Star Trek The Motion Picture 45th Anniversary Book Club

[Tallguy]

Chapter Twenty-Six - Not Chess, Poker

Will Decker is just having terrible, horrible, no good, very bad week.

It was an incredible image that came onto the main viewer. A relay signal, it showed the colossal alien machine as it came into sight over a lunar horizon. Its energy-field cloud had dissipated when it decelerated and it left Vejur looking even more alien and deadly.

That would have been a very cool shot. EDIT: It occurs to me again that next to the moon that Vejur still looks tiny.

“Vejur signals the Creator.” It was the Ilia-probe speaking.
“Saying what?” McCoy asked. “ ‘Here I am’?”

Cute. "Now it came about after these things, that God tested Abraham, and said to him, Abraham!” And he said, “Here I am.”"

“I understand, Captain,” said Spock. “It would seem to me that your disclosure requires a closer contact with Vejur, does it not? I received an impression during mine that there is a central brain complex somewhere. . . .”

This scene both here and in the film plays (finally some might say) like classic Star Trek. This extra bit of "Spock playing along" ("Perhaps the accident I had as a child...") makes it even more so.

An interesting exchange: Decker anticipates Kirk's order to self destruct. Spock appreciates his initiative. Decker / Kirk / Spock actually makes more of a showing in this story than Kirk / Spock / McCoy. I don't think any of the films (including The Final Frontier which gets the most credit for trying) ever really got back to the Kirk as the center and Spock and McCoy as the two sides of the scale dynamic. TFF had them together the most.

The self destruct plot point was not in the theatrical cut but it was in the ABC version and it was restored to the Director's Edition. Anything to give Scott something to do, I'm in favor of it.

 

[David cgc]

That would have been a very cool shot. EDIT: It occurs to me again that next to the moon that Vejur still looks tiny.

I wonder if Roddenberry might've been thinking about this bit of concept art.

 

[Christopher]

Years ago I had a book called Tarzan Alive! (I believe) by Philip Jose Farmer. The idea of the book was that Tarzan was real person, who was actually still alive at the time the book was written (1960s or early 1970s). Farmer claimed to have met this person.

Well, of course, that's the same way Burroughs approached all his novels -- that he was passing along an account that was related to him by a participant in the events, or publishing a manuscript he happened to discover, or whatever. It was pretty standard in the fiction of the day, like the Sherlock Holmes stories supposedly being written by Watson, or Dracula being an epistolary novel constructed from letters, journals, and articles. I think it was particularly done in SF/fantasy to counteract the unbelievable nature of the narratives by presenting them as documented true events. (Which was also part of Roddenberry and Solow's thinking in framing TOS with log entries.)

In the book Farmer gave a detailed explanation of how it was that Tarzan knew things like how to write his name, or what it was that he had in fact written and that Burroughs had simplified for the books. Among other claims that Farmer made, he said that sometimes Burroughs changed details in the books, in part to throw off track people who were trying to find out who the "real" Tarzan was. Unfortunately, I got rid of the book years ago.

From what I've heard about Farmer's pastiches, that doesn't surprise me.

 

[Tallguy]

I wonder if Roddenberry might've been thinking about this bit of concept art.

That's like Independence Day big!

I'm sure I had that in my mind when I read it this time. It's getting to where I've read and seen so much about this movie that I can't remember it all! (Part of why I haven't finished Return to Tomorrow: It's a lot to keep in one's head.)

 

[DarrenTR1970]

Just as Spock sometimes can do stuff just because he's Spock, there are things Tarzan can do just because he's Tarzan!

Years ago I had a book called Tarzan Alive! (I believe) by Philip Jose Farmer. The idea of the book was that Tarzan was real person, who was actually still alive at the time the book was written (1960s or early 1970s). Farmer claimed to have met this person. In the book Farmer gave a detailed explanation of how it was that Tarzan knew things like how to write his name, or what it was that he had in fact written and that Burroughs had simplified for the books. Among other claims that Farmer made, he said that sometimes Burroughs changed details in the books, in part to throw off track people who were trying to find out who the "real" Tarzan was. Unfortunately, I got rid of the book years ago.

