Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

[trevanian]

If I missed it in this thread, had there been any discussion of what of the Phase II test footage is included in this set? I read that it was in the "Making It So" segment. Anyone remember how much they showed?

Several years back I tried to find a way to get all those old transcripts from GEN and FC off the 3.5" floppies, but since it was done in a weird file format (I used one of those electronic typewriter thingies rather than a computer almost up till the end of the century), I couldn't salvage anything. I have maybe a thousand cut words from the GEN article on hard copy, but nothing relevant to this issue, unfortunately.

What format or which word processor type? There are services which will recover that data.

Also, re the 6-footer, I was surprised to learn that ILM had built in a nacelle cap flashing effect, since you never really see it on the show.

I've got no idea, maybe it was a Smith-Corona processor? I supposed I should research this, I know I kept a couple of the disks the last time I moved, so they should be here someplace.

Where did you hear about the nacelle flash thing, on the disks? Is it like the TOS effect or more like the FC one?

 

[Maurice]

^^^The Nacelle effect, which looks like swirling plasma is in this clip (6:55 seconds in):

[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nd8Jybu1ICA[/yt]

I see it's from "The Trek Not Taken" Blu-ray special feature. I'm mot sure but it might be one of those "get it if you buy it ay this store" features.

 

[FalTorPan]

Thought I'd chime in to defend the Enterprise-D. I love that design.

Carry on.

 

[jimbotron]

I'm glad I was finally able to see that. The model work is to me the most fascinating part of these remasters.

I notice they used the unused Booby Trap music for the underscore. I like little touches like that. Even though it's not in the episode, they make it part of the whole package regardless.

 

[Maxwell Everett]

^^^The Nacelle effect, which looks like swirling plasma is in this clip (6:55 seconds in):



I see it's from "The Trek Not Taken" Blu-ray special feature. I'm mot sure but it might be one of those "get it if you buy it ay this store" features.

Thanks for posting that! I thought I might never see it again due to trouble accessing Best Buy's moronic CinemaNow service. Entering my code again, which came with Season Three, didn't bring the video back either. And even with broadband internet, I still was never able to see it in anything but 480p! Now I can watch it whenever I want, and in 1080p! Based on the burned in German subs, this must be the version that was downloadable from Paramount Germany's website when customers bought Season Four.

 

[Warped Trekker]

This season is such a shame and a disgrace to fans and Star Trek. I can't believe the numerous mistakes, and shoddy VFX work done by "HTV Illuminate", now known as "Illuminate Hollywood". Grainy scenes, flat overall color. Just look at scenes where counselor Troi is sitting near a window with the starfield in back of her. Her hair is completely washed out and lacking any detail!

How could any VFX artist f*ck-up so badly on the shot of the Enterprise, where it wasn't aligned properly with the other layers? There is white outline around the saucer section in one scene! I'm terribly disappointed in Season 2. Not sure if it is all HTV Illuminate's fault, or Dan Curry, etc?

After season 7 is done, I would hope that CBS Digital would go back and redo season 2 properly. But it looks like we won't ever get redone, due to costs. Okuda said he was very happy with how season 2 turned out.

 

[jimbotron]

After season 7 is done, I would hope that CBS Digital would go back and redo season 2 properly. But it looks like we won't ever get redone, due to costs. Okuda said he was very happy with how season 2 turned out.

Like you said, too expensive to even consider. Even harder to roll out and sell.

I'm now of the opinion that the work done by HTV is simply "good enough". The effects work are an eyesore, sure, but I can live with it. I will still rewatch these episodes as I would the other seasons because I enjoy most of these episodes. The only thing that really ticks me off is when they crank up the DNR when there's a bluescreen element, because the quality changes dramatically from shot to shot:

DNR, no grain, very little detail
http://tng.trekcore.com/hd/albums/2x09/themeasureofaman_hd_076.jpg

Same scene, grain, detailed, textured:
http://tng.trekcore.com/hd/albums/2x09/themeasureofaman_hd_080.jpg

 

[Doug Otte]

After season 7 is done, I would hope that CBS Digital would go back and redo season 2 properly. But it looks like we won't ever get redone, due to costs. Okuda said he was very happy with how season 2 turned out.

Like you said, too expensive to even consider. Even harder to roll out and sell.

I'm now of the opinion that the work done by HTV is simply "good enough". The effects work are an eyesore, sure, but I can live with it. I will still rewatch these episodes as I would the other seasons because I enjoy most of these episodes. The only thing that really ticks me off is when they crank up the DNR when there's a bluescreen element, because the quality changes dramatically from shot to shot:

DNR, no grain, very little detail
http://tng.trekcore.com/hd/albums/2x09/themeasureofaman_hd_076.jpg

Same scene, grain, detailed, textured:
http://tng.trekcore.com/hd/albums/2x09/themeasureofaman_hd_080.jpg

I agree; it's very jarring, especially when the picture quality varies so much in the same scene.

