Saavik's First Spacdock Flight

[barnaclelapse]

I always thought McCoy was offering Kirk the tranquilizer because there was a sexy, well-endowed Kirstie Alley on the bridge and Kirk was going ga-ga over her. I either completely misinterpreted that scene or was trying to rationalize a scene that made no sense (since you put it that way).

That's what I always figured.

Kirk definitely had a thing for her on some level.

 

[JB2005]

^Why not?

Because that makes no sense and don't give me that well they didn't show them using the bathroom so its possible stuff, the audience isn't so stupid they would assume people don't pee in the future if it isn't shown where as a promotion has to be mentioned or it or noone knows about it and it probably didn't happen.

Plus if Sulu was going to be a captain it would have been sometime after they got back and that would have gone out the window the moment he helped Kirk steal the Enterprise no matter what the Federation president said.

And seeing as the cut Sulu promotion scene had ADMIRAL Kirk being the one to cut the orders, well guess who isn't an admiral anymore and as such has orders that now don't mean crap?

And forgetting all this name one thing (outside the novelizations of Treks II-IV) that points to Sulu being a captain or about to be promoted to captain besides a cut scene that probably dosen't even exist anymore.

Bear in mind...we're talking about the guy who kept it fairly quiet that he had a daughter...

 

[Hartzilla2007]

^Why not?

Because that makes no sense and don't give me that well they didn't show them using the bathroom so its possible stuff, the audience isn't so stupid they would assume people don't pee in the future if it isn't shown where as a promotion has to be mentioned or it or noone knows about it and it probably didn't happen.

Plus if Sulu was going to be a captain it would have been sometime after they got back and that would have gone out the window the moment he helped Kirk steal the Enterprise no matter what the Federation president said.

And seeing as the cut Sulu promotion scene had ADMIRAL Kirk being the one to cut the orders, well guess who isn't an admiral anymore and as such has orders that now don't mean crap?

And forgetting all this name one thing (outside the novelizations of Treks II-IV) that points to Sulu being a captain or about to be promoted to captain besides a cut scene that probably dosen't even exist anymore.

Bear in mind...we're talking about the guy who kept it fairly quiet that he had a daughter...

Yes but it was MENTIONED ONSCREEN at one point.

Also the the main problem eith Sulu's "secret promotion" is he has a commander rank pin in II, III, and IV and was said to be a commander in V.

 

[Hartzilla2007]

In the novelizations, yes he was.

Yeah and in the TMP novelization Kirk was named after his mom's first love instructor, humans existed in some psychic sex orgy thing, their were rumors in Starfleet that Kirk and Spock were lovers, and the events of TOS were said to be exaggerated propaganda Starfleet released for somw reason probably to increase recruitment. Are you saying all this stuff should count too?

 

[Peach Wookiee]

I think the Kirk/Spock-shipping was mentioned as a thing to those who thought Jim and Spock were gay...

 

[Ssosmcin]

Saavik may not have been handling the helm herself but she was certainly the "ship's driver" or "pilot" at the time. In the navy, the person in charge of the bridge, say an Officer of the Deck or Officer of the Watch, is the ship's driver responsible for the supervision of the helm and safe maneuvering of the vessel. Many USN officers who aspire to be ship's captains, the most skilled ship drivers, must train in difficult maneuvers and take the "conn" in both simiulated (similar to the Kobayashi Maru simulator without the Klingons and the no-win stuff) and actual sea operations as part of their continued training and development.

Which is cool, but Saavik's job consisted of giving two orders. It didn't seem like a complex maneuver. "Here, do these things, Sulu" and then they were done. I can see this being a command exercise, but nothing for Kirk to get nervous about.

 

[Timo]

...OTOH, I'd suppose that harbor areas are where officers in peacetime command of ships today make the mistakes with the most serious consequences, the ones with the most damage and the greatest risk of loss of life. If one screws up in wargames on open ocean, it's usually just a case of some lost time, or perhaps an expensively misfired dummy missile or somesuch. But if one screws up while approaching a pier, or maneuvering next to a replenishment ship, an entire ship or two might be reduced to irrepairable scrap.

The same probably holds true for peacetime Starfleet ops. Saavik needs to learn to supervise during critical operations, and this is one of them. Spock might have made this a training event, or then not; Saavik cannot know which decision Spock made, and Kirk cannot know, either. Perhaps Sulu has been instructed to (almost?) tear out the moorings if Saavik forgets to order their clearing? Perhaps Sulu has been instructed to fake a thruster misfire? It is a tense moment for the trainee, and for her instructor (or Academy Commandant on a pleasure cruise, or whatnot), and it is only after the moment has passed that those involved can breathe out and decide that there was no reason to be tense after all.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Ryan Thomas Riddle]

Which is cool, but Saavik's job consisted of giving two orders. It didn't seem like a complex maneuver. "Here, do these things, Sulu" and then they were done. I can see this being a command exercise, but nothing for Kirk to get nervous about.

What Timo said...

...OTOH, I'd suppose that harbor areas are where officers in peacetime command of ships today make the mistakes with the most serious consequences, the ones with the most damage and the greatest risk of loss of life.

Despite it appearing "simple," docking and disembarkation can be one of the most difficult and dangerous maneuvers, and a lot of young officers spend a lot of time practicing it.

 

[AthanisTree]

Fascinating: I've never considered that Kirk might be nervous as to the capability of the Cadet in the Center-seat nor the 'Saavik is hot' theory..

Had always thought that Kirks look of unease stemmed from the sense of time slipping by that crops up in the film- his son is grown-up, cadets crew the old warhorse Enterprise and an enemy from Kirks brash past pops up to recite Shakespeare and play hide-the-bomb in a nebula.

Considering the power-play importance of the Center-seat throughout TOS and the films, I always read his vaguely bizarre look as one-part Shatner, two-parts "I'm old, these kids are good, where's my blanket?" and three parts, "That's my chair, it's my ship- shift it!" As previous posters have pointed out, Sulu is in charge of the helm and he hadn't crashed the ship previously (?) - why be nervous..?

 

[Captain59]

Some people really need to grab the rod and pull out of arse about canon. If people want to believe Sulu became captain in three weeks, so be it. Stop being so damned annoying.

 

[Colonel Midnight]

Which is cool, but Saavik's job consisted of giving two orders. It didn't seem like a complex maneuver. "Here, do these things, Sulu" and then they were done. I can see this being a command exercise, but nothing for Kirk to get nervous about.

What Timo said...

...OTOH, I'd suppose that harbor areas are where officers in peacetime command of ships today make the mistakes with the most serious consequences, the ones with the most damage and the greatest risk of loss of life.

Despite it appearing "simple," docking and disembarkation can be one of the most difficult and dangerous maneuvers, and a lot of young officers spend a lot of time practicing it.

Indeed. He's the CO of one of the largest ships in Starfleet.

I would hazard to say that (at least in RL)... the first time any CO looks relaxed while HIS (or HERS) ship is being maneuvered near a pier, mooring, or a similar situation... they shouldn't be the CO anymore. That's my experience, at least.

Just IMO, of course.

Cheers,
-CM-

 

[Shazam!]

Maybe the sensors were turned off so if Saavik got it wrong, Sulu would crash the ship. I'd imagine being able to manoeuvre almost blind is required training.

That's how I saw it anyway.

 

[Hober Mallow]

Kirk was nervous that once Saavik got in his chair and started giving orders, she was going to find out just how f*cking easy his job actually is.

 

[Ssosmcin]

Kirk was nervous that once Saavik got in his chair and started giving orders, she was going to find out just how f*cking easy his job actually is.

Now THAT is the answer I buy!