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RTD address criticism about his writing style

Samurai8472

Admiral
Admiral
Since we've been picking apart the new book "The Writers tale" I thought this part was interesting

http://www.sfx.co.uk/page/sfx?entry=20_things_we_learnt_from

Discussing re-watching a repeat of “The Sound Of Drums”, he ponders the fact that you suddenly learn about things like the Archangel network, the Valiant, and the TARDIS becoming a Paradox Machine out of nowhere, with no advance seeding or foreshadowing in the script. It’s a fascinating passage, worth quoting at length: “I can see how annoying that looks. I can see how maddening it must be, for some people. Especially if you’re imposing really classical script structures and templates on that episode, even unconsciously. I must look like a vandal, a kid or an amateur… The simple fact is, all those things were planned. All of them were my choice. They’re not lazy, clumsy or desperate. They’re chosen. I can see more traditional ways of telling those stories, but I’m not interested. I think the stuff that you gain from writing in this way – the shock, the whirlwind, the freedom, the exhilaration – is worth the world. I’ve got this sort of tumbling, freewheeling style that somersaults along, with everything happening now - not later, not before, but now, now, now. I’ve made a Doctor Who that exists in the present tense. It’s happening now, right in front of your eyes! If you don’t like it, if you don’t join in with it then… blimey, these episodes must be nonsensical. But those classical structures can be seen in Primeval, in Demons, in Merlin, in all of them – and yet we stand with millions more viewers. And I think that’s partly why.

Sounds like he just makes things up off the cuff

"I live in the moment!"

>_>
 
It's cute that he thinks its his writing that draws in the audience. As opposed to the brand name and adoration for the characters alone.
 
It's cute that he thinks its his writing that draws in the audience. As opposed to the brand name and adoration for the characters alone.
In my case, it did. I had the vaguest idea about Doctor Who before his term, and I had never watched the show. Now, his writing has its faults, but it kept me entertained.
 
It's cute that he thinks its his writing that draws in the audience. As opposed to the brand name and adoration for the characters alone.

Cute, eh? :) ...Without the writing, the rest of that is rubbish, especially to the Doctor Who audience... I think Davies is a wonderfully artful scribe, and perhaps the only man could revive DW at the time. It's a brilliantly done series, and I must credit the man soley for it's ressurection. Tennant was just gravy to an already great series, and was hand picked by Davies even before Eccleston, saying even more about his genius... Davies has certainly earned my respect to be sure.
 
I love how someone thinks that everyone flocking to their television sets on a Saturday night are all doing so out of loyalty to the doctor who name. Now I haven't always liked RTD and often have problems with his endings in paticular but even I admit that he is a popular much loved writer whose stories entertain.
 
Oh hang on, I just responded to all this where it was posted in the other topic. I'll copy and paste.




See, that's a quote that really gets to me. He seems arrogant and irritating.
Rustbucket said:
"I must look like a vandal, a kid or an amateur… The simple fact is, all those things were planned. All of them were my choice. They’re not lazy, clumsy or desperate."
I think they probably are.
"They’re chosen. I can see more traditional ways of telling those stories, but I’m not interested."
Not capable more like.
"If you don’t like it, if you don’t join in with it then… blimey, these episodes must be nonsensical."
Something either makes sense or it doesn't. These things often don't but he throws so many things in there so that we hopefully won't notice. And sadly, it seems to work.
"But those classical structures can be seen in Primeval, in Demons, in Merlin, in all of them – and yet we stand with millions more viewers. And I think that’s partly why."
I think it's more to do with the Doctor Who name and all that comes with it (Daleks, TARDIS...), the budget and commitment behind it, and the easy publicity.
 
"But those classical structures can be seen in Primeval, in Demons, in Merlin, in all of them – and yet we stand with millions more viewers. And I think that’s partly why."
I think it's more to do with the Doctor Who name and all that comes with it (Daleks, TARDIS...), the budget and commitment behind it, and the easy publicity.

Right, that's why the TV movie version did so well... :p
 
"But those classical structures can be seen in Primeval, in Demons, in Merlin, in all of them – and yet we stand with millions more viewers. And I think that’s partly why."
I think it's more to do with the Doctor Who name and all that comes with it (Daleks, TARDIS...), the budget and commitment behind it, and the easy publicity.

Right, that's why the TV movie version did so well... :p
Got a fair amount of viewers in the UK, didn't it?

There's also the argument that having nonsense stories that look flashy but don't make sense have more general appeal, because a lot of people are idiots. Doesn't make the stories any good, merely appealing to the undemanding.
 
It's cute that he thinks its his writing that draws in the audience. As opposed to the brand name and adoration for the characters alone.

:guffaw::guffaw::guffaw::guffaw::guffaw::guffaw: :guffaw:

Yes, that's what makes it the second or third most popular program on British television: The brand name of a cheap, poorly-written, cheesily-acted children's program that had been off the air for a decade and a half and which had represented hammy productions with incredibly small, geeky, niche audiences when it was on.

That's why millions of Britons love the thing!
 
