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Rewatching Voyager

So how did the borg find out about the existence of humans/Earth/the Federation? Through Picard in Q WHO? - or through Seven's parents in DARK FRONTIER?
I've always had an issue with how the Voyager writers retconned that. I would like to think Picard discovered who they were and the Raven was kind of a forgotten ship. I mean the El Aurians (Guinan's people) look just like humans afterall.

Scientific Method

Star Trek doing commentary on the ethical treatments of animals in experiments was basically what this episode boiled down to. It was fun watching Janeway go badass (And crazy) taking the ship into the pulsars and we get more on the Tom/Torres relationship. Watching the episodes so close, I'm even more of a fan of how they develop this relationship since Day of Honor. Not much else to say about this episode really other than I enjoyed it.
 
The aliens were kind of ... cool:
435345c6817f316ca9e9f4575ca19c1d.jpg

Chakotay and Neelix looked kind of ... different. Their dialogue in sickbay was entertaining.
Janeway looked kind of ... mad (as, I think, she herself admitted it):
0d25bb745c5779d2089db65aa6af23c9.jpg

Of course, the funniest-looking guy was the Doctor. Again, no Leonardo, unfortunately, but at least we had scenes in his workshop:
d6b7e4c02812babef9342f06756cc2a3.jpg
 
I remember watching the scene of Tom and B'Elanna making out in engineering and thinking how funny it would be if they accidentally shut down the warp core.
 
Year of Hell

Watching this episode a week after watching Scorpion, I wonder what a full season of this would have been like. I think it would have been interesting to say the least, at least until the finale where the Season resets, but maybe then the writers would have finally utilized the premise of the show and put Voyager is real danger each week without having to repair the ship. It might have been an interesting experiment and it would have placed right in with shows today.

What we got though, was very good. I love Kurtwood Smith, and he was great as Annorax, even though I have a little issue with Chakotay being swayed by him so easily. I don't know if he really would have been so curious, and this is where I wish we got Maquis Chakotay. Maquis Chakotay wouldn't have taken his crap and saw him as the megalomaniac he was. He may be "well intentioned" but he was still erasing civilizations from history.

As for the Voyager side, Janeway was great in these episodes again. She really loved that ship, and I appreciated the use of Voyager as a character. In this era where the JJ movies love to destroy the ship, this was shades of Star Trek and I loved when Janeway was talking about Voyager as a caretaker in Part 2. I also really liked the interactions between Tuvok and Seven, and I have to say with these episodes and The Raven, I really do see a lot of similarities between the two characters. There is almost a mutual logical respect between the two that Tuvok only shows towards Janeway.

The ending to this two parter is always memorable. Love Janeway's "Times Up" and the effect of the weapon ship blowing up was really nice to see. Going back to my beginning statement, I do wonder what this episode would have been like as a full season arc. I think they couldn't use the time ship, or they would introduce the time ship in the later part of the season. It might have been interesting to see variations of Voyager through each temporal incursion though. It would be like Parallels in which we see Riker in command, the federation being taken over by the borg, stuff like that. It's a shame that really was never a possibility. In terms of season finale/premiere episodes though, Scorpion was much better.
 
This has been brought up before but apparently at some point Janeway and the others forgot about Kes' warning about the Krenim. I'm going to assume it happened during Annorax's first 'time wipe' when he wiped out the Zahl. Just a guess on my part.

It's been mentioned before that not only do we see Seven finding the torpedo instead of Kes, we see Chakotay and Paris kidnapped in lieu of the death of their 'partners' Torres and Janeway.

Some have said they wanted this to be season long arch but we have to remember that this was running concurrent with DS9 where there was a war going on. Maybe the higher ups didn't darkness and destruction going on on both series at the same time. I personally would not have been opposed to a mini-arc though...something with four to six episodes maybe.
 
I made a mention of the whole Kes thing when I talked about Before and After, but I think it can be explained not by the time wipe that took out the Zahl homeworld, but the one before it, in the teaser.

I do like the idea of the mini-arc. Like I said last night, based on how this specific episode was written, you needed to have some major changes to make it season long. Having it be 6 episodes is much more workable.
 
