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So... who got the Dominion fleet?

Deimos Anomaly

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Just before the battle of cardassia this huge fleet was shown... but then Kira Garak and Odo happened, and presumably this fleet was surrendered mostly intact.

It looked like it contained hundreds of ships, including several of those giganto mile-long battleships. Could be very useful in future if say the Borg attacked again...

I could almost see the alliance falling apart right there as the Klingons and Romulans fought it out for the Dominion fleet.
 
I'd think the Dominion got the Dominion fleet.

At the so-called "capitulation" of the Dominion forces, there was never any talk about any sort of compensation or even withdrawing from the conquered territory - merely of the Dominion agreeing not to fight any more, for now. In practice, they won the war: their strength remained superior till the bitter end, and that was just the strength of an isolated beachhead force... If the Feds pressed their "victory" too far, such as trying to possess the Dominion fleet, they'd just anger a galactic power that could crush them like bugs. (It would just take them seventy years to do so if the wormhole remained blocked by the Prophets!)

Timo Saloniemi
 
However, initially before the war began, just how many convoys of ships did the Dominion send through?
For all we know, they could have sent the majority of their forces with but a minor contingent remaining behind in the GQ.

And let's not forget the DS9 writers seriously messed things up in terms of fleet sizes.
The Federation alone should have had more than enough ships to deal with the Dominion.
Drama on the other hand dictated otherwise.

Granted, over the 2 years the war was fought, the Dominion would likely be able to replenish their forces in the GQ since their facilities there were intact.
However, let's not forget that the Feds, Klingons and Romulans (it was ridiculous that all 3 would be inferior to Cardies/Dominion) were fighting a Cardassian EMPIRE (which already had pre-established industry and facilities in the AQ which the Dominon simply took over).

I doubt the Dominion would have been so fortunate if the fight was happening in the GQ.
And besides, 70 years to reach the AQ in order to 'crush' the Feds like bugs in a sever overstatement of their capabilities.
For one thing, the Feds and the Dominion were more or less equals in terms of tech development when they met, with the Dominion creating an advantage due to their spy network (which probably gave them initially the upper hand with weapons - which the Feds were able to counteract by the time the war began anyway).

70 years down the line, a severely outdated Dominion fleet would reach the AQ, and do what exactly?
Challenge a fully armed and technologically upgraded DS9 (provided it would still be there by that time and not replaced by a new behemoth starbase)?
Yeah, right.
:D
 
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If the Feds pressed their "victory" too far, such as trying to possess the Dominion fleet, they'd just anger a galactic power that could crush them like bugs. (It would just take them seventy years to do so if the wormhole remained blocked by the Prophets!)
Of course, depending on the Prophets powers outside the wormhole, the Dominon could spend seventy years traveling to the Alpha Quadrant by warp drive, only to have the Prophets destroy their fleet as it first arrives.

Because they might be a threat to Bajor.

Most of the (different) maps I've seen, show Bajor as being on the side of the Federation closest to the Gamma Quadrant.

:)
 
For all we know, they could have sent the majority of their forces with but a minor contingent remaining behind in the GQ.

That wouldn't alter the balance of power much, though - because the isolated forces on the Alpha side were denied of shipbuilding resources many times over (the first day of the war saw Starfleet destroying several shipyards) and still apparently managed to outproduce the combined Alpha powers! If a beachhead force with portable factories could achieve that, then the main body of Dominion back home in Gamma could have built a force to dwarf all Alpha navies in a forthnight...

The Federation alone should have had more than enough ships to deal with the Dominion. Drama on the other hand dictated otherwise.

Why "should"? What's objectionable about the concept of the Dominion sending through the wormhole as many ships as Starfleet possessed? Even if we're speaking about, say, 10,000 ships, it's just ten thousand-ship convoys, or a hundred hundred-ship ones. We supposedly saw something like a hundred ships push through in "The Die is Cast" (counting the number of quantum singularities on the computer screen), and plenty of Skreean ships came through in "Sanctuary", too.

...a Cardassian EMPIRE (which already had pre-established industry and facilities in the AQ which the Dominon simply took over)

OTOH, that empire had been a pushover in the last conflict with the Federation (in the sense that we barely noticed there was a war going on during TNG), and had only barely held against the Klingons. I wonder whether its war materiel production could have contributed to all that much in the end.

I doubt the Dominion would have been so fortunate if the fight was happening in the GQ.

We never heard of the Alphans replenishing their forces even when the fighting took place on their own turf. The only ship built during the war appeared to be the Sao Paulo!

70 years down the line, a severely outdated Dominion fleet would reach the AQ, and do what exactly?

The thing it did in the first place - surprise the Feds by alien innovations. After all, the Feds, too, would lack intelligence on their opponent.