(That's all pretty off-topic I know, but Trek fans have been known to come up with equally elaborate and implausible ways of explaining the mysteries of our own favorite fictional universe!)

I had that book as well, along with its companion 'Doc Savage: His Apocalyptic Life' - and, because Great Apes/Gorilla's didn't live in that portion of Africa as Burroughs described, Tarzan wasn't raised by apes, but a heretofore unknown/undiscovered offshoot of Anthropopithecus, possibly related to the tribes located in Pellucidar.​

 

[Christopher]

Oh, yes -- Burroughs's depiction of Africa was completely fanciful. IIRC, the way he described the jungle was more consistent with South America than anything in Africa.

 

[TheUsualSuspect]

I had that book as well, along with its companion 'Doc Savage: His Apocalyptic Life' - and, because Great Apes/Gorilla's didn't live in that portion of Africa as Burroughs described, Tarzan wasn't raised by apes, but a heretofore unknown/undiscovered offshoot of Anthropopithecus, possibly related to the tribes located in Pellucidar.​

I'd forgotten about the Australopithecene thing! If I remember right, it was also partly because the living great apes don't have the verbal language capacity that Burroughs' great apes did.

(Decker calls Kirk "Jim" for the first time here. the first time Riker called Picard "Jean-Luc it was not well received.)

I don't think it's the first time Decker called Kirk "Jim" (although it's the first time he calls him Jim in the book). We know that Decker is Kirk's "protege," and I've always thought of that as meaning Kirk was his mentor. Looking over the earlier parts of the novel, exactly what their relationship is is not clear, although Kirk refers to Decker as "Will" when he speaks to him. More significantly, on p 62, the phrase "his friendship with Kirk" is used in describing Decker's mindset. That suggests to me that Decker might have been comfortable using Kirk's first name despite their difference in rank and positions in chains of command. Also, the situation here is tense and Decker is at a fairly raw moment emotionally. It just may have been natural that he wanted to get Kirk's attention in a personal, rather than formal, fashion.

 

[Commander Troi]

Again, poor Decker! Feeling and "hearing" the real Ilia for a moment would be devastating. But he catches on quickly to Kirk's plan, which speaks well for him.

Kirk's plan is, as you say, poker, and thus a very Kirk way to deal with an impossible situation. It's a HUGE longshot, but it's the only shot there is.

 

[publiusr]

Oh, yes -- Burroughs's depiction of Africa was completely fanciful. IIRC, the way he described the jungle was more consistent with South America than anything in Africa.

I had this idea in my head that somehow Tarzan could live in both continents and travel in a mystic way. Tarzan, though skilled was more an innocent than Conan.

“Not Chess, poker”

I think that line was first used by Korean War veterans.

 

[Tallguy]

Chapter Twenty-Seven - IT was a Brain

My understanding is that this is the part of making the film that was the most chaotic with re-writes coming in constantly (often dueling between Roddenberry and Livingston). And this chapter so far seems to reflect that. The balance of the relationships is different, who leads what conversation is different, the dialog is the most different compared with earlier in this novel.

I wonder how much of this was Roddenberry making his own path and how much of it was that this wasn't complete while he was writing the novel. I don't know the timeline of when filming wrapped and when Roddenberry was writing this.

Anyway, it follows the general outline of the events of the film: Vejur takes them to its brain and we find out that it is a twentieth century space probe.

Decker leads a conversation about Vejur's incompleteness with Spock commenting on the conclusions. In the film this all came entirely from Spock. This would be where the scene with the tears would be. Honestly this is better in the film, especially the Director's Edition.

and for once even the efficient Sulu had forgotten to call off a change in helm status.

Mr. Scott would be happy.