Just wanted to let everyone know I'm going on Vacation tomorrow and won't be back until the week from now. That means I will pick up Voyager when I get back. Thanks for following along. Some of these threads I do I end up losing interest because there is a lack of interest but this thread has been fun and the desktop wallpapers have been really cool. Hope everyone has a good week. :)
 
Just wanted to let everyone know I'm going on Vacation tomorrow and won't be back until the week from now. That means I will pick up Voyager when I get back. Thanks for following along. Some of these threads I do I end up losing interest because there is a lack of interest but this thread has been fun and the desktop wallpapers have been really cool. Hope everyone has a good week. :)
After a whole year of hell, it's understandable that you need a holiday ... :D
On a somewhat more serious note, have a pleasant stay (wherever you go) - I just hope you're not going to the Delta Quadrant because it would be very unfair of you to leave us all here in the AQ ... :D:D:D
I think I can safely say that the few of us who follow this thread on a regular basis are looking forward to your return.
See you in a week or so. :beer:
 
Back home from my trip and wanted to watch a couple more episodes of Voyager tonight. :)

Random Thoughts

I really like the concept of this episode. A society that considers it a crime to have violent thoughts and how that created a black market to circumvent the laws. I love what this episode did for Tuvok, really highlighting him as an investigator and the difference between how he investigates and how the alien culture investigates crimes. The scene with the Mind Meld was eerily creepy and that Quill guy could have played the Zodiac killer and probably could have been really convincing. Also, I didn't notice this before, but one of the Duras Sisters played the lead investigator in this episode. I always get it confused which one Walsh played (Either Lursa or Betor) but we got to see her out of the klingon make up for this episode, and dressed a little more. Overall, decent episode really spotlighting Tuvok and probably the best Tuvok episode since Season 2's Meld.

I also love Seven's reactions in this episode. She's talking about efficiency and her scene with Janeway at the end was classic of that relationship. Seven is really a child still and she comes across as someone complaining to a mother about having to do Chores. Janeway's reaction is so calm and collected and then her "Dismissed" was just icing to the scene.

Concerning Flight

I'm sorry but I find this episode dull. You can do so much with De Vinci and Reys Davies is so good in things he's in, but here I couldn't really care about what was going on. However, the scene where they do get the glider to fly was exciting and really felt like an invention someone does that always fails finally working at the most appropriate time. It was kind of a mesmerizing scene, to be honest.
 
Random Thoughts

I really like the concept of this episode. A society that considers it a crime to have violent thoughts and how that created a black market to circumvent the laws. I love what this episode did for Tuvok, really highlighting him as an investigator and the difference between how he investigates and how the alien culture investigates crimes. The scene with the Mind Meld was eerily creepy and that Quill guy could have played the Zodiac killer and probably could have been really convincing. Also, I didn't notice this before, but one of the Duras Sisters played the lead investigator in this episode. I always get it confused which one Walsh played (Either Lursa or Betor) but we got to see her out of the klingon make up for this episode, and dressed a little more. Overall, decent episode really spotlighting Tuvok and probably the best Tuvok episode since Season 2's Meld.

I also love Seven's reactions in this episode. She's talking about efficiency and her scene with Janeway at the end was classic of that relationship. Seven is really a child still and she comes across as someone complaining to a mother about having to do Chores. Janeway's reaction is so calm and collected and then her "Dismissed" was just icing to the scene.
This is one of the most underrated episodes of Voyager, IMO. A lot of people dismiss it as boring but like you, I also find the concept to be very interesting - as well as the execution of that concept. In addition to the things you mentioned, I love how Tom loses his temper and wants to save B'Elanna at all costs. Such episodes are actually positive proofs to me that Tom's and B'Elanna's tempers are similar - Tom just keeps his more under control.
B'Elanna's comment on the Vulcan mind meld was spot on:
"I'm not sure I like the idea of a mind meld any better than an anagrammatic purge."
Normally, most people think that the Vulcan mind meld is a great thing. Well, not for me. I wouldn't want Tuvok (or anyone else) to search through my brain, that's for sure.
Here's a wallpaper for the episode:
23ac76569aeeb27c08cfdb9269b41c29.jpg