And sending one fleet over would allow the Dominion to build a new one the next decade, and a new one the following decade, and to keep on producing newer and perhaps faster fleets so that 70 years down the line, seven overwhelmingly sized invasion forces would arrive simultaneously. It's not as if we ever heard of the Dominion military having anything better to do in the Gamma Quadrant, after all.

What we saw in DS9 gave us evidence of a fanatical breed of oppressors and conquerors, not particularly lacking in means. The Alphans did little to erode that drive or those means, and in turn demonstrated that they weren't particularly willing to reverse the tables and commit to the annihilation of the Dominion. They did demonstrate they were capable of underhanded tricks, though, thereby probably signing their death warrants because there was no way the Dominion could leave them alive now...

Timo Saloniemi
 
Dominion ships are junk in my opinion especially the bug fighters.

Why would Romulans need more capital ships when they have the superlative Scimitar class or the Klingons the Negh'Var class?

All those ships would need to be completely gutted and rebuilt for a non-Jem'har crew. They most likely lack proper sleeping, eating and toilet facilities.
 
...Plus, their beam weapons, while deadly, seem to have poor targeting systems: far too many misses, and "The Ship" makes it sound as if their steering mechanism is a physical one, rather than phased-array. Might go a long way in explaining the miss rate, actually.

However, the Dominion really knew how to churn out those little buggers. The manufacturing methods would be nothing to snort at - ignoring them might be as bad a mistake as the Allies turning a cold shoulder to VW Beetle production at German defeat in WWII!

Timo Saloniemi
 
...Plus, their beam weapons, while deadly, seem to have poor targeting systems: far too many misses, and "The Ship" makes it sound as if their steering mechanism is a physical one, rather than phased-array. Might go a long way in explaining the miss rate, actually.

Look who's talking: The Defiant's phasers are aimed by aiming the whole ship, like a WWII fighter.

However, the Dominion really knew how to churn out those little buggers. The manufacturing methods would be nothing to snort at - ignoring them might be as bad a mistake as the Allies turning a cold shoulder to VW Beetle production at German defeat in WWII!

Timo Saloniemi
One of the things the Dominion had going was a small number of standardised designs. There was the bug, the battlecruiser, and eventually the battleship. It means you can make more ships per a given industrial capacity.

On the other hand the UFP had about a dozen or more different classes. Defiants, Mirandas, Excelciors, Galaxies, Nebulas, Akiras, Intrepids, Soverigns eventually... and no doubt more I haven't covered.

It also means incidentally that both the RSE and the IKE must have significantly poorer industrial capacity than the UFP. They have small numbers of classes, pretty much just D'Deridexes for the Romulans, and a 3-class tonnage ascendency (BOP / Vorcha / Negh'Var) for the Klingons, yet they were pretty much at parity with the UFP through the whole TNG era. And this is in spite f them both being much more militarily oriented states.

In the case of the Klingons a lot of this might be a continuing legacy of the Praxis disaster, not sure about the Romulans.
 
Well it all depends on the exact terms of the treaty, it could have been a withdrawl of all Dominion forces from the AQ/BQ.

A case could be made that the Federation actually in the end will come out stronger. I believe it was said that the Klingon and Romulan fleets were not in a state to attack the Dominion and that the Federation wouldn't let them. That implies that the Federation is still in a relative strong position.

As for being stronger, presuming it replaces all the ships it lost and more, they would be of newer designs rather than the more obsolete Miranda/Excelsior Classes which are getting on for being in the region of 80 year old designs, effectively nearing the end of their design life.
 
In the novels at least, the Dominion simply pulled back, returned to its base in the Gamma Quadrant, and basically stayed out of everyone's way.
 
The Doms took their ships and went home.

Made ya wonder what all the fighting was about.
They did demonstrate they were capable of underhanded tricks, though, thereby probably signing their death warrants because there was no way the Dominion could leave them alive now...

But the hammer will not fall immediately. The Founders think very long term.
 
It looked like it contained hundreds of ships, including several of those giganto mile-long battleships. Could be very useful in future if say the Borg attacked again...

As it happens, captured ships are not as useful as most would think in a technological society. Pretty much only be useful for refined materials, and maybe not even that.
 
The Dominion's ability to produce possible hundreds of ships in a few days, is what makes them dangerous.

It's not a coincidence that they can breed hundreds of functioning Jem Hadar soldiers in a few days, and also produce huge numbers of ships in a short time.

In a few short months they were able to build a massive fleet that almost single handedly conquered the Federation and Klingons-

The Jem Hadar probably build the ships-they don't sleep or rest-so it's ship building 24 hours a day.


I think the Federation phaser array design is smart-it can hit you from almost any angle, even when facing the opposite way or retreating.

As far as war and battle, the main fault with ship design is that Starfleet concentrated mainly on science instead of warfare.

But if they did, then they wouldn't be the Starfleet that we know...
 
I'd expect them to break up the fleet they were in a position to do that. Sending them back to the gamma quafrant in force would be stupid.
 
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