I think the stuff that you gain from writing in this way – the shock, the whirlwind, the freedom, the exhilaration – is worth the world. I’ve got this sort of tumbling, freewheeling style that somersaults along, with everything happening now - not later, not before, but now, now, now. I’ve made a Doctor Who that exists in the present tense. It’s happening now, right in front of your eyes!

Exactly so - that sums up a great deal of why I enjoy nuWho so much and what separates it from the mediocre and - yes, mundane - skiffy shows that rear up from the muck of television and trudge on for years. I'm a little surprised that Davies is self-aware enough about the process to sum it up that neatly.

Brilliant!

What Davies succeeded in doing for a dead kiddie franchise is now safe beyond the complaints of the would-be and armchair "producer/writers" on the Internet. He's the only reason you have the opportunity to see the forthcoming Adventures of Forehead Boy series at all.
 
The thing is, RTD is capable of planning things out ahead of time and laying the groundwork. He does it every year with his season arcs. Then, when it comes to an episode, everything comes out of the blue. You can make things look like they're happening now while still laying some groundwork. Now, I enjoy the episodes, but he certainly takes no effort of taking away some camp when he pulls things out of the blue like he does. I don't think it makes him a bad writer, I just think it's part of what makes him hit and miss.
 
I think it's more to do with the Doctor Who name and all that comes with it (Daleks, TARDIS...), the budget and commitment behind it, and the easy publicity.

Right, that's why the TV movie version did so well... :p
Got a fair amount of viewers in the UK, didn't it?
Not enough to jumpstart a new series as it was intended


There's also the argument that having nonsense stories that look flashy but don't make sense have more general appeal, because a lot of people are idiots. Doesn't make the stories any good, merely appealing to the undemanding.

Whatever you gotta tell yourself... :p

It's cool, Doctor Who isn't for every taste, cheers !!
 
I had heard about Doctor Who before I started watching it, my dad used to watch the old Doctor Who when he was younger, and from what I heard of it, it didn't really strike me as all that interesting. My mom started watching Torchwood off iTunes early last year, and got me to watch it, and that really sucked me in. I thought it was very interesting, and when my mom and I found out that Captain Jack had started on Doctor Who and had more story to him there, we decided we would watch those episodes so we could see everything there was about Captain Jack. Watching those episodes of Doctor Who is what got me into Doctor Who. It wasn't the fact that it was Doctor Who at all. It was the story. I got into Doctor Who because of the STORY, not the brand or adoration of the characters. It was the story that got me into Doctor Who. I ended up liking Doctor Who more than Torchwood. I've now got every single episode of Doctor Who from Rose up to The End Of Time on my computer. It's certainly not because of the brand or adoration of the characters that got me into the show, it was entirely the story that pulled me in. If it wasn't for the story pulling me in then I probably would not have watched Doctor Who beyond the 5 episodes from season 1, 3 from season 3, and 2 from season 4 that had Jack in them. To sit there and say that everyone watches it only because of their love of the characters or the fact that it is Doctor Who in general is just ridiculous. That might make up a portion of the viewers, yes, but there ARE plenty of people who watch it for the story which comes from RTD and the rest of the Doctor Who writing staff.
 
Exactly. If anything, I came to Davies' DW with a mild bias against the whole thing - I've found DW fitfully amusing and just as often annoyingly limited for decades. The characters, stories and tone of nuWho sucked me right in.

As for calling folks who enjoy this kind of story "idiots" - I've read enough of that poster's previous observations not to feel overmatched from that quarter in regard to taste or intelligence.
 
Repeating something I asked in "The End of Time, Part 2"'s thread...

I'm always curious... Plenty of posters have claimed that RTD is a poor writer with difficulty controlling his writing process, or that he's incapable of writing a more traditionally-structured script than he tends to write with Doctor Who.

So my question is...

What of his work, outside of Who and its related projects, have those of you who think this seen to come to that conclusion?

Remember, RTD isn't just a sci-fi/Who writer. The guy's written things like The Grand, Touching Evil, Queer As Folk, Bob and Rose, The Second Coming, Casanova, and Mine All Mine. Mainstream shows for the Not We.

Bottom line.... RTD is essentially saying that he willingly chooses to write in a specific style that some find off-putting or amateurish when he writes Doctor Who. The most rational way to test whether this is a trait of his writing in general -- and therefore to test whether or not he is capable of writing a more traditional structure -- is to have a comprehensive overview of his non-Who-related credits.

Has anyone done that?

(For the record, I haven't seen anything by RTD outside of Who.)
 
It will be fun to see all the literary geniuses with all their published successful work come in here to poo poo him.

I hate this attitude. I can't criticise his work unless I have a comparable career? Balls.

That said, I love RTD, but trying to pass poor writing off as progressive... lol troll

Note: I did not call him a poor writer. I happen to think he's a visonary genius, just a bloody lazy one sometimes.

It's cute that he thinks its his writing that draws in the audience. As opposed to the brand name and adoration for the characters alone.

You have got to be kidding. Before the new series started, even in the UK, Doctor Who was a running joke. It's very name was used as a synonym for "shoddy production". RTD brought it back and completely changed the way it was perceived. That takes balls, luck, and a shitload of talent. People had to be convinced by the show to return or they wouldn't have, because frankly, brand name recognition alone would killed it off, not helped its chances.
 
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