Star Trek: The Art of the Film

[Arpy]

Well, hold on people. Did they not know what they were for by the end of the process? If so, it is moronic of them. That's what Google's for.

Now over the years I've picked up that the collectors are for sucking in hydrogen primarily for use in the ship's propulsion - they can be used for numerous other things. But if your job, that you're extremely lucky to have, is pseudo-science, you should at least be wondering how freakin' anti-matter (the most combustible thing in the universe) fits into all this.

 

[JoeP]

This.

Except for the fact that virtually no one actually gives a fuck what the nacelles do.

Steve, he's agreeing with you-- he's "thissing" the roll-eyes.

This.

 

[Therin of Andor]

Saw the bit about how they thought the Bussards on the nacelles were for sucking in interstellar antimatter to burn in the nacelles, thus confirming they were a pack of morons who didn't have a clue what they were doing.

When did TOS tell us how the nacelles worked?

 

[Christopher]

Well, hold on people. Did they not know what they were for by the end of the process? If so, it is moronic of them. That's what Google's for.

Come on. It's a trivial detail that was completely irrelevant to the actual story of the film. And how do we know that the paraphrase Captain Robert April posted is what they actually said? Given his obvious and profound biases, I'm not going to trust his claim without verification of what the actual text in the book says. For one thing, if the book contains that description at all, is it a verbatim quote from one of the designers, is it a quote from someone else less directly involved with the design process, or is it a paraphrase -- possibly a misquote -- by the author of the book?

After all, the passage that CRA alleges the book contains is really very close to the Sternbach-Okuda explanation for the Bussard collectors. They draw in interstellar hydrogen, some of which can be converted to antihydrogen by other systems, for use in the warp reactors. The difference between that and the alleged description posted by CRA is something that could easily crop up by a mishearing or two, like a game of telephone. So unless you can be certain exactly who said exactly what, it's irresponsible to toss words like "moronic" around.

Now over the years I've picked up that the collectors are for sucking in hydrogen primarily for use in the ship's propulsion - they can be used for numerous other things. But if your job, that you're extremely lucky to have, is pseudo-science, you should at least be wondering how freakin' anti-matter (the most combustible thing in the universe) fits into all this.

There actually are trace amounts of antiparticles existing in space. Since space is mostly, well, empty space, antiparticles can exist there for a long time without hitting anything else. The Earth's radiation belts naturally contain a far, far vaster quantity of antiparticles than have ever been manufactured by human endeavor, and there are still more abundant quantities contained in the magnetospheres of Jupiter, Saturn, and the like. These quantities are minuscule compared to the amounts used by fictional starships, but the basic principle is not as absurd as you'd think. There's a serious scientific proposal out there to develop means of harvesting those antiparticles from the Earth's radiation belts and elsewhere as a fuel source. Read more here:

Finding Antimatter in the Solar System
Collecting Natural Antimatter

 

[startrekrcks]

I love the Ibridge it is very modern but I understand why some people who are canonists don't like the design

 

[Captain Robert April]

Flipped through the thing at Borders. Saw the bit about how they thought the Bussards on the nacelles were for sucking in interstellar antimatter to burn in the nacelles, thus confirming they were a pack of morons who didn't have a clue what they were doing.

I didn't know that either, so does that mean I'm a moron too?

Did you work on the movie?

 

[Dukhat]

Flipped through the thing at Borders. Saw the bit about how they thought the Bussards on the nacelles were for sucking in interstellar antimatter to burn in the nacelles, thus confirming they were a pack of morons who didn't have a clue what they were doing.

I didn't know that either, so does that mean I'm a moron too?

Did you work on the movie?

He probably didn't, but that's irrelevant. He's a Star Trek fan, just like you, me, Orci & Kurtzman, and everyone else on this board who either liked or didn't like the movie, irregardless of the knowledge of how nacelles work. So answer his question. Is he a moron?

 

[Steve Roby]

Except for the fact that virtually no one actually gives a fuck what the nacelles do.

Steve, he's agreeing with you-- he's "thissing" the roll-eyes.

This.

I've been dumb before, and I'll be dumb again. Unfortunately.

 

[Mysterion]

Yeah, at the theatre, when the scene in the movie in which everything depended on the Bussards being used to draw in antimatter appeared, the audience erupted in jeers and boos and ripped the seats out and burned down the theatre, chanting "Death to false Star Trek!"

I really gotta start going to more matinees!

 

[JD]

Flipped through the thing at Borders. Saw the bit about how they thought the Bussards on the nacelles were for sucking in interstellar antimatter to burn in the nacelles, thus confirming they were a pack of morons who didn't have a clue what they were doing.

I didn't know that either, so does that mean I'm a moron too?

Did you work on the movie?

No, but I have been considering possibly starting to write some fan-fic. Do you feel that anybody who works on something Trek related has to know every little detail about every little minuscule element of the franchise?

 

[FalTorPan]

I enjoyed the book. I wish each section had about five times more content than it did -- especially for the designs of the Starfleet ships' interiors -- but I liked the book just fine.

As for the nacelles, who cares?

 

[Captain Robert April]

I didn't know that either, so does that mean I'm a moron too?

