Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

[Scotty]

I think I seriously need to re-evaluate my opinion on the effects work on the release of season 2. I just saw this comparison of the exact same flyby shot.

Spoiler: disappointment ahead...

Season 1 (CBS D)

Season 2 (HTV)

Everything is off with the second picture. Low res planet, poor lighting on the Enterprise, poor blending of the elements, almost visible mattelines... Sigh....

 

[Timo47]

I am really noticing the added brightness in the orbital Enterprise and Enterprise versus the Borg cube shots and I don't think I like it. The general washed-out look of the composited models detracts from the sense of depth that is present in the original shots with more shading.

That's what's bodering me the most as well: the ships no longer blend in with the rest of the shot. I can live with a little inconsistency but not with space shots that simply look... bad.

I'm not going to cancel my order or anything but it is kind of disappointing. Hopefully they'll learn and Season 4 will be done with more care.

I'm seriously considering cancelling my pre-order. I was lucky to avoid the audio problems by holding out a bit on season 1 and seems like holding out on season 2 will be the sensible thing to do as well. I'm waiting for the reviews and a reaction from CBS on what clearly looks like a drop in quality.

 

[Scotty]

^I'm curious if any Blu Ray disc reviewers will notice it and mention it in their reviews.

 

[Timo47]

^Good point, since none of them noticed the audio issues. We'll see.

 

[TheSeeker]

I'd be curious to know if any of this feedback has made its way back to CBS.

 

[NewHorizon]

Yup, the shots on Trekcore are pretty poor quality.

HTV-Illuminate used the exact same starfield in 3 different shots. The thing is, the 3 shots were all from different camera angles. The original SD shots used different starfields, so where is the faithfulness to the originals there? Pure laziness.

 

[throwback]

What is known about this HTV-Illuminate? For me, it's worryingly when a company hasn't updated their web site since 2009 or 2010. Their news site ends in 2010.

http://www.htvinc.com/htv_index.html

I watch a program called "Checks, Please! Bay Area". On one of the episodes, one of the reviewers, who was employed as a restauranteur, said he emptied the sugar bowl when he visited a restaurant. If he finds the bowl clean, then the restaurant was managed well. However, if the bowl was dirty and had things in it - he once found coins in the bowl - than the restaurant wasn't managed well.

For me, I check a company's web site. If it was updated in the current year, preferably in the past few days or months, then this was a positive sign that the company was well managed. I am not feeling that way about the company in discussion.

According to one review, a worker who worked at this company for three months wasn't paid. Another worryingly sign.

https://foursquare.com/v/htv--illuminate/4b70bf65f964a520cf2c2de3

Did CBS Digital go on the cheap here? My experience was that when you go on the cheap, that the end product was always subpar.

 

[BillJ]

Did CBS Digital go on the cheap here? My experience was that when you go on the cheap, that the end product was always subpar.

CBS would be the ones writing the checks for this project, CBS-Digital is a subsidiary.

 

[throwback]

Thank you for clarifying. The question stands.

 

[NewHorizon]

Thank you for clarifying. The question stands.

They probably went with HTV-Illuminate since Dan Curry works there. Even if they did go with the lowest bid, that shouldn't automatically indicate shoddy work...it all comes down to how much the people working on it care about the product. If this place doesn't pay people, like the person on that website said, then it's a possibility that the place is populated with a group of disinterested, disillusioned workers.

The product we're seeing certainly doesn't reflect much in the way of 'love' for matching the look of Season 1 or even making Next Generation look good.

There is no love in those shots, it simply comes across as "get the job done and get paid".

 

[groundhog]

Any way they postpone the release if enough noise is made by fans? Or fix it for the complete series set?

 

[LOKAI of CHERON]

I'm seriously considering cancelling my pre-order. I was lucky to avoid the audio problems by holding out a bit on season 1 and seems like holding out on season 2 will be the sensible thing to do as well. I'm waiting for the reviews and a reaction from CBS on what clearly looks like a drop in quality.

I totally understand where you're coming from. The only problem with this is the likelihood of a product recall/disc replacement program. IMHO, it's zero. I'd love to be proven wrong - indeed - the ideal scenario would be to pull the plug now, start from scratch and release a quality set next year.

 

[NewHorizon]

I totally understand where you're coming from. The only problem with this is the likelihood of a product recall/disc replacement program. IMHO, it's zero. I'd love to be proven wrong - indeed - the ideal scenario would be to pull the plug now, start from scratch and release a quality set next year.

Yup, if it meant getting a consistent, quality product. I certainly wouldn't mind waiting longer. I sincerely hope CBS takes Seasons 4 and 6 away from HTV-Illuminate and gives CBS-Digital and extra 9 months or so to do it themselves.

Season 2 will never be fixed, but if we make our displeasure known...we may be able to save 4 and 6.

