Ron Jones' firing was an omen.

[CorporalCaptain]

I'm so tired of fans with tunnel-vision and who can't seem to find the quality aspects in TREK after just one aspect (Ron Jones leaving) has been changed.

Wow, who said anything like that in this thread?

The original poster, who said that this signaled the end of quality TREK, so I was really just responding to his statement.

What the OP claimed was that firing Ron Jones was the first of many sins of micromanaging that Rick Berman committed. The OP didn't say that Ron Jones' leaving itself alone ruined everything after, and he didn't get specific about what other ways Berman micromanaged Star Trek into blandness. He did however claim that Ron Jones might have made it less bland. That's all the OP's assertion, though, not mine.

Or at least, that's how I read the OP.

 

[Lance]

The scores composer Ron Jones made for the early seasons of TNG made some abyssmal episodes tolerable. With his firing, it seemed like it was the beginning of Rick Berman's micromanaging of Trek under the guise of Gene's vision to the point that it became as bland and safe as the music. Imagine how the most thrilling moments in Trek, the Borg at Wolf 359, the skirmishes outside Deep Space Nine, would have been enhanced moreso with Jones' scoring instead of the generic string section falling asleep the post Jones music had. It seemed like a signaling of the end of quality Trek.

Jones did score "The Best of Both Worlds".

I suspect the OP probably meant the actual battle, as seen later in the DS9 pilot.

I mean, don't misunderstand me, there's nothing wrong with Denis McCarthy's score there. But Berman's directive for what he called 'wallpaper music' had very much taken hold like a cancer at the point they shot that. And it does create something of an unfortunate contrast to Jones' rousing bombastic score on BOBW itself. One can't help but be left wondering how Jones might have handled that scene...

I think Jones himself summed it up the best when he said on the TNG Blu Ray how a film composer being told not to use music to drive the emotions of the audience is like an Anathema. Directing the emotions of the viewer is a film composers' job!

I just don't think Berman 'got' it. It was probably his experience (which was mostly in documentaries prior to Star Trek) that was blinding him to how drama is actually supposed to work.

 

[TV's Frank]

Wow, who said anything like that in this thread?

The original poster, who said that this signaled the end of quality TREK, so I was really just responding to his statement.

What the OP claimed was that firing Ron Jones was the first of many sins of micromanaging than Rick Berman committed. The OP didn't say that Ron Jones' leaving itself alone ruined everything after, and he didn't get specific about what other ways Berman micromanaged Star Trek into blandness. He did however claim that Ron Jones might have made it less bland. That's all the OP's assertion, though, not mine.

Or at least, that's how I read the OP.

I can see how the OP's statement could also be interpreted that way, I was just taking his final assessment at face value, but maybe it shouldn't be taken out of context.

 

[LMFAOschwarz]

Good points on both sides here.

True, these are not music videos, and the story of course comes first. But again, no reason to not let the music stand out at times when appropriate.

If the show had featured pieces of 'popular, contemporary music by today's artists', I think you can be damn sure it would have been right up front in the sound mix. Drama and storytelling would've taken a back seat to commercial considerations...

 

[Hober Mallow]

That doesn’t mean, as some people have interpreted it, that I wanted dull, boring music.

I think the perception that Berman wanted dull boring music comes less from anything Jones has said than from the fact that, well... we got lots of dull boring music on TNG.

 

[LMFAOschwarz]

Maybe we all got spoiled by the original series, in which the music was generally outstanding, i.e. Conscience of the King, The Paradise Syndrome...there are really terrific, quality compositions floating around that show.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

Another example of when music comes to the foreground: Patton, music by Jerry Goldsmith. How much less of a movie it would have been without the echoplex trumpets? How much less without the brilliantly orchestrated main theme?

It would seem that Ancient Warship / Promellian Vessel by Ron Jones is quite obviously inspired by the echoplex trumpets in Goldsmith's Patton.

 

[LMFAOschwarz]

Another example of when music comes to the foreground: Patton, music by Jerry Goldsmith. How much less of a movie it would have been without the echoplex trumpets? How much less without the brilliantly orchestrated main theme?

