Agreed, thought I didn't zone out. This may be a season that, due to it's serialized nature, should not be judged on an episode-by-episode basis and instead be judged as a whole when it is all said and done.
S13E01 "The Halloween Apocalypse" BBC1 6.25pm 31st October
- Thread starter StCoop
- Start date
Agreed, thought I didn't zone out. This may be a season that, due to it's serialized nature, should not be judged on an episode-by-episode basis and instead be judged as a whole when it is all said and done.
Karvanista is a good boy.
I mostly enjoyed that. It was a bit fun with lots of things going on. Good, but not great. I like Dan. It's hard to judge this episode in isolation. Much of it was clearly there to set up later events.
Claire is obviously more than meets the eye. She already knew the Angel was going to be there. And taking the long way home has to refer to time travel. So, she was there to get sent back in time. I'm just not sure why she tried to resist blinking.
The season opener has my interest. Let's hope Chibnall can keep this level up for the season. I'm reminded of Skyfall part 1 and that it seemed to start a promising new season.
Claire is obviously more than meets the eye. She already knew the Angel was going to be there. And taking the long way home has to refer to time travel. So, she was there to get sent back in time. I'm just not sure why she tried to resist blinking.
The season opener has my interest. Let's hope Chibnall can keep this level up for the season. I'm reminded of Skyfall part 1 and that it seemed to start a promising new season.
Yeah, right.
That was excellent.
I honestly don't understand why 'perceived fan wisdom' has cast the Chibnall Era as a disappointment or disaster thus far, because from where I sit there's been very little about the 23 episodes (and counting) that he's helped deliver that hasn't worked, and the more I experience of ' Classic Who', the more I come to appreciate the approach he's taking and the degree to which he's integrating the franchise's past and present.
Case in point: Starting off The Halloween Apocalypse with Thirteen and Yaz in peril in the midst of an adventure is quintessential 'Classic Who', but the tone and presentation of the story is decidedly 'modern' and smacks very much of stories like "Rose", "Partners in Crime", and pretty much every Finale from the Russell T. Davies era of the show... something that I find totally apprapos given that RTD is the one to whom Chibnall will be handing the baton next.
Beyond continuing the blending of 'Classic Who' homage with 'Modern Who' tone and presentation, this episode was also quintessential Chibnall, putting the emphasis on quick and dirty character establishment as a function of plot development and asking the viewer to strap in and enjoy the proverbial ride and expecting that they can and will.
Some people might argue that the story threw far too much at viewers all at once, but the way I see it is that by packing as much into the narrative as it did, The Halloween Apocalypse primed the pump for so much more to come over the course of the next five episodes and promises an epic adventure in the same way that a good book does, making it so that you can't wait to find out what's going to happen next.
I also appreciated the way that the episode blended the 'there isn't really a villain' narrative trope that was present in roughly half of Series 12 and most of Series 11 with a clear villainous scheme and a proper creepy and brand-new bad guy who clearly has the kind of history with the Doctor that you'd expect from foes like the Daleks and the Master, and thought it was exceptionally clever of Chibnall to reveal that the Doctor only saw Karvanista as an adversary because he was using aggressive tactics to try and stop her from interfering in his mission - and the wider mission of the Lupari in general - to save humanity from the Flux.
I honestly don't understand why 'perceived fan wisdom' has cast the Chibnall Era as a disappointment or disaster thus far, because from where I sit there's been very little about the 23 episodes (and counting) that he's helped deliver that hasn't worked, and the more I experience of ' Classic Who', the more I come to appreciate the approach he's taking and the degree to which he's integrating the franchise's past and present.
Case in point: Starting off The Halloween Apocalypse with Thirteen and Yaz in peril in the midst of an adventure is quintessential 'Classic Who', but the tone and presentation of the story is decidedly 'modern' and smacks very much of stories like "Rose", "Partners in Crime", and pretty much every Finale from the Russell T. Davies era of the show... something that I find totally apprapos given that RTD is the one to whom Chibnall will be handing the baton next.
Beyond continuing the blending of 'Classic Who' homage with 'Modern Who' tone and presentation, this episode was also quintessential Chibnall, putting the emphasis on quick and dirty character establishment as a function of plot development and asking the viewer to strap in and enjoy the proverbial ride and expecting that they can and will.
Some people might argue that the story threw far too much at viewers all at once, but the way I see it is that by packing as much into the narrative as it did, The Halloween Apocalypse primed the pump for so much more to come over the course of the next five episodes and promises an epic adventure in the same way that a good book does, making it so that you can't wait to find out what's going to happen next.
