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Star Trek: Planet of the Titans

Gotham Central

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Before TMP and the aborted Phase II, there was Planet of the Titans. This is definately one of the odder entries in Trek's long list of creative dead ends. The story itself is somewhat interesting if its a bit predictable. But what always interested me was Ralph McQuarrie's art preliminary art work. Some of his creations were interesting like the asteroid space dock. But I think Trek certainly dodged a bullet by passing on his angular wedge shaped Enterprise. I think it was designed before he started working on Star Wars, but you can definately see the genesis of the Star Destroyer in the design. Ironically, since he actually made models of the ships, and sense they did technically end up on screen...they are canon.

Anyone have any thoughts on this "road not taken?"
 
Anyone have any thoughts on this "road not taken?"

As much as I used to respect Phil Kaufman as a filmmaker, I suspect that ST:PotT would have ended up as little more than a stinking pile of kitschy 1970s Erich von Däniken-inspired rubbish with a ghastly production design. OTOH, it would have made a perfect double feature when paired with William Shatner's Mysteries of the Gods.

TGT
 
Even though I often agree with TGT, I am staunchly of the opinion that TITANS would have been a Trek-lite but solid adventure that would have been much better received than TMP.

In fact, I'm of the opinion that if they had to do a trek-lite adventure like the new Abrams seems to be, that TITANS would have been better source material than the thing these TRANSFORMERS guys came up with, which might well be Nexus-level material (and I'm referring to GENERATIONS, not BLADE RUNNER.)

BTW, the McQuarrie art is far inferior to the Ken Adam ship sketches they 'build' on. I would have hoped that Derek Meddings' ship miniatures reflected more of Adam's stylings.

The McQuarrie stuff was done AFTER his main work on SW, not before. I think it was right before he started working on GALACTICA, though.
 
Even though I often agree with TGT, I am staunchly of the opinion that TITANS would have been a Trek-lite but solid adventure that would have been much better received than TMP.

In fact, I'm of the opinion that if they had to do a trek-lite adventure like the new Abrams seems to be, that TITANS would have been better source material than the thing these TRANSFORMERS guys came up with, which might well be Nexus-level material (and I'm referring to GENERATIONS, not BLADE RUNNER.)

BTW, the McQuarrie art is far inferior to the Ken Adam ship sketches they 'build' on. I would have hoped that Derek Meddings' ship miniatures reflected more of Adam's stylings.

The McQuarrie stuff was done AFTER his main work on SW, not before. I think it was right before he started working on GALACTICA, though.

I think it would have been OK. The thing, in retrospect, that I would have had doubts about would be Derek Meddings effects. I have never been a real Meddings fan. His work on Journey to the Far Side of the Sun and UFO was great, but I dunno...there was always something about his effects that I didn't care for.

Ken Adam's production design would have been top notch though...

The production illustrations and paintings from this are impressive.
 
Meddings almost always worked without enough money (even on the Bonds, though those suffered more for a complete lack of time in post), so that influences the way his stuff is perceived (kind of like the 'that looks good for an amateur movie' style compliment.) Also he'd work with various other units (on SUPERMAN, he did the front half of the dam break, but somebody else did the back half, which is screechingly funny with its telephone poles vibrating as water hits them) and often get blame for what they did wrong.

But in terms of good possibilities on TITANS I'm thinking of some of his near-invisible work, where he'd do in-camera stuff live on set with foreground miniatures, like Mike Minor did on TMP and TWOK. There's a dockyard explosion in FOR YOUR EYES ONLY and a poppy field blast in LIVE&LETDIE that are both totally genuine-looking, but done in miniature. And some of the stuff that comes off a little bit hokey is probably due to editing ... the supertanker in SPY WHO LOVED ME looks fantastic in wide and medium shots, but the close shots of the bow in the water are blown by obvious scale issues ... if they'd not dwelt on the closeups, the tanker swallowing submarine stuff would have been pretty convincing.

The superbrain sketch of Adam's looks like something that could have been done with paintings or foreground miniatures and actors on scaffolding in the distance seen 'through' the superbrain, so again that'd be right up Medding's alley.

I've always been more excited thinking about what Jordan Belson would have brought to the show, since he was going to be doing the optical end of things. If you've seen any of his incredible short films or how his work was incorporated into THE RIGHT STUFF (and JOURNEY TO THE FAR SIDE OF THE SUN I think), you may know he was doing amazing luminous-looking stuff with stone knives & bearskins tech, and I think his black hole stuff would have been pretty trippy (maybe a real nice subjective warp drive effect too, come to think of it.)
 