Concerning Flight

I'm sorry but I find this episode dull. You can do so much with De Vinci and Reys Davies is so good in things he's in, but here I couldn't really care about what was going on. However, the scene where they do get the glider to fly was exciting and really felt like an invention someone does that always fails finally working at the most appropriate time. It was kind of a mesmerizing scene, to be honest.
I'm surprised that you didn't like this one - but then, we can't always agree on everything. I love Leonardo da Vinci - in fact I feel sorry that we only get to see him in two episodes. This one had an interesting setting with mixing Renaissance Italy with a (no-name, I guess) planet in the Delta Quadrant. The scene when Janeway tells Tuvok to make small talk with Leonardo was hilarious - just like the following scene between Tuvok and Leonardo.
The best thing about this episode is, however, the relationship between Catarina and her maestro. I love how she respects him, even though she always manages to convince him to see things her way. Also, it is evident that Leonardo likes his apprentice, too and the way Janeway convinced him why he should accept his own limitations even though he is the master was a very nice scene.
Perhaps on a physical level not much happened on this episode but I thought it showed how important Janeway thought following in the footsteps of old masters was. After all, she is a scientist and I find it "logical" (sorry, no reference to the Vulcans intended) that she would choose a role model for herself from the great period of the Renaissance - and a man at that who was at home both in sciences and humanities.
 
I might be getting into a Binge Voyager mode this weekend so I can end it with The Killing Game. Some of these reviews might be shorter than usual.

Mortal Coil

Whenever anyone bashes Neelix and says he's a stupid character, I always point to this episode and tell them they are wrong. Ok, so maybe Neelix can be slightly annoying, but I think he has a good heart and means well even when he might not show it. Case in point the beginning of this episode where his preasence makes everyone around him happy. In fact, that is one of the themes of this episode, how he has an impact on people, especially a little girl who connects with him on a very personal level.

This episode is mainly about his crisis of faith and that is why I think this is the best Neelix episode of the series. Once again Voyager takes a good hard look at death, but this time it's the belief of the afterlife and if it is or isn't there. You may criticize religion, say it's no longer necessary, but I say it's Faith that is very necessary. It guides us in our lives and hopefully makes us better people. That is what this episode is about, how Faith is powerful and how a loss of faith can affect even the happiest of people. We see Neelix die, he comes back, and he's contemplating suicide because his vision quest sent him on that path, or at least that was the literal interpretation. I loved Chakotay talking him down at the end, saying he may still go to the Great Forest but it wasn't his time yet and he is very valued on Voyager. This was a very powerful and strong episode and it worked great for both Neelix and Chakotay.

Waking Moments

Voyager does inception. Like Random Thoughts, I like the concept of this episode, even if I found the execution kind of paint by the numbers. Again though, Chakotay is great here and considering we're in the time of the series where Beltran wasn't given much to do, what he is given he makes the most out of it. Love that twist of him still dreaming and the Aliens who thrive in the dream world was really interesting.

Message in a Bottle

This episode is all kinds of fun, and the ending is filled with hopeful optimism. I have to say, rewatching Season 4 right now, it feels like Voyager forgot they were going home since The Gift. I appreciated this episode, as fun as it is, bringing that back to light full throttle. Voyager has found a way to communicate with the Alpha Quadrant, and they use the Doctor to send a message back to headquarters. The best parts of this episode are the banter between Doctor and EMH-2, IE Andy Dick. Picardo and Dick (I'm sorry for my gutter thoughts in advance ;) ) do have great chemistry on screen, and their scenes was just delightful. I also really liked the stuff with B'Elanna and Seven, especially the scene where Torres is impressed by what Seven did to the Hirogen. I also loved the end and the call back to Scorpion about Janeway being alone, with the message that Starfleet will not rest until Voyager comes home. Nice way to set up the Pathfinder storyline, but that really doesn't happen until Season 6. Still, I'm in the middle of the series now and I can see how things here are setting up things down the road.

Speaking of the Hirogen, we have now entered into my favorite part of Season 4, the Hirogen arc, with this episode, Hunters, Prey, and then The Killing Game two episodes later.

Also, one final comment about all three episodes I saw tonight: I love B'Elanna's jacket. I wish she had kept it, even after the pregnancy. It really did make her more of an engineer.
 