I also appreciated the way that the episode blended the 'there isn't really a villain' narrative trope that was present in roughly half of Series 12 and most of Series 11 with a clear villainous scheme and a proper creepy and brand-new bad guy who clearly has the kind of history with the Doctor that you'd expect from foes like the Daleks and the Master, and thought it was exceptionally clever of Chibnall to reveal that the Doctor only saw Karvanista as an adversary because he was using aggressive tactics to try and stop her from interfering in his mission - and the wider mission of the Lupari in general - to save humanity from the Flux.
Well, I can hope!
But, as I mentioned, the opener for last season seemed promising . . . but that was lost by part two. It was an improvement over the previous season at least a bit.
I thought it was a confusing, hot mess but then I'm an old fart. Not terrible per se but seemingly heavily influenced by what I imagine modern video games are like - not that I go anywhere near them. I expect I'm many decades outside the target demographic. It was almost impossible to hear the dialogue over the music and sound effects. I had to resort to subtitles from the start. I also wonder how some viewers are going to cope with all the various northern, non-RP English accents.
Was ruminating some more about this. I think Dan is clearly more important to what's going on than it seems. It can't be mere coincidence that Karvanista somehow got to Earth ahead of his battalion, and nor can it be coincidental that Dan's romantic interest was kidnapped by the big bads. Given Claire's 'long way around' ' we haven't met yet' comments it seems likely there'll be some timey-wimey'ness going on.
It won't surprise me if we eventually learn that the "accidental" acceleration Karvanista hit to get to Earth quicker was intentional, with the Doctor herself travelling back to ensure he gets there first.
It won't surprise me if we eventually learn that the "accidental" acceleration Karvanista hit to get to Earth quicker was intentional, with the Doctor herself travelling back to ensure he gets there first.
Can't get into this, too many northerners in it
If that's the case, if you're that is afraid of getting bad reviews and don't want to promote the show in any way, you shouldn't be working on television. Or anywhere in the entertainment industry, at all.
I suppose the big question will be, does the highly serialsed nature (much more than I though it was going to be TBH) put people off or keep them watching?
Enjoyable episode, though I agree with the criticisms about there being a lot thrown in. Of course, given the serialized nature of this season, this episode is more about set-up and introductions then anything else, so it may be more prudent to hold off too many judgements until the season is finished, though it is an enjoyable start.
Not the show's fault at all, but you can certainly see how the pandemic is impacting the production somewhat. There sure didn't seem to be very many trick-or-treaters out on Halloween night, and the bridge of the Sontaran ship is very lightly staffed.
Not the show's fault at all, but you can certainly see how the pandemic is impacting the production somewhat. There sure didn't seem to be very many trick-or-treaters out on Halloween night, and the bridge of the Sontaran ship is very lightly staffed.
I also found some of the dialogue hard to hear. Part of this is how modern tv and films are often mixed, part is that I’m nearly 50 and have listened to loud rock music most of my life and part of it was how Jodie and Mandip speak. People used to complain that Capaldi was hard to make out, but being from Ireland, I had no difficulty with his crisp Scottish pronunciation and I also find John Bishop very easy to understand.
Finally got a chance to watch the episode and wow, what an opening. Lots of moving parts that I'm hoping will gel together as the season progresses. For the most part, the main focus is fairly clear with the Flux as universal destructive force that appears to be controlled by Swarm, apparently an ancient enemy of The Doctor's, or more likely, the Timeless Child, considering The Doctor doesn't recognize him.
The mad dash introduction of Dan via Karvanistra who was similarly introduced quickly as a villain but is now a reluctant ally fits the swift pace of the rest episode. We're also rapidly introduced to some 19th century tunnellers, classic Sontarans tracking the Flux, the outpost watcher Vinder who we already knew was going to be important, Swarm's sister who was in hiding not unlike The Fugitive Doctor, and Claire, a mysterious woman who The Doctor and Yaz will meet in their future who is being chased after a Weeping Angel. Oh, and Dan's not-a-girlfriend friend, Diane, who gets kidnapped by Azure in perhaps a coincidence too many.
I really enjoyed the rollercoaster ride and I might rewatch the episode again ahead of next week's episode to see how well everything fits together. Lots of mysteries run around, not just the Flux and whatever Swarm's motives might be, but also The Division that The Doctor is so concerned about, which may or may not also tie in with the Timeless Child.
Perhaps this is just me, but when I first saw Swarm and his changing crystal form, I immediately thought of Eldrad (especially since there were two different actors playing him). Considering The Doctor doesn't seem to recognize him, I'm guessing it's nothing to do with Eldrad but the similarities still stood out.