Before TMP and the aborted Phase II, there was Planet of the Titans. This is definately one of the odder entries in Trek's long list of creative dead ends. The story itself is somewhat interesting if its a bit predictable. But what always interested me was Ralph McQuarrie's art preliminary art work. Some of his creations were interesting like the asteroid space dock. But I think Trek certainly dodged a bullet by passing on his angular wedge shaped Enterprise. I think it was designed before he started working on Star Wars, but you can definately see the genesis of the Star Destroyer in the design. Ironically, since he actually made models of the ships, and sense they did technically end up on screen...they are canon.

Anyone have any thoughts on this "road not taken?"

The designs looked intriguing but the story concept and plotline blew. This would have wound up as the kind of minor 70s sf flick that the few aging Trek fans still extant in 2009 would defend and pore over endlessly while the rest of humanity moved on and forgot the stillborn would-be "franchise."
 
Before TMP and the aborted Phase II, there was Planet of the Titans. This is definately one of the odder entries in Trek's long list of creative dead ends. The story itself is somewhat interesting if its a bit predictable. But what always interested me was Ralph McQuarrie's art preliminary art work. Some of his creations were interesting like the asteroid space dock. But I think Trek certainly dodged a bullet by passing on his angular wedge shaped Enterprise. I think it was designed before he started working on Star Wars, but you can definately see the genesis of the Star Destroyer in the design. Ironically, since he actually made models of the ships, and sense they did technically end up on screen...they are canon.

Anyone have any thoughts on this "road not taken?"

The designs looked intriguing but the story concept and plotline blew. This would have wound up as the kind of minor 70s sf flick that the few aging Trek fans still extant in 2009 would defend and pore over endlessly while the rest of humanity moved on and forgot the stillborn would-be "franchise."

And your basis for this hot-air has to do with your own issues with aging? Or is it the fact that the road not taken is often at least as interesting to others as our hoping you find the river that leaves you up the creek?
 
Meddings almost always worked without enough money (even on the Bonds, though those suffered more for a complete lack of time in post), so that influences the way his stuff is perceived (kind of like the 'that looks good for an amateur movie' style compliment.) Also he'd work with various other units (on SUPERMAN, he did the front half of the dam break, but somebody else did the back half, which is screechingly funny with its telephone poles vibrating as water hits them) and often get blame for what they did wrong.

But in terms of good possibilities on TITANS I'm thinking of some of his near-invisible work, where he'd do in-camera stuff live on set with foreground miniatures, like Mike Minor did on TMP and TWOK. There's a dockyard explosion in FOR YOUR EYES ONLY and a poppy field blast in LIVE&LETDIE that are both totally genuine-looking, but done in miniature. And some of the stuff that comes off a little bit hokey is probably due to editing ... the supertanker in SPY WHO LOVED ME looks fantastic in wide and medium shots, but the close shots of the bow in the water are blown by obvious scale issues ... if they'd not dwelt on the closeups, the tanker swallowing submarine stuff would have been pretty convincing.

The superbrain sketch of Adam's looks like something that could have been done with paintings or foreground miniatures and actors on scaffolding in the distance seen 'through' the superbrain, so again that'd be right up Medding's alley.

I've always been more excited thinking about what Jordan Belson would have brought to the show, since he was going to be doing the optical end of things. If you've seen any of his incredible short films or how his work was incorporated into THE RIGHT STUFF (and JOURNEY TO THE FAR SIDE OF THE SUN I think), you may know he was doing amazing luminous-looking stuff with stone knives & bearskins tech, and I think his black hole stuff would have been pretty trippy (maybe a real nice subjective warp drive effect too, come to think of it.)

If I remember correctly, Belson also did a lot of stuff in-camera for The Right Stuff. I don't know how that would have worked for Trek...shuttlecraft, planetscapes...sure. Anything else, I don't know...

Anyway, Meddings has done some good work. I liked his miniature work for Superman -- The Movie.

But, Trumbull, Dykstra, Tippet and Edlund were always my heroes of the visual effects field.
 
Before TMP and the aborted Phase II, there was Planet of the Titans. This is definately one of the odder entries in Trek's long list of creative dead ends. The story itself is somewhat interesting if its a bit predictable. But what always interested me was Ralph McQuarrie's art preliminary art work. Some of his creations were interesting like the asteroid space dock. But I think Trek certainly dodged a bullet by passing on his angular wedge shaped Enterprise. I think it was designed before he started working on Star Wars, but you can definately see the genesis of the Star Destroyer in the design. Ironically, since he actually made models of the ships, and sense they did technically end up on screen...they are canon.

Anyone have any thoughts on this "road not taken?"

The designs looked intriguing but the story concept and plotline blew. This would have wound up as the kind of minor 70s sf flick that the few aging Trek fans still extant in 2009 would defend and pore over endlessly while the rest of humanity moved on and forgot the stillborn would-be "franchise."