Well that was a lot to read. Oddly my phone stopped going me notifications, and I just had a random thought that I hadn't heard from anyone in a while xD

I obviously can't comment on all of the posts but just a few things. Absolutely love scientific method! One of the my favorite epsiodes considering the ethics of science considering I would like to do science at university

I also particualr enjoy the Torres and Tom build up here, it's great and the writers weaved it in really well across the epsiodes.

Year of hell! You guys neeeeeeed to read the Voyager after books!!! I was on full circle what 6 months ago and now I'm out of voyager literature, I think in the past month I've consumed 5 books alone. BTW pocket full of lies is the book that addresses the year of hell Krenim questions, I won't give away any spoilers tho!

Also any book reccomendation, Trek or non trek? Since I'm going on holiday when school breaks up in a week and I've run out of books. I love anything Fantasy and dabble in Sci-Fi so if you guys have picked up anything recently that was good do tell me.

Finally message in a bottle, I particualry love the doctor, In most epsiodes, and here especially. I think there were some great interactions between him and the other EMH.
 
I enjoyed Message in a Bottle. Andy Dick was great and then there was that whole "Let's build a Doctor' routine between Paris and Kim. Eventually, there were other Doctor programs floating around because of Living Witness and Critical Care. I wondered if they didn't just keep the Doctor from The Equinox, took care of his ethical subroutines and put him in storage.

I did think it was a bit ironic that Torres was lecturing Seven about being rude. This was the person who broke Carey's nose, remember? :lol: Of course, we have to keep in mind at the time she was probably still mad at the idea of being the Delta Quadrant against her will to begin with.

Mortal Coil was good. A bit deep but good. It did bother some of us that no one thought to ask that perhaps (For the sake of the story. I'm not going to pretend this is real) that Neelix did go to the Great Forest but when he woke up he simply didn't remember it. It would still cause a crisis of faith of course but it bothered me that no one even thought about that possibility. Oh well. No matter. Still a good episode.

Loved Waking Moments and that Chakotay got something of substance to do.
 
I did think it was a bit ironic that Torres was lecturing Seven about being rude. This was the person who broke Carey's nose, remember? :lol: Of course, we have to keep in mind at the time she was probably still mad at the idea of being the Delta Quadrant against her will to begin with.

I kind of wish Chakotay would have brought this up. What Seven is now is what Torres was in the very first season. I know it was brought up in the first few episodes of the season, but I think it should have been the driving force of that particular story here and it really wasn't.
 
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Mortal Coil

Whenever anyone bashes Neelix and says he's a stupid character, I always point to this episode and tell them they are wrong. Ok, so maybe Neelix can be slightly annoying, but I think he has a good heart and means well even when he might not show it. Case in point the beginning of this episode where his preasence makes everyone around him happy. In fact, that is one of the themes of this episode, how he has an impact on people, especially a little girl who connects with him on a very personal level.

This episode is mainly about his crisis of faith and that is why I think this is the best Neelix episode of the series. Once again Voyager takes a good hard look at death, but this time it's the belief of the afterlife and if it is or isn't there. You may criticize religion, say it's no longer necessary, but I say it's Faith that is very necessary. It guides us in our lives and hopefully makes us better people. That is what this episode is about, how Faith is powerful and how a loss of faith can affect even the happiest of people. We see Neelix die, he comes back, and he's contemplating suicide because his vision quest sent him on that path, or at least that was the literal interpretation. I loved Chakotay talking him down at the end, saying he may still go to the Great Forest but it wasn't his time yet and he is very valued on Voyager. This was a very powerful and strong episode and it worked great for both Neelix and Chakotay.
The funny thing about this episode is that you all seem to like it. Seriously. There's nothing surprising about me loving all VOY episodes (all except FURY) but the fact that you are all in unison when it comes to forming an opinion about this ep is a pleasant surprise to me. The reason for this is the fact that when Voyager gets bashed - and it DOES get bashed to a stupefying extent -, this is one of the episodes that people love to cite as a negative example. Their problem with this episode is that Seven resurrects Neelix but she never does that to any other crew members for the rest of the show.
I think that Seven is simply great (on this episode as well as on any other episode). She brings Neelix back to life, then sees the negative consequences - after all, her efforts nearly led to suicide - and draws the necessary conclusion: playing with death is a dangerous thing and not something done easily and carelessly. Hence why she never attempts it again IMHO. Well done, Seven!
There are so many memorable scenes in this episode - just like in any other eps. Neelix's conversation with Alixia, e.g. Or that scene in the mess hall when he looks rather embarrassed by the fact how many people love him. And then, of course, his interaction with Chakotay. He acts for Neelix as a kind of spiritual counsellor - a role soon to be reversed in UNFORGETTABLE.
All in all, an excellent Neelix episode, probably the best if you discount the Tuvok-Neelix ones. Although of course, I must say I also like HOMESTEAD very much, even though the idea to throw out a main character two episodes before the end of the show is mind-boggling.
As for Tuvok and Neelix, RIDDLES totally rocks in my book.
Waking Moments