It would seem that Ancient Warship / Promellian Vessel by Ron Jones is quite obviously inspired by the echoplex trumpets in Goldsmith's Patton.

Wow! I never connected those particular dots before. Nice!

 

[jimbotron]

Rick Berman is in denial. His claim is that he fired Ron Jones because his music brought too much attention to itself. In other words, he did not like Jones' music, and fired him. But any fan with a decent ear can agree that Jones' music was great and boosted the show, often improving the episodes he composed. So that means, yes Rick, you don't like good music.

I can think of several examples of music that brings attention to itself, chiefly among them Star Wars. Would Berman fire John Williams if he could?

It usually one takes a few notes at the beginning of an episode to recognize a Jones score, they're very distinctive. BOBW aside, my favorites are Booby Trap and A Matter of Perspective. The music of the hijack scene in 11001001 is awesome.

 

[LMFAOschwarz]

It usually one takes a few notes at the beginning of an episode to recognize a Jones score, they're very distinctive. BOBW aside, my favorites are Booby Trap and A Matter of Perspective. The music of the hijack scene in 11001001 is awesome.

I watched that one about a month ago, not having seen it in about 15 years, and I really got caught up in that hijack scene. You're right: the music definitely propels the drama. From the moment in engineering when Data and Geordi determined that the antimatter containment was failing, the music really provided the backbone to the scene. Movie-quality stuff.

You know, it's entirely possible that Rick Berman may simply have a tin ear. I've known quite a few people like that.

 

[jimbotron]

I will give some credit to Berman though. The decision to remove the end music from Booby Trap and track in music from Where Silence Has Lease was the right call. Jones' music there was over the top and repetitive. "Brought attention to itself" one might say.

 

[Melakon]

I loved the music in "We'll Always Have Paris" when I first saw it. A simple 2 note doppler motif throughout the episode, often during the timejumps, added to the spookiness of the whole thing.

Also, "The Drumhead". Loved that cello.

 

[LMFAOschwarz]

I loved the music in "We'll Always Have Paris" when I first saw it. A simple 2 note doppler motif throughout the episode, often during the timejumps, added to the spookiness of the whole thing.

I'll have to watch that one, as I trust your judgement in these matters, Melakon.

Even though I'll have to watch that horrible actress in the cafe scene...

 

[Melakon]

Just imagine her singing "California Dreamin'".

Oh maybe you don't mean Michelle Phillips.

 

[LMFAOschwarz]

Just imagine her singing "California Dreamin'".

Oh maybe you don't mean Michelle Phillips.

No, nooo... I meant the blonde who got stood up.

I've got no problem with Michelle Phillips.

 

[Melakon]

Just imagine her singing "California Dreamin'".

Oh maybe you don't mean Michelle Phillips.

No, nooo... I meant the blonde who got stood up.

I've got no problem with Michelle Phillips.

Yeah that girl's French accent was pretty bad. Easy on the eyes though. Memory Alpha says she's a personal trainer now.

 

[LMFAOschwarz]

Just imagine her singing "California Dreamin'".

Oh maybe you don't mean Michelle Phillips.

No, nooo... I meant the blonde who got stood up.

I've got no problem with Michelle Phillips.

Yeah that girl's French accent was pretty bad. Easy on the eyes though. Memory Alpha says she's a personal trainer now.

Watching 'Paris' now. You know, that girl really didn't need to have a french accent at all. It makes me wonder to what extent the holodeck simulations tend to create gereralized, "stereotypical" scenarios.

 

[The Lensman]

Seems like I recall Berman not liking Jones penchant for using recurring "themes". Example: playing TMP like Klingon theme when Klingons showed up. I recall fans defending that practice as they liked hearing identifying themes like that. It's like hearing the Imperial March when the pov switches to the Empire.

 

[Amaris]

Jesus Christ, I want Ennio Morricone to score a Star Trek movie.

 

[Ithekro]

Some of Horner's themes seems to blend with this action so well that there are a few points were I have difficulty separating sound effects from his score. Especially in the Wrath of Khan. I was somewhat amazed when I heard just the soundtrack and found what I thought has been a sound effect for Spock's finger on the screen showing Kirk the damage was actually a musical queue.