The mad dash introduction of Dan via Karvanistra who was similarly introduced quickly as a villain but is now a reluctant ally fits the swift pace of the rest episode. We're also rapidly introduced to some 19th century tunnellers, classic Sontarans tracking the Flux, the outpost watcher Vinder who we already knew was going to be important, Swarm's sister who was in hiding not unlike The Fugitive Doctor, and Claire, a mysterious woman who The Doctor and Yaz will meet in their future who is being chased after a Weeping Angel. Oh, and Dan's not-a-girlfriend friend, Diane, who gets kidnapped by Azure in perhaps a coincidence too many.
I really enjoyed the rollercoaster ride and I might rewatch the episode again ahead of next week's episode to see how well everything fits together. Lots of mysteries run around, not just the Flux and whatever Swarm's motives might be, but also The Division that The Doctor is so concerned about, which may or may not also tie in with the Timeless Child.
Perhaps this is just me, but when I first saw Swarm and his changing crystal form, I immediately thought of Eldrad (especially since there were two different actors playing him). Considering The Doctor doesn't seem to recognize him, I'm guessing it's nothing to do with Eldrad but the similarities still stood out.
Last edited:
^ The Division is absolutely connected to the Timeless Child; The Timeless Children couldn't have made that more clear.
A couple of things I forgot to mention:
I loved the Nitro 9 reference! I wonder what Ace would think of The Doctor now actively using it herself instead of relying on someone like Ace. Especially considering the recent Sophie Aldred novel with the two of them meeting and I believe The Doctor chastised her for using it again (but I could be recalling incorrectly).
Even though the cold open ended up connecting directly with the season arc, I really enjoyed seeing The Doctor and Yaz having their own adventure together before meeting Dan as well as getting references to other past adventures. I can't wait to listen to Big Finish's audio plays filling in that gap...but it still makes me sad we won't get a season of just The Doctor and Yaz.
I loved the Nitro 9 reference! I wonder what Ace would think of The Doctor now actively using it herself instead of relying on someone like Ace. Especially considering the recent Sophie Aldred novel with the two of them meeting and I believe The Doctor chastised her for using it again (but I could be recalling incorrectly).
Even though the cold open ended up connecting directly with the season arc, I really enjoyed seeing The Doctor and Yaz having their own adventure together before meeting Dan as well as getting references to other past adventures. I can't wait to listen to Big Finish's audio plays filling in that gap...but it still makes me sad we won't get a season of just The Doctor and Yaz.
Oh, that's cool! I didn't know that was connected to a historical event so thank you for pointing that out. I do love it when Doctor Who delves into real-world mysteries and comes up with their own explanation.
Yeah, there's definitely some timey-wimey wonkiness going on. Not just Claire's situation, with her going the long way around suggests she's already been zapped by a Weeping Angel before (so are we going to see two versions of her in later episodes?), but also the coincidences involving both Dan and Diana (why were they both independently targeted by different people and now have a connection with The Doctor?) and how this all relates to the Liverpool tunnels.
Oh I agree, and even bad publicity is still publicity.
Well maybe the fact that it's just six episodes will help with that, it will be interesting to see what happens. I still don't think the BBC have pushed the six episodes, one story narrative enough though.
The amount of "jam packed" material may also have been the result of fewer episodes commissioned. I mean, wasn't the series going to have 10, or at least 8, and then some point along the way, it was trimmed to the we're finally getting? If originally planned for a longer run, I can imagine the writers trying restructure the scripts to fit within 6 episodes, making them even faster paced than what they might have been otherwise.
Not too bad, I thought much more worked than didn't and it put me in mind of RTD/Moffat a bit. I can't put my finger on exactly what without going back and comparing but the picture seemed brighter and more open, I think they used to rely more on closeups and muted colors. I liked the more active Yaz, felt a little like Ace with how she interacts with the Doctor (or maybe we rearrange Yaz as Ayz
). I like new guy and the way he rolls with things and processes them and dog guy is fun. Graham and Ryan were alright but I think this story would've been harder to execute with them around.
I've tried to get through Timeless Child twice now and switched off before the end so this was quite an improvement for me. Still don't care about that storyline at all but whatever. It's too bad we couldn't get two multi-episode arcs of some kind this season but here's hoping this one is decent enough if a bit short.
). I like new guy and the way he rolls with things and processes them and dog guy is fun. Graham and Ryan were alright but I think this story would've been harder to execute with them around.I've tried to get through Timeless Child twice now and switched off before the end so this was quite an improvement for me. Still don't care about that storyline at all but whatever. It's too bad we couldn't get two multi-episode arcs of some kind this season but here's hoping this one is decent enough if a bit short.