Voyager does inception. Like Random Thoughts, I like the concept of this episode, even if I found the execution kind of paint by the numbers. Again though, Chakotay is great here and considering we're in the time of the series where Beltran wasn't given much to do, what he is given he makes the most out of it. Love that twist of him still dreaming and the Aliens who thrive in the dream world was really interesting.

Voyager does inception? Isn't it the other way round? This episode had existed long before they even thought about the idea of INCEPTION. This one actually might have led to the concept of that film. Or not. :biggrin: But the possibility exists.
In any case, this episode was a brilliant one, too. It's a pity things are resolved very easily at the end. But the idea of a collective subconscious was a very good one - since we have had our borg lady aboard, her knowledge has proved invaluable for the umpteenth time. Well done, Seven! (Am I saying this again? Incredible. And she isn't even my favourite character. Oh well, I'm sure you'd never have guessed but I just love all VOY characters, :D).

I also really liked the scene with Chakotay going hunting. The transformation of the deer into the alien was kind of cool. Archimago, does this episode get incorporated into any of the VOY relaunch novels? I'm not that keen on them (it seems to me I'm the only person who doesn't swoon when Kirsten Beyer comes out with a new book :brickwall:) and I haven't read anything VOY since THE ETERNAL TIDE.

Message in a Bottle

This episode is all kinds of fun, and the ending is filled with hopeful optimism. I have to say, rewatching Season 4 right now, it feels like Voyager forgot they were going home since The Gift. I appreciated this episode, as fun as it is, bringing that back to light full throttle. Voyager has found a way to communicate with the Alpha Quadrant, and they use the Doctor to send a message back to headquarters. The best parts of this episode are the banter between Doctor and EMH-2, IE Andy Dick. Picardo and Dick (I'm sorry for my gutter thoughts in advance ;) ) do have great chemistry on screen, and their scenes was just delightful. I also really liked the stuff with B'Elanna and Seven, especially the scene where Torres is impressed by what Seven did to the Hirogen. I also loved the end and the call back to Scorpion about Janeway being alone, with the message that Starfleet will not rest until Voyager comes home. Nice way to set up the Pathfinder storyline, but that really doesn't happen until Season 6. Still, I'm in the middle of the series now and I can see how things here are setting up things down the road.

Speaking of the Hirogen, we have now entered into my favorite part of Season 4, the Hirogen arc, with this episode, Hunters, Prey, and then The Killing Game two episodes later.

Tomalak, your second sentence is spot-on! It seems to me that ever since Seven came aboard, Voyager hasn't really been interested in going home. This is also true for the rest of the show. In the first three seasons, this seemed to be their main goal. Now it seems Janeway is a lot more interested in reintegrating Seven into human society than going home.
Not that I mind, of course. Actually, I can perfectly imagine that having survived three years on a ship lost in space has made everyone a lot stronger. Perhaps they have accepted the reality of their situation and although they haven't given up on their plans to go home, other things have taken priority.
I can relate to that perfectly. I mean if your prospect of ever getting home is minimal, you could perhaps make the most of your time aboard that ship. Or you could try it at least. Perhaps a life filled with meaning is better than a life spent trying to reach a goal that you most probably can't. Perhaps, as we know from Harry in ENDGAME, it is, after all, the journey that matters and not the destination. If you lead a meaningful life, then it is better than wasting it feeling sorry for your loss all the time.
Of course, the fact that the Voyager seems to provide our crew with everything (including entertainment) helps a lot. Had those circumstances been slighly different, the whole journey might have turned into a big survival show. This is one of the main things that is criticized about Voyager: the producers didn't put the crew in perilous enough situations. We don't see them fight for food, water, oxygen, etc. We don't see them having power problems - even if we do (NIGHT), these things are sorted out too easily.
As for me, I'm happy to see that the producers decided to do with Voyager what they did. There are quite a lot of sci-fi shows out there that have this dark tone to them (StarGate Universe, e.g.). It is nice to see one that took a different approach. JMO, of course.