“Jim, lad . . . ’tis a terrible thing you’re doing to me.” It was Scott’s voice from the intercom. Kirk whirled guiltily—he had completely forgotten leaving Scott there in mid-command.

I love this line. I wish Scott had talked like this more. To me rather than being overly casual it cements the respect that Scott has for Kirk. It also (to me) underlines the notion that it's Scotty's ship and Kirk borrows it.

Even in the Director's Edition there is never a second reference to the self-destruct order. Here Kirk and Decker discuss timing and tactics.

In the film Kirk takes Spock and McCoy and Decker requests to be included. Sulu is left at the conn. (Did Decker get the conn once? I don't think he did. Even when he is waiting on the bridge with Ilia he's not in the chair.)

Here they all just... Go. Also in the film Chekov detects an oxygen / gravity envelope around the ship. Here they remark on it after they are outside the ship and Spock says it was "promised" to them.

Exclamations from McCoy and Decker as a pattern of tumbling shapes came rushing toward them at alarming speed. They appeared to be great translucent rectangles of light which were somehow solidifying into matter as they came. Then the shapes made a sweeping pirouette and settled in gently between them and the hemisphere’s “island” nucleus.

This, of course, is the original concept of how they would traverse to Vejur. It is not in the theatrical but was realized in both the 2001 and 2022 Director's Editions.

“I doubt that Vejur will believe the truth,” murmured Spock.
“You can be damned certain it won’t,” said McCoy.

OK. That was awesome. Gene Coon would be smiling.

 

[Christopher]

“Not Chess, poker”

I think that line was first used by Korean War veterans.

It's a quote from "The Corbomite Maneuver."

Chapter Twenty-Seven - IT was a Brain

My understanding is that this is the part of making the film that was the most chaotic with re-writes coming in constantly (often dueling between Roddenberry and Livingston). And this chapter so far seems to reflect that. The balance of the relationships is different, who leads what conversation is different, the dialog is the most different compared with earlier in this novel.

I wonder how much of this was Roddenberry making his own path and how much of it was that this wasn't complete while he was writing the novel. I don't know the timeline of when filming wrapped and when Roddenberry was writing this.

A mix of both, probably. We've seen that Roddenberry took advantage of the freedom of writing the novel to work in elements he couldn't get into the film, like the sexual aspects. And it was normal back then, as we've been discussing in the Vonda McIntyre thread, for novelizers to be free to take liberties with a film's story and make it their own. It's hard to imagine that Roddenberry wouldn't take advantage of that freedom to do things his own way instead of deferring to what others decided.

 

[TheUsualSuspect]

A few thoughts on Chapters 26 and 27:

These chapters really feel like the climax of a TOS episode to me even though, as has been noted, they are different in some ways from the movie. (I haven't watched TMP for a number of years - maybe I'll watch it once this novel-read is over.) The whole putting-together-a-last-minute-plan-on-the-fly move feels very much like classic Trek. Spock, McCoy, and Kirk talk through what they know and Kirk comes up with a "hail Mary" plan in the absence of full information. Actually, it's two plans - implementing the self-destruct sequence is also a very TOS move. If Kirk's half-formed plan to confront whatever Vejur's original source was fails, he'll blow up the ship and take Vejur with it! And the reveal of the original probe at the very end of Chapter 27 felt very effective to me as a reader.

I also appreciated the focus on Decker's thoughts about his experience with the Ilia/Vejur probe near the beginning of Chapter 26. It gives us new insight to what Decker has gone through, and sets up what is to come in a way that feels a bit different than what I remember getting from watching the movie.

I look forward to reading Chapter 28 and seeing everyone's thoughts here.

 

[Tallguy]

Scotty's assurances notwithstanding, does anyone actually think the self destruct would have worked? (I do not.)

 

[Christopher]

Scotty's assurances notwithstanding, does anyone actually think the self destruct would have worked? (I do not.)