We're going to have to convince ourselves that it's "good enough," because we'll never get a correction.

 

[NewHorizon]

We're going to have to convince ourselves that it's "good enough," because we'll never get a correction.

I'll never agree to it being 'good enough' because it isn't. It's a wart on an otherwise near perfect restoration. I'm stilling holding out to buy Season 2 used from a bargain bin. I simply don't have the money to toss out 30 to 60 dollars on something that's so poorly done. Could never justify it.

 

[Start Wreck]

It's a shame it wasn't given quite the same careful treatment, but it still looks better than the DVDs by quite a considerable margin and it could have been a hell of a lot worse. They could have just upscaled all the effects shots and called it a day.

It's still an impressive undertaking, they just didn't have the same quality control.

 

[trekker670]

It's a shame it wasn't given quite the same careful treatment, but it still looks better than the DVDs by quite a considerable margin and it could have been a hell of a lot worse. They could have just upscaled all the effects shots and called it a day.

It's still an impressive undertaking, they just didn't have the same quality control.

I agree completely. I was "disappointed" in S2, when compared to the other TNG-HD released, but compared to what else we have there's no comparison in quality.

 

[NewHorizon]

It's a shame it wasn't given quite the same careful treatment, but it still looks better than the DVDs by quite a considerable margin...

Folks like Mike Okuda were issuing statements like that about S2 being better than the DVD's and while that's true, it's a silly thing for them to say since it's expected that they would be better than the DVD's since it's an HD restoration. I can pop my old DVD's into a bluray player that does some type of upconversion magic and even it looks better than if I played it on an old DVD player.

I just don't think it's fair to put S2 BLU along side the S2 DVD and say it's better. I'm putting it along side S1 BLU. I expected it to be no lower in quality than S1, so that's my beef with it. I'll get it eventually for 5 bucks somewhere. I don't want a gap on the shelf.

Really looking forward to Season 6 though.

 

[jimbotron]

There's a common fallacy I've seen when Blu-rays are reviewed, and that's "it's better than DVD." So-and-so has heavy DNR, edge enhancement, and frozen or splotchy grain, but hey, it's an upgrade over the DVD, so buy it!

The original Blu-ray for Gladiator was "better than the DVD", but after a consumer frenzy, there was a remaster which clearly showed the original's shortcomings:

http://caps-a-holic.com/hd_vergleic...ch=gladiator_b1&action=1&lossless=0#vergleich

Compared the TNG season 2 DVD, the Blu-ray looks great. In fact, very authentic to the original episodes. While CBS-D improved the lighting on the Enterprise to make it look realistic, HTV replicated the same blown-out lighting from 1988.

 

[BillJ]

I was happy with season two.

 

[MakeshiftPython]

I'm content with it, but it's still disappointing, especially since guys like Dan Curry were involved you'd think it turn out much better. I would have likely been more disappointed if the third season was treated this way. Since it's only the second season, I'm not too upset. It could have been much worse. At the end of the day, this is likely the best quality we'll ever see of this season. I would be extremely surprised if CBS decided it would be worth it to redo it properly.

 

[Mage]

So, without going through 143 pages of discussion....

What's the actual problem with season 2, and do other seasons suffer from the same problem?

 

[jimbotron]

So, without going through 143 pages of discussion....

What's the actual problem with season 2, and do other seasons suffer from the same problem?

CBS farmed out production of season 2 to a different company, with poor results. CBS Digital (the main team) have completely worked on seasons 1, 3, 5, 6, and are working on 7. CBS Digital worked on most of season 4, with another effects house (this time supervised) with mostly positive reviews.

Only season 2 suffers this problem.

 

[Maxwell Everett]

So, without going through 143 pages of discussion....

What's the actual problem with season 2, and do other seasons suffer from the same problem?

• Overly softened live-action FX plates
• No matching film grain
• Poor bluescreen compositing with evident blue spill on actors and set pieces
• Fuzzy looking planets
• Flat, low-contrast color grading on the miniature footage
• Improper geometry of the Enterprise in certain shots
• Misaligned motion control passes

 

[Mage]

Hm.... My girlfriend and I were considering the blurays, kinda sad that season 2 is of a lesser quality. But if the rest of the seasons are good, I think we can deal with it.

 

[LOKAI of CHERON]

Hm.... My girlfriend and I were considering the blurays, kinda sad that season 2 is of a lesser quality. But if the rest of the seasons are good, I think we can deal with it.

Mage, don't be put off Season 2. Technically, it's certainly inferior to the other TNG BD's thus far released - but is neverheless vastly superior to the DVD's.