On a different note, my very favourite villains are the Hirogen - I wish we'd got more of them. They are excellent in Season 4 and although they do appear here and there in the rest of the show, they lose their significance (and their height :alienblush:) over the long term. It's a shame, really - in any case I enjoy what we have of them.
What I find even more puzzling is that no VOY author has given us a good Hirogen-based novel yet. Or at least, not that I know. But I'd love to be counterproved by you ("counterprove"? is this an English word?).

Also any book reccomendation, Trek or non trek? Since I'm going on holiday when school breaks up in a week and I've run out of books. I love anything Fantasy and dabble in Sci-Fi so if you guys have picked up anything recently that was good do tell me.
Well, I haven't read too much Voyager (except for the relaunch books) but of all the VOY books I've read I've always liked the DARK MATTERS TRILOGY the best. Have you read that one?

I did think it was a bit ironic that Torres was lecturing Seven about being rude. This was the person who broke Carey's nose, remember? :lol: Of course, we have to keep in mind at the time she was probably still mad at the idea of being the Delta Quadrant against her will to begin with.
B'Elanna is a " role model" for Seven ... :D:D:D Just think about how in a few episodes she is going to break Kovin's nose (RETROSPECT) ... :techman:
On a more serious note, there is something similar about the two of them. Something that I can't quite place but their temper can be similar at times. And although technically speaking they'll never become friends, they share a certain "unity", which will be demonstrated in IMPERFECTION when B'Elanna is harbouring Seven so that she doesn't have to go back to Sickbay.
 
I think that Seven is simply great (on this episode as well as on any other episode). She brings Neelix back to life, then sees the negative consequences - after all, her efforts nearly led to suicide - and draws the necessary conclusion: playing with death is a dangerous thing and not something done easily and carelessly. Hence why she never attempts it again IMHO. Well done, Seven!

This is really interesting to think about. At this point in Season 4, Seven is still about 75% Borg, 25% human. She still doesn't know compassion and when she tries based of what she's learned so far, it does produce less than positive circumstances. Also, it would get tiring if Nanoprobes were the end all be all of life and death. This episode really wasn't about that either, but more about faith and how faith can be challenging.
 
The funny thing about this episode is that you all seem to like it. Seriously. There's nothing surprising about me loving all VOY episodes (all except FURY) but the fact that you are all in unison when it comes to forming an opinion about this ep is a pleasant surprise to me. The reason for this is the fact that when Voyager gets bashed - and it DOES get bashed to a stupefying extent -, this is one of the episodes that people love to cite as a negative example. Their problem with this episode is that Seven resurrects Neelix but she never does that to any other crew members for the rest of the show.
I think that Seven is simply great (on this episode as well as on any other episode). She brings Neelix back to life, then sees the negative consequences - after all, her efforts nearly led to suicide - and draws the necessary conclusion: playing with death is a dangerous thing and not something done easily and carelessly. Hence why she never attempts it again IMHO. Well done, Seven!
There are so many memorable scenes in this episode - just like in any other eps. Neelix's conversation with Alixia, e.g. Or that scene in the mess hall when he looks rather embarrassed by the fact how many people love him. And then, of course, his interaction with Chakotay. He acts for Neelix as a kind of spiritual counsellor - a role soon to be reversed in UNFORGETTABLE.
All in all, an excellent Neelix episode, probably the best if you discount the Tuvok-Neelix ones. Although of course, I must say I also like HOMESTEAD very much, even though the idea to throw out a main character two episodes before the end of the show is mind-boggling.
As for Tuvok and Neelix, RIDDLES totally rocks in my book.