Did you work on the movie?

No, but I have been considering possibly starting to write some fan-fic.

So why the need to feel insulted by a comment directed at those who did work on it?

Do you feel that anybody who works on something Trek related has to know every little detail about every little minuscule element of the franchise?

If the function of the engines has nothing to do with your story, no. If it comes up, it'd certainly help if you looked into it so that you'd know what you were talking about.

If you're one of the designers of the damn ship, then yes, you better know, chapter and verse, how the thing works, especially before you go about changing things. Kind of the old "you have to know the rules before you can properly break them" thing. And considering that a Bussard collector is a legitimate scientific concept, and not something made up for the show (and this is still supposed to be a science fiction movie, and not Dora the Explorer) it might behoove these dweebs to crack open a textbook or two and do some frelling homework instead of just regurgitating the same old warmed over Star Wars crap they grew up on.

 

[DimesDan]

Did you work on the movie?

No, but I have been considering possibly starting to write some fan-fic.

So why the need to feel insulted by a comment directed at those who did work on it?

Do you feel that anybody who works on something Trek related has to know every little detail about every little minuscule element of the franchise?

If the function of the engines has nothing to do with your story, no. If it comes up, it'd certainly help if you looked into it so that you'd know what you were talking about.

If you're one of the designers of the damn ship, then yes, you better know, chapter and verse, how the thing works, especially before you go about changing things. Kind of the old "you have to know the rules before you can properly break them" thing. And considering that a Bussard collector is a legitimate scientific concept, and not something made up for the show (and this is still supposed to be a science fiction movie, and not Dora the Explorer) it might behoove these dweebs to crack open a textbook or two and do some frelling homework instead of just regurgitating the same old warmed over Star Wars crap they grew up on.

Firstly, who gives a flying shit really?

Spoiler: a gift for Bob :-P

Secondly, here's a hat for you Robert April

 

[F. King Daniel]

I enjoyed the book. I wish each section had about five times more content than it did -- especially for the designs of the Starfleet ships' interiors -- but I liked the book just fine.

As for the nacelles, who cares?

I don't have the book, but I've seen the previews and flicked though very briefly.

I wish they had proper huge pics of the various ships' CG models rather then just the earlier concept art pics (from before the ships were supersized, by the looks of it). A nice closeup of one of those big Enterprise windows, like when you see people looking out when Kirk's pod ejects, would have been amusing just for the reaction online ("It's a CG error! The ship is tiny!").

 

[JarodRussell]

You'd think for a designer who gets paid to do the job it shouldn't be too hard to actually spend some time on the work the previous designers did, since most of those didn't only go for "oh it looks cool" but spend a lot of thought abouzt the why and how. A quick call to Probert or Sternbach and and you'd know what, why and how.

"What's the red glowy thingy we're going to make blue supposed to be?"

But then again, I'd expect a director and writer of a movie to actually watch the movies that came before, and if it's the movie version of a TV show, to watch the TV show, before tackling the job. To get to know the dos and don'ts, the story flow, the characters and the portrayal... I'm all for precise work.

Who of you the tie-in authors doesn't know Trek down to the tiniest bit of trivia, even the technobabble stuff?

 

[David cgc]

Don't we have a thread still on the front page about authors describing phaser beams (that aren't in TOS books) as blue? I also remember books that had the Bajoran wormhole set in the delta quadrant.

Never mind that the red things weren't established as ramscoops in TOS, not to mention the dish being a sensor and not a deflector. And, more importantly, what makes you think that error was carried through, and they never did check? Hell, the deflector even had a little bit of business added where it deployed into a high-intensity configuration for warp speed because the dust it was supposed to be deflecting would be going so much faster.

 

[Christopher]

Never mind that the red things weren't established as ramscoops in TOS, not to mention the dish being a sensor and not a deflector.

Why do people keep thinking that? The Making of Star Trek, published in 1968 while TOS was still in production, explicitly describes the dish as "the starship's main sensor-deflector (a parabolic sensor antenna and asteroid deflector") on page 191.

 

[Dayton Ward]

Who of you the tie-in authors doesn't know Trek down to the tiniest bit of trivia, even the technobabble stuff?

Me.

I don't keep all that crap in my head. I can hold my own so far as TOS and most of TNG is concerned, but not so with all the ridiculous mumbo-jumbo from the latter series. When the need to have such information arises, I consult the proper references to refresh my memory. Unless there's a specific need, I don't spend time obsessing over such things.

 

[Captain Robert April]

Who of you the tie-in authors doesn't know Trek down to the tiniest bit of trivia, even the technobabble stuff?

Me.

I don't keep all that crap in my head. I can hold my own so far as TOS and most of TNG is concerned, but not so with all the ridiculous mumbo-jumbo from the latter series. When the need to have such information arises, I consult the proper references to refresh my memory. Unless there's a specific need, I don't spend time obsessing over such things.

Emphasis mine.

Y'see, Dayton, that is what makes the difference between a professional who takes the work seriously and a hack who doesn't care and doesn't think the audience either cares or is smart enough to notice.

Expect a fruit basket at Star Fest.

 

[seigezunt]

or at least a fruitcake.