And your basis for this hot-air has to do with your own issues with aging? Or is it the fact that the road not taken is often at least as interesting to others as our hoping you find the river that leaves you up the creek?


Plus, I can think of a few movies that don't sound that good on paper but turned out to be classics. And may I remind you that even classics like The Wizard of Oz were not predicted to be hits at the box office. Still, the one aspect of the story that might not have sat well with fans or the average Joe moviegoer is the lack of Kirk. There would likely have been a lot of ticketholder asking "Where's Kirk?" for most of the movie...

I don't think the story "blew" at all. I like the idea of a "Quest for Kirk" and the Spock-centric aspects of the storyline. I think Kaufman would have made a good movie. I loved his version of Invasion of the Body Snatchers -- which is the project he took on instead of Star Trek.
 
Meddings almost always worked without enough money (even on the Bonds, though those suffered more for a complete lack of time in post), so that influences the way his stuff is perceived (kind of like the 'that looks good for an amateur movie' style compliment.) Also he'd work with various other units (on SUPERMAN, he did the front half of the dam break, but somebody else did the back half, which is screechingly funny with its telephone poles vibrating as water hits them) and often get blame for what they did wrong.

But in terms of good possibilities on TITANS I'm thinking of some of his near-invisible work, where he'd do in-camera stuff live on set with foreground miniatures, like Mike Minor did on TMP and TWOK. There's a dockyard explosion in FOR YOUR EYES ONLY and a poppy field blast in LIVE&LETDIE that are both totally genuine-looking, but done in miniature. And some of the stuff that comes off a little bit hokey is probably due to editing ... the supertanker in SPY WHO LOVED ME looks fantastic in wide and medium shots, but the close shots of the bow in the water are blown by obvious scale issues ... if they'd not dwelt on the closeups, the tanker swallowing submarine stuff would have been pretty convincing.

The superbrain sketch of Adam's looks like something that could have been done with paintings or foreground miniatures and actors on scaffolding in the distance seen 'through' the superbrain, so again that'd be right up Medding's alley.

I've always been more excited thinking about what Jordan Belson would have brought to the show, since he was going to be doing the optical end of things. If you've seen any of his incredible short films or how his work was incorporated into THE RIGHT STUFF (and JOURNEY TO THE FAR SIDE OF THE SUN I think), you may know he was doing amazing luminous-looking stuff with stone knives & bearskins tech, and I think his black hole stuff would have been pretty trippy (maybe a real nice subjective warp drive effect too, come to think of it.)

If I remember correctly, Belson also did a lot of stuff in-camera for The Right Stuff. I don't know how that would have worked for Trek...shuttlecraft, planetscapes...sure. Anything else, I don't know...

Belson does largely nonrepresentational work. His material in RIGHT STUFF was subjective POV work for the 'demon' at high mach speed, plus the fireflies in Glenn's orbit and SOME (not the fiery stuff) of the re-entry shots, as well as a few stylized views of Earth. He has gone out of his way to not be interviewed very often; I think CFQ had a tiny interview with him once. I don't think he'd've done any spaceship stuff for trek, though he might have created some atmospherics around a ship element.

It's just a guess, but I think a certain percentage of Belson' stuff was kind of like lissajous (sp) patterns, the stuff seem at the very end of the heaven stuff in BRAINSTORM. If you've ever set a metal cheesegrater in the kitchen window and then seen the way sunlight goes through it and up on the opposite wall, you'll know what I mean. If you have a pattern light that going off mylar (like the laser off mylar LIFEFORCE fx) you get some amazing variety of light-based imagery. If you can imagine doing thirty or forty passes on the LIFEFORCE stuff, that is I THINK what Belson does for some of his work.
 
Came across a blog with the old Famous Monsters TMP article scanned in, and it had a comment from Mike Minor about Klingon ship design in TITANS.

"They had new designs for the klingon ships which looked like ballpoint pens. They really did look like a pen set, mounted on its desk base."

That's a new one for me. Don't suppose anybody has seen these sketches?

EDIT ADDON: Article mentions that the author, Brian Forbes, has more material with Mike Minor. Does anybody know him or if the material turned up anywhere else?
 
Came across a blog with the old Famous Monsters TMP article scanned in, and it had a comment from Mike Minor about Klingon ship design in TITANS.

"They had new designs for the klingon ships which looked like ballpoint pens. They really did look like a pen set, mounted on its desk base."

That's a new one for me. Don't suppose anybody has seen these sketches?

EDIT ADDON: Article mentions that the author, Brian Forbes, has more material with Mike Minor. Does anybody know him or if the material turned up anywhere else?
That description sounds like the "weird fish" V'ger concept, which does sorta resemble a ball point pen.
 
The study models along with those for the Excelsior ended up as wrecks in TNG's "The Best of Both Worlds". Ex Astris has a nice page on it.
 
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