Romulans through the years question

[balls]

I would imagine that this has been asked and answered before (so if there is a link, please point me in that direction), What's the deal with the ridges of 24th century Romulans? Has it ever been explained in anyway? I recently watched "Babel", "United" and "The Aenar" of ENT. The Romulans looked and were dressed like 24th century Romulans. ENT attempted to reconcile the whole Klingon ridges issue, but then seemed to drop the ball on the Romulan look. Were there episodes of TNG, VOY or DS9 that had Romulans look like TOS Romulans? In "Unification" Spock was able to blend in on Romulus without much problem. I don't want this to be a debate on the merits of ENT. I just am wondering if there has been anything written about this subject.
Thanks

 

[shapeshifter]

Speculatively, I'll say I think had ENT had more time, a story may have been woven which somehow caused some mutated form of the Klingon mutagen to be loosed among the Romulan's thus causing them to grow ridges. That'd really piss em off so was done in an attempt to start a war(?)

 

[captcalhoun]

michael westmore decided that because of the reidged Klingons the Rommies deserved ridges too to make them seem mean.

 

[Kegek]

It can't be explained away as a makeup thing, as the Klingons used to. This is because, up till now, makeup has been strangely consistent:

23rd century Romulans that have been seen are all ridgeless. This includes Caithlin Dar in The Final Frontier, and Ambassador Nanclus in The Undiscovered Country. Both films were made after the introduction of ridged Romulans on TNG, and these Romulans are the only Romulans to appear in TOS movies. Furthermore, given the elaborate makeup of background aliens, budgetary reasons were obviously not the concern behind the lack of foreheads.

All 22nd and 24th century Romulans, in effect all Romulans in the Berman era, without exception, have bumpbed foreheads. This began with TNG's "The Neutral Zone", and continued through DS9, VOY and ENT. It was also in evidence in the Romulan corpse seen in Generations, and the Romulans in Nemesis, the most Romulan-centric film so far... and it wasn't Romulan-centric.

I'm curious as to whether Nero and company will sport bumps.

Prior to the "Affliction"/"Divergence" arc, and not counting the stock footage Klingons in "Trials and Tribble-ations", the only time Klingons appeared ridgeless was in TOS. In all other productions, which had higher budgets, a variety of ridge-styles were sported.

 

[Timo]

My favorite theory nowadays is that the ridges reflect the mood of the Vulcanoid in question. In essence, they are facial erections: many Romulans shamelessly flaunt them as a proud sign of their raging emotions, while Vulcans would rather commit suicide than have their foreheads bulge in public. But any ridgehead can go smooth when in proper mood, and any smoothbrow can expand to vigorous dimensions. At least with a little bit of medical intervention.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Kegek]

Then why the uniform distinction on the shows, where Romulans in the 22nd and 24th century all, regardless of their opinions or status, while their 23rd century brethren do not?

For that matter, when Vulcans go nuts, on pon farr or drugs or embrace emotional philosophy, why don't their head bulge?

 

[Temis the Vorta]

I gotta say, I like the "facial erections" theory.

 

[KDoug]

I've got it! It's a fashion statement! Sometime before the Enterprise period, the Romulans decided that they would look cool with big, ridged foreheads, which they gave themselves through plastic surgery. This look went out of style during TOS and came back into fashion again around the time of TNG.

 

[Starfleet Engineer]

^That would make Romulans also related to Vampires of the Buffyverse.

 

[STIntergalactic]

I just always assumed that there were two classes of Romulan. Some had ridges, while others did not. And when and where we saw them in context of the Star Trek universe, was a matter of chance and coincidence.

 

[Timo]

...The TOS helmets would also help hide the ridges on the then-lower classes.

Then why the uniform distinction on the shows, where Romulans in the 22nd and 24th century all, regardless of their opinions or status, while their 23rd century brethren do not?

Fashion. We wouldn't expect to see naked hair in the courts of the 1600s, or stubby or smooth chins for people of position in the 1800s.

Seriously, forks. All the TOS Romulans we saw with bared foreheads were military personnel of great composure, or diplomats on a mission. They probably wouldn't let their emotion ridges bulge much. Although it would have been interesting to add in TOS-R a brief, quickly contained forehead erection of anger and grief to Lenard's Romulan Commander character as his old friend dies... Or to his Sarek in "Sarek" or "Unification".

Timo Saloniemi

 

[RoJoHen]

I like the fashion theory, because it's probably the best we're going to get.

Romulans from the 22nd and 24th Centuries have heads that are pumped full of collagen. It makes them look more badass. It's the Romulan equivalent of a tattoo.

Perhaps Future Guy was a Romulan (I'm assuming he was never revealed, as I missed much of ENT) from the 24th Century, saw that 22nd Century Romulans had bumps, and then did it himself. Future Guy is the man who brought bumps back in style!

 

[Kegek]

Timo said:
Fashion. We wouldn't expect to see naked hair in the courts of the 1600s, or stubby or smooth chins for people of position in the 1800s.

Seriously, forks. All the TOS Romulans we saw with bared foreheads were military personnel of great composure, or diplomats on a mission. They probably wouldn't let their emotion ridges bulge much.

Unlike the diplomats and military personnel of great composure who let their ridges bulge continuously, even when they changed emotions? Alidar Jarok, Tomalak, and so on.

And again; we've seen Vulcans who embrace an emotional philosophy from Enterprise and The Final Frontier. We've seen Spock go nuts from pon farr, from weird alien plants, from... uh... I never really understood the whole racial-return-to-emotionalism from "All Our Yesterdays", but also there. And not once, not once did they bulge.