I was so happy with Season 1, and thought CBS had finally gotten their act together in order to do this right. It's such an utter disappointment to see them drop the ball like this...again. I thought they had learned their lesson about inconsistent quality after the nonsense with TOS:R, where quality was all over the place from episode to episode.

Thanks to HTV-Illuminate we get to enjoy the matte lines in HD!

I really don't understand what the heck they were thinking with this. I already own blurry planets abd matte lined, SD episodes of TNG on VHS and DVD. Why the heck would I pay to see blurry planets and matte lined episodes in HD? They expect people to pay top dollar for this???

I really don't understand how this could happen. If they're using the same or similar software, then they should be able to share all of their settings between effects houses to ensure continuity. It's 2012, there is no excuse...separate effects houses or not. We have all of this technology for sharing EVERYTHING....use it.

 

[throwback]

I think it should have been learned by now that not everyone who had an interest in a product is necessary looking out for that product. I am thinking of George Lucas. (I am one of those who is excited to see Star Wars under a Disney banner. After the failure of the prequels, in my opinion, the franchise can only go up.)

I am in agreement with people here that the work so far seen for the second season is terrible. I am familiar with the restoration process from the documentaries made to describe how they restored the first Star Wars trilogy. One of the first things they worked to reduce was the matte lines. If this restore company, who are working on season two, can't be bothered to remove the matte lines, what else they can't be bothered to remove?

 

[Falcor5]

Yup, the shots on Trekcore are pretty poor quality.

HTV-Illuminate used the exact same starfield in 3 different shots. The thing is, the 3 shots were all from different camera angles. The original SD shots used different starfields, so where is the faithfulness to the originals there? Pure laziness.

Wow that really is pretty lazy. So they actually in some cases are making the effects worse than the original.

Really getting nervous about the quality of the remastering work HTV-Illuminate is providing for these seasons. Wish CBS had just let CBS Digital handle them all in house and did not set an unrealistic release schedule.

 

[MickJo1701]

Any way they postpone the release if enough noise is made by fans? Or fix it for the complete series set?

If CBS do read these forums and take notice, they could do something to prevent this occurring for seasons 4 & 6 but you can bet its too late for season 2, its cocked and locked for release next month.

 

[Maxwell Everett]

I am in agreement with people here that the work so far seen for the second season is terrible.

Hyperbole isn't very constructive. These Season Two shots we're seeing aren't "terrible." They're just not up to the high standards set by CBS Digital on Season One. I have no problem with people expressing their disappointment with with these images (I've expressed my disappointment too), but to label these shots as "terrible," the people at CBS who may be reading this thread are just going to dismiss your comments entirely.

Stay level-headed, despite any frustration you may have... and try to use more accurate words to describe what you're seeing. We likely can't change what's been done, but we can maybe encourage them to re-focus their attention toward making sure the remaining seasons look better.

 

[TheSeeker]

^Well said.

 

[throwback]

Did you read my full thread?

"I am familiar with the restoration process from the documentaries made to describe how they restored the first Star Wars trilogy. One of the first things they worked to reduce was the matte lines. If this restore company, who are working on season two, can't be bothered to remove the matte lines, what else they can't be bothered to remove?"

I did provide an example of where they could improve. This failure to do so looks even worse on them. On their website, they tout themselves as leaders in digital restoration.

High Technology Video is a leader in the business of high definition telecine mastering and artifact free standards conversion.
The company's predominant focus is mastering feature films and television shows for domestic and international distribution. HTV also performs electronic restoration of images, as well as various types of duplication and audio work.
HTV is the only place in the world that can transfer 70mm and 65/70mm in real time, in both high definition and standard definition. It is a rapidly growing company with major studios and many independent companies as clients.

http://www.htvinc.net/content/content.php?content=About%20High%20Technology%20Video&subchoice=about-htv&subnav=about-htv&hx=553

We are committed to providing our studio and network clients the highest quality and execution," says Jim. "Our team demands top performance at every level and on every project. That's our promise to our clients - that's our DNA.

-Jim Hardy, CEO

http://www.htvinc.net/content/conte...ice=company-profiles&subnav=about-htv&hx=2500

I suggest that you too read their website, and then compare what they say to what we see.

For me, to describe what I see wrong, would be difficult. It's instinctual. I don't think CBS cares what hardcore fans say. They will care when we interact with them on a more physical level, as what happen with the audio issues on the first season set.

 

[NewHorizon]

Stay level-headed, despite any frustration you may have... and try to use more accurate words to describe what you're seeing. We likely can't change what's been done, but we can maybe encourage them to re-focus their attention toward making sure the remaining seasons look better.

Well, the simplest way I could put it would be to tell whoever is working on Seasons 4 and 6 to watch Season 1 and do THAT.

No matte lines, no blurry stars or planets, no washed out lighting.

Just stick to the style and quality of Season 1 for the remainder of the Seasons.