put his birth year anywhere between 2215 and 2220.
• Threx - Since Dr. Phlox was in his 80s and looked to be in his 40s during Enterprise, I have absolutely no idea how old PO1 Threx would be during Vanguard/Seekers.
• Karen Cahow - Probably about the same age as Thieriault, but since Cahow's enlisted, she didn't go through the Academy and has more sea time, err, space time.
• Torvig - Assuming he went through Starfleet Basic Training at approximately age 18-20, then he was probably born in the early to mid 2240s.
• Zhao Sheng - At the time of his death, he was coming up on his 40th anniversary in Starfleet, so I'd approximate his age as late 50s/early 60s with a birth year sometime between 2205 and 2210.
• Atish Khatami - Another character who was likely born in the 2220s decade.
• Tony Leone - All I got on Leone is that he's older than Dr. McCoy and younger than Dr. Boyce (Capt. Pike's CMO in "The Cage"), although I think I recall a reference to him being closer to 50 years old than 40 (again, I can't say that for certain).
• Bersh glov Mog - Another character that's tricky since I don't know how old Tellarites are.

Anyways, any help or input would be appreciated (especially if you can give me not just a year of birth but an actual date!). Also, if I've forgotten anybody, feel free to chime in.

 

[Nyotarules]

To any of the writers of the series, was there a backlash from some fans due to the Vanguard series not showing Starfleet as the 'good guys'?

 

[David Mack]

To any of the writers of the series, was there a backlash from some fans due to the Vanguard series not showing Starfleet as the 'good guys'?

Some, but not enough to be significant. And as the series developed, many of those early critics came to understand that some of our principal characters had to start out in flawed states so that they had room in which to grow and improve. One of the series' biggest recurring themes is atonement and redemption.

 

[Little_kingsfan]

@David Mack, @Dayton Ward, as two of the main architects of this great series, can either of you please give me your perspective(s) on this particular puzzle - or is this one of those things that doesn't really matter except to detail-oriented nitpickers like myself?

Hey, guys, I'm updating my personal files on various Star Trek characters and was wondering, specifically, how old some of the characters in Vanguard/Seekers are.

The ones I know/have a strong hunch about include:

• Diego Reyes - Age: 50s, which puts his date of birth in between 2210 and 2215 (Memory Beta says 2215, which would make him 50 years old in Harbinger); however, MB also says that he graduated from Starfleet Academy circa 2235. Now, while it is possible that he did actually graduate that year at the age of 20, assuming the 2215 birth year is accurate, but it's equally possible he was born in 2213 (making him 22 in 2235) or graduated in 2237.
• T'Prynn - Life dates given explicitly as 2191-2349, so her age during Vanguard is not in question.
• Ezekiel Fisher - Like Reyes, Fisher is only confirmed to be in his 80s and a fifty-plus-year veteran of Starfleet; MB gives his year of birth as 2185 and I believe that to be accurate.
• Rana Desai - Her age is given as late 30s/early 40s, but her backstory has her in Starfleet since approximately 2242 (14 years in Starfleet Security and SCIS before joining the JAG Corps in 2256). Assuming she graduated from the Academy at the age of 22 in 2242, her birthday would be circa 2220 and her age in Harbinger would be 45.
• Adelard Nassir - The only specific clue about his age is that he's past his pheromone prime, but I seem to recall (but am not certain) that he was described as being on the latter side of middle age (if he were human, I'd say in his late 50s to early 70s, but I'm not sure how comparable Deltans' ages are).
• Lisa Babitz - Likely in her late 30s to early 40s, which would make her around the same age as Dr. McCoy on TOS.
• Sorak - Specifically said to be 118 years old in Reap the Whirlwind (2266) and 120 in Seekers (2269), which would put his birthday in 2148/2149.
• Sayna zh'Firro - I have no idea, but probably sometime in between 2225-2235, which would put her in her 30s during Vanguard
• Vanessa Thieriault - Again, this is approximate, but I'd say she was in her early/mid-20s during Harbinger and Reap the Whirlwind, which would put her birthday in the early 2240s.
• Razka - Another character who's life years were explicitly given as 2231-2379 in one of his appearances; again, not worried about him.
• Mike Illucci - Given that he's been an enlisted man in Starfleet for almost 30 years as of 2269, I'd put his birth year anywhere between 2215 and 2220.
• Threx - Since Dr. Phlox was in his 80s and looked to be in his 40s during Enterprise, I have absolutely no idea how old PO1 Threx would be during Vanguard/Seekers.
• Karen Cahow - Probably about the same age as Thieriault, but since Cahow's enlisted, she didn't go through the Academy and has more sea time, err, space time.
• Torvig - Assuming he went through Starfleet Basic Training at approximately age 18-20, then he was probably born in the early to mid 2240s.
• Zhao Sheng - At the time of his death, he was coming up on his 40th anniversary in Starfleet, so I'd approximate his age as late 50s/early 60s with a birth year sometime between 2205 and 2210.
• Atish Khatami - Another character who was likely born in the 2220s decade.
• Tony Leone - All I got on Leone is that he's older than Dr. McCoy and younger than Dr. Boyce (Capt. Pike's CMO in "The Cage"), although I think I recall a reference to him being closer to 50 years old than 40 (again, I can't say that for certain).
• Bersh glov Mog - Another character that's tricky since I don't know how old Tellarites are.

Anyways, any help or input would be appreciated (especially if you can give me not just a year of birth but an actual date!). Also, if I've forgotten anybody, feel free to chime in.

Thanks.

 

[David Mack]

@David Mack, @Dayton Ward, as two of the main architects of this great series, can either of you please give me your perspective(s) on this particular puzzle - or is this one of those things that doesn't really matter except to detail-oriented nitpickers like myself?
Thanks.

We tend not to bog down in such tiny details. They are rarely vital to the story. It's enough to know that a certain character is in their twenties or their thirties, another is middle-aged, another is near retirement age, etc. Exact numbers and dates just create details to trip over the next time we write those characters.

 

[Little_kingsfan]

We tend not to bog down in such tiny details. They are rarely vital to the story. It's enough to know that a certain character is in their twenties or their thirties, another is middle-aged, another is near retirement age, etc. Exact numbers and dates just create details to trip over the next time we write those characters.

Makes sense, I guess. I just don't like seeing my personal charts and lists use a character's first appearance as their start date instead of their birthday (example: I have Amb. Jetanien, Lt. Cmdr. Mog, Capt. Nassir, Lt. Sayna, Lt. Niwara, PO1 Threx, PO3 Torvig, Capt. (Mosh zelev) Sereb, Cmdr. ch'Nayra in that order, all with a start date of 2265 (even though Cmdr. ch'Nayra isn't introduced until Precipice set in 2267 and Capt. Sereb similarly was introduced the year earlier during Open Secrets), while Lt. Cmdrs. T'Prynn and Sorak and MCPO Razka all have actual birth years listed) if I can help it.

 

[David Mack]

If I recall correctly, I ended up calculating T'Prynn's year of birth so that I could figure out how many times she had been through Pon farr since the death of Stonn, and so that I could assess how many years ago it had been when we meet her in 2265.