If it happened right next to V'Ger's core brain? I'd say it's fairly likely. Even if the immediate explosion didn't vaporize V'Ger's brain, the gamma radiation at such close range would probably fry it. After all, V'Ger's shielding would be mostly on the outside. And the oxygen atmosphere V'Ger kindly pumped in would make the explosion far more destructive than it would be in vacuum, due to the superheating and expansion of the air -- particularly in an enclosed volume, which would concentrate the blast.

The explosion probably wouldn't be large enough to destroy the entire body of V'Ger, which is the size of Maui. But I think it would probably destroy or cripple its brain.

On the other hand, that's if it's allowed to go off without warning. It's possible that V'Ger could detect the buildup to it and erect some kind of shielding, or send a probe to override the computers and shut down the sequence.

 

[David cgc]

Would there be any build-up? Scotty's remark suggest it's not any kind of overload or progressive detonation, just releasing the safeties on the antimatter supply and letting nature take its course.

 

[Christopher]

Would there be any build-up? Scotty's remark suggest it's not any kind of overload or progressive detonation, just releasing the safeties on the antimatter supply and letting nature take its course.

Yeah, but the process of releasing those safeties would probably take a few moments, since there would be multiply redundant safeguards that would all have to be shut down. V'Ger might be able to detect the physical or computer activity and realize what's about to happen in time to stop it or shield against it.

 

[Commander Troi]

Scotty's assurances notwithstanding, does anyone actually think the self destruct would have worked? (I do not.)

I tend to think Scotty is right on this one. This close to the "brain", it should incapacitate Vejur at least.

About that atmosphere being promised... too bad it wasn't in here!

I do love the reveal. I'm sure it completely surprised me as a kid.

 

[Tallguy]

It should. But Vejur has proven indestructible and nearly omnipotent (if weirdly ignorant and stupid) at every turn so far.

I honestly don't know my reaction to the 20th century space probe. I might have recognized it. I read National Geographic, I followed the progress of the Space Shuttle, I remember when Viking landed on Mars. I had several books on Skylab. I'm not sure what I knew about Voyager.

Honestly as slow as the movie is I think at that point it might have also been a little overwhelming. I know for my Dad it was the only part of the movie he liked. And he really liked that part.

Once Ilia shows up the movie is still not fast but it does start to move at a decent pace. One might say "as soon as the movie finds itself in the parameters of a Star Trek episode they know what to do."

 

[Christopher]

It should. But Vejur has proven indestructible and nearly omnipotent (if weirdly ignorant and stupid) at every turn so far.

Which is exactly why Kirk tricked V'Ger and the Ilia Probe into bringing the Enterprise into V'Ger's core, where it's most vulnerable. It's the same principle as the Trojan Horse -- the walls of Troy were impenetrable for ten years, but once they got inside the walls, it was all over.

(This is also why it drove me crazy whenever Voyager did an episode where the crew brought an unknown and potentially dangerous alien device aboard and studied it six feet away from the warp core.)

 

[Greg Cox]

That's been driving me crazy for four decades. How does it know how the shapes "V GER" are pronounced in English? How does it know those shapes even represent its name?

Edgar Rice Burroughs's first Tarzan novel had the same problem. It stressed that Tarzan learned English only in written form and had no idea what sounds the letters represented, yet somehow he knew that his name in the ape language should be spelled "TARZAN" in the keep-out sign he wrote for his treehouse.

The nitpickiest of nitpicks: It wasn't his treehouse (which was more of a movie thing). It was his father's old cabin, from when Lord and Lady Greystoke were first stranded in the jungle, before their tragic ends.

None of which affects the point of your observation, of course.

Speaking of Tarzan and framing sequences, the intro to the first novel implies that Burroughs changed the names to protect the privacy of the "real" people involved: "a certain English gentlemen whom we shall call Lord Greystoke," or words to that effect.

As I understand, this is the only time ERB made this distinction with regards to Tarzan. The notion that "Lord Greystoke" is a substitute for the "real" name cannot be found in any of the many, many sequels.