For that matter, in all occasions of Romulan forehead ridges - and I'll be generous and include the identical Mintakan ridges - they've never actually moved.

And the fashion argument makes little sense. Romulan style in Enterprise is largely synonymous with Romulan style in TNG-DS9-VOY, but clearly distinct from Romulan style in the 23rd century. The 2000s, as of yet, have not reverted into the 1800s.

So, the theory is amusing, certainly, but holds little water. I've never bought the 'hidden bumps' either. If that's the case, where are the flat-headed Romulans in the 22nd and 24th centuries?

 

[Timo]

I think the concept of "lack of ridged Romulans in the 23rd century" is a false one: we saw too few Romulans during that period to tell one way or the other.

However, the concept of "lack of smooth Romulans in 22nd/24th" must be acknowledged somehow, yet still by taking in account the fact that Spock raised no eyebrows when smoothly moving among 24th century Romulans.

And the concept of "all Vulcans without exception are smooth" seems the most demanding of all. The brief changes in Romulan foreheads may be given a series of brief explanations; the absolutism of Vulcan smoothness requires some sort of an absolute truth.

Perhaps the simplest way to explain the discrepancies is to say that Romulans were separated from Vulcans by racial strife, Vulcans being the racists. Ridges were eradicated from Vulcan by mass deportations, and those also swept away some smoothheaded sympathizers of the plight of the ridgeheads.

The facial erection theory would fit this one in that the followers of Surak would have a reason to hate (wholly unemotinally, of course) those who had a tendency to bulge their ridges. Once deported, the Romulans would in turn have more of a "live and let live" mentality overall - but they would be a violent bunch, prone to upheavals, oppression and also the occasional bout of racism. Thus, at times there would be rigorously enforced fashion to fit the whims of the rulers of the day.

As for Romulan fashions in general, we only saw their field operatives in TOS. The folks back home in the 2260s may have been clad just like they are in the 22nd/24th centuries, hiding beneath uniform mullet cuts lest Tal'Shiar send in its feared Barber Squad.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Kegek]

Timo said:
I think the concept of "lack of ridged Romulans in the 23rd century" is a false one: we saw too few Romulans during that period to tell one way or the other.

That there are no ridged Romulans in the 23rd century is inductively true: All Romulans seen there had no ridges. That there were no ridge-less Romulans in the 22nd and 24th centuries is also inductively true: All Romulans seen there had ridges. As our only evidence is the information provided on the screen, quite often inductive reasoning is the only method one can use in these kinds of discussions.

However, the concept of "lack of smooth Romulans in 22nd/24th" must be acknowledged somehow, yet still by taking in account the fact that Spock raised no eyebrows when smoothly moving among 24th century Romulans.

An interesting point, though this episode, one of the few set on Romulus, also shows no ridge-less Romulans whatsoever. Spock's presence on Romulus did almost immediately reach the ears of the Federation, however, and since the Romulan government intended to use him, he may not have been as inconspicuous as he at first appeared.

 

[Timo]

Good points about Spock!

As for inductive reasoning, the clear difference between the concepts I tried to separate is in the number of cases observed. An explanation hinged on "we see just an exception" inherently works better in a small pool of cases than in a large one.

How many smooth Romulan foreheads did we see in TOS?

-Lenard's Commander
-The Centurion

-Linville's Commander
-Tal, with relatively long hair on his forehead
-Two extras with long hair covering their foreheads

-Two animated Commanders with long hair covering their foreheads

-Pardek
-Nanclus

We also saw something like eight helmeted extras. So while we can argue for an uncommonly frequent occurrence of smooth foreheads, the argument for uncommonly rare ridges might not carry as much weight. Especially when we are always arguing from some extraevidential premise anyway...

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Kegek]

Timo said:
-Pardek
-Nanclus

Pardek has ridges and only appeared on TNG. Caithlin Dar, however, appeared in The Final Frontier, so this amounts to the same number of Romulans.

I'm not claiming inductive reasoning is perfect. Far from it - but it's incredibly useful when limited information is available. Even with the much larger number of ridges seen on the later shows, we still saw what was, in effect, a minority of the Romulan population. A larger but still in all likelihood negligible percentage. But there are still observable and un-contradicted patterns in the sample we have.

Over the course of the franchise we have seen ridged and ridge-less Romulans; and never both in the same production. There is only one factor that seperates them: All of the former were seen in the 23rd century, the latter were all seen in either the 24th or 22nd centuries. It's the simplest and most internally consistent division between these two groups, even if it leaves questions as to 'why'.

 

[balls]

It's been awhile, but was Pardek in the novel of TUC? I know that Spock references meeting him at Khitomer in "Unification." I don't recall seeing any Romulans at the conference other than Nanclus. Although, it may be that I was assuming that the Vulcans there were Vulcans and not Romulans.

 

[Kegek]

I'm fairly certain Pardek was not in the film. As "Unification" was an implicit tie-in to TUC, though, I wouldn't be surprised if a novelisation mentions it. Nanclus was the only Romulan with a speaking role (and if memory serves, the only Romulan) and his forehead was as flat as Terry Farrell's delivery.

 

[Timo]

...Of course, we may wonder how many of the pointy-ears in yellow sashes at Khitomer were Vulcans, and how many were Romulans. It was rather interesting that there be a separate pointy-ear delegation, one where Sarek shared the colors with Nanclus rather than with the Federation. A joint Vulcan-Romulan entity serving as the hosts and mediators of the event, perhaps?

Timo Saloniemi