Romulans were inept in The Enterprise Incident

Discussion in 'Star Trek - The Original & Animated Series' started by AndHand, Apr 29, 2017.

  1. RomulanCommander

    RomulanCommander Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    I chalk that up to two things:
    1. Spock, and Vulcans, have been shown to have a telepathic power of persuasion
    2. Romulan emotions are more intense and powerful than human emotion, so perhaps the Romulan Commander's emotions overpowered her common sense
     
  2. geotrek

    geotrek Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    A possibility... but it always irked me that this supposedly powerful, decisive, in command female would be so easy. It just doesn't seem like a congruous character trait to me, never has. I still like the episode, Romulan Commander, but you're right, plenty of "bad-guy-ineptitude" in this one.
     
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  3. Ithekro

    Ithekro Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Spock has a way with the ladies. Even Dax was in for that Vulcan.

    Given the this I post-separation from T'Pring, Spock's single. He was probably just going with the plan, even when Kirk contacted him on the communicator. But after the Commander came out in that dress, I think Spock's, hormones, for lack of a better concept, decided to just wing it. The Commander was definitely into the idea of Spock joining her...in more ways than politically.
     
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  4. RomulanCommander

    RomulanCommander Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    Of course, we are talking about 1960s TV, so not much point in debating it to death, because we all know that writing back then was more simplistic and linear. But maybe sexual attraction to Spock was only part of the emotions the Romulan Commander was dealing with. It also could be that she was blinded by ambition, too. By the time of that episode, Spock was already a living legend on Vulcan and the Federation. Turning him to work for the Romulans would do wonders for her career. Ambition that blinds one to common sense isn't just something the Romulans are guilty of. That is practically how every bad guy gets taken down, especially in Star Trek.
     
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  5. PCz911

    PCz911 Captain Captain

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    If they weren't incompetent it would have been a very short and different episode. Imagine that scenario
     
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  6. geotrek

    geotrek Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Yes, excellent point. I never considered it in that light. ;-)
     
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  7. Spock's Barber

    Spock's Barber Commodore Commodore

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    I like the episode, too. The only part that really bothers me is how gullible the Romulan Commander was, especially since D.C Fontana wrote the script.
     
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  8. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Spock himself doesn't seem to have a high opinion on his opponent, or her species:

    :rommie:

    Honestly, I don't see the gullibility angle here. The Romulans had to be careful and proceed in steps, because they didn't want Scotty or some other hothead blowing up the precious prize. OTOH, the Romulans were in no hurry whatsoever: for a rare once, they had not violated the RNZ themselves, and were safely on their own side, immune to Federation countermoves other than ones that would hurt the Feds more than the Romulans. Why not wine and dine?

    ...Because Spock suggested wining and dining, doh! But Spock had already been "candid" about the tactical situation, spelling out his motivations and hers, and his logic on W&D sounded like a natural continuation of that. Sure, she'd be angry afterwards, like Kirk when going all "KHAAAAAAAN!!" despite actually being on top of the situation. And she'd have little reason not to let it show.

    The silly business with inept guards could be more a function of those not being guards at all, but assorted nerds charged with operating the new supertech. The guarding would take place elsewhere, farther out. Note that nobody attempts to call a guard next to the cloaking device when the plot is uncovered - instead, a posse walks to the spot, as if such a guard were not expected to exist.

    Why don't the Romulans raise shields? We know from "A Taste of Armageddon" that shields do zip in preventing a beam-out or a beam-down, even though they block a beam-in or a beam-up. But that's with a transporter that sits inside the shields. Kirk and Spock are extracted using an external transporter. Any clever ideas on that?

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  9. Nebusj

    Nebusj Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    What evidence is there that Romulans of this era have shields?

    (Mic drop.)
     
  10. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Is that the one optional extra the Klingons withheld when selling these ships?

    Admittedly, even the Klingon version only explicitly sports shields in "Elaan of Troyius", but that's on SD 4372, seven hundred ticks before "The Enterprise Incident". :devil:

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  11. Nebusj

    Nebusj Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Cloaking device plugs into the deflector screens --- the ones we know (``Tomorrow Is Yesterday'') will already naturally block some sensors such as radar --- or cloaking device replaces the deflector screens? Why waste power shielding something that can't be targeted anyway? (And note that Kirk does not order shields up after going invisible.)
     
  12. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Works for some models and eras, not all of them. Might be this particular model would hinder shielding. But if the enemy agent has already pocketed the device, shouldn't this cease to be a concern? ;)

    Whether to apply shields or power up weapons or operate transporters when a cloak is active seems to be a doctrinal choice first and foremost. We have seen all three of the above tricks pulled off by a cloaked vessel. And whenever there has been hesitancy to do the above, it has been Romulan hesitancy (or then a Defiant thing, and their cloak supposedly remains Romulan, even if they have a practitioner of Klingon-style cloaking aboard later on).

    I guess one doctrine would emphasize stealth, meaning high energy devices such as shields and guns and transporters would be shut down, often automatically so. Another would go for partial stealth to restore defensive and offensive potential, although preheating the guns is always a bad idea that ruins the cloaking effect so totally that not even Klingons go for it.

    I'm a bit reluctant to accept that any of the cloak models would actually tie into the shielding hardware directly. Most of 'em are plug-and-pray, sometimes even operating without plugging. Perhaps the only power system Kirk could spare here was the deflector one, as he needed his impulse and warp drive and probably wanted his guns for the Freudian comfort?

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  13. Forbin

    Forbin Admiral Admiral

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    I said out, dammit!
    Good thing the device turned out to be a single, small unit! Imagine a spy in the 1970s being sent to Russia to steal a newly-developed radar jammer that's used on their bombers. He sneaks onto the airfield, sneaks up to a Badger bomber, and finds the system is made up of seven Line Replaceable Units, each weighing from 20 to 75 pounds, plus four receive antennas and four transmit antennas placed in the wing roots and the tail fin, with approx two kilometers of wiring.

    I guess that's the point where you need to steal the whole airplane instead.
     
  14. Vger23

    Vger23 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Bad guys are always inept. What shows have you all been watching the last 50 years?
     
  15. UnknownSample

    UnknownSample Commodore Commodore

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    This episode always seemed to be almost one of the greats, except for a somewhat cartoonish execution, that seems totally inappropriate in a sort of Cold War espionage story.
     
  16. Ricky Spanish

    Ricky Spanish Former Democrat Premium Member

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    Bad guys are always inept to some degree. If not, the Borg would've assimilated Earth, not leaving their collective "off" switch in an unsecured folder.
     
  17. captainkirk

    captainkirk Commodore Commodore

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    Or the fact that when they want to assimilate a wimpy little planet in Dark Frontier they send a whole fleet, but when they want to assimilate Earth they only send one ship. And then after this plan fails the first time they do it again.
     
  18. UnknownSample

    UnknownSample Commodore Commodore

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    That one-cube-only business was inherited from the original conception of the Borg as being able to do a shocking amount of damage even with just one ship. The Neutral Zone was supposed to have been followed by a report that the entire Romulan Empire had been destroyed by just one small Borg scout ship. That is such a compelling idea, almost TOS-worthy in scale, that I try to give them a pass on the one-cube attack on Earth.
    --------------
    I try, but fail. No matter how powerful one vessel is, it can't be everywhere.
     
  19. Forbin

    Forbin Admiral Admiral

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    I said out, dammit!
    It can if it's going warp 10!
    But then you'd end up with Borg salamanders.
     
  20. Poltargyst

    Poltargyst Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Romulans inept? I don't know. How many times does the Enterprise get taken over/sabotaged?