Voyager does inception? Isn't it the other way round? This episode had existed long before they even thought about the idea of INCEPTION. This one actually might have led to the concept of that film. Or not. :biggrin: But the possibility exists.
In any case, this episode was a brilliant one, too. It's a pity things are resolved very easily at the end. But the idea of a collective subconscious was a very good one - since we have had our borg lady aboard, her knowledge has proved invaluable for the umpteenth time. Well done, Seven! (Am I saying this again? Incredible. And she isn't even my favourite character. Oh well, I'm sure you'd never have guessed but I just love all VOY characters, :D).

I also really liked the scene with Chakotay going hunting. The transformation of the deer into the alien was kind of cool. Archimago, does this episode get incorporated into any of the VOY relaunch novels? I'm not that keen on them (it seems to me I'm the only person who doesn't swoon when Kirsten Beyer comes out with a new book :brickwall:) and I haven't read anything VOY since THE ETERNAL TIDE.



Tomalak, your second sentence is spot-on! It seems to me that ever since Seven came aboard, Voyager hasn't really been interested in going home. This is also true for the rest of the show. In the first three seasons, this seemed to be their main goal. Now it seems Janeway is a lot more interested in reintegrating Seven into human society than going home.
Not that I mind, of course. Actually, I can perfectly imagine that having survived three years on a ship lost in space has made everyone a lot stronger. Perhaps they have accepted the reality of their situation and although they haven't given up on their plans to go home, other things have taken priority.
I can relate to that perfectly. I mean if your prospect of ever getting home is minimal, you could perhaps make the most of your time aboard that ship. Or you could try it at least. Perhaps a life filled with meaning is better than a life spent trying to reach a goal that you most probably can't. Perhaps, as we know from Harry in ENDGAME, it is, after all, the journey that matters and not the destination. If you lead a meaningful life, then it is better than wasting it feeling sorry for your loss all the time.
Of course, the fact that the Voyager seems to provide our crew with everything (including entertainment) helps a lot. Had those circumstances been slighly different, the whole journey might have turned into a big survival show. This is one of the main things that is criticized about Voyager: the producers didn't put the crew in perilous enough situations. We don't see them fight for food, water, oxygen, etc. We don't see them having power problems - even if we do (NIGHT), these things are sorted out too easily.
As for me, I'm happy to see that the producers decided to do with Voyager what they did. There are quite a lot of sci-fi shows out there that have this dark tone to them (StarGate Universe, e.g.). It is nice to see one that took a different approach. JMO, of course.

On a different note, my very favourite villains are the Hirogen - I wish we'd got more of them. They are excellent in Season 4 and although they do appear here and there in the rest of the show, they lose their significance (and their height :alienblush:) over the long term. It's a shame, really - in any case I enjoy what we have of them.
What I find even more puzzling is that no VOY author has given us a good Hirogen-based novel yet. Or at least, not that I know. But I'd love to be counterproved by you ("counterprove"? is this an English word?).


Well, I haven't read too much Voyager (except for the relaunch books) but of all the VOY books I've read I've always liked the DARK MATTERS TRILOGY the best. Have you read that one?


B'Elanna is a " role model" for Seven ... :D:D:D Just think about how in a few episodes she is going to break Kovin's nose (RETROSPECT) ... :techman:
On a more serious note, there is something similar about the two of them. Something that I can't quite place but their temper can be similar at times. And although technically speaking they'll never become friends, they share a certain "unity", which will be demonstrated in IMPERFECTION when B'Elanna is harbouring Seven so that she doesn't have to go back to Sickbay.

Is the epsiode you're referring to the one with Riley? (Dr Fraizer) if so yes! It is dealt with In the trilogy, protectors acts of contrition and atonement, which are all seperate relaunch novels but they come as a 3 parter. Riley and her people feature mainly in attonement though.

And no I haven't read the dark matter! I'll buy them now :p

You see I really like the novels I just think they summarise Voyager so well, (Especially thr characters) my only real difficulty in pocket full of lies was Tuvok, but he made up for it in the end.
 
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I didn't care for Dark Matter but its nothing to do with how good the books are. I just strongly disagreed with the author's choice in one situation. To me she had one character acting out of character and thought it would have been more reasonable for another character to take on that role. It's just a personal choice thing. I would never dissuade anyone from reading them because what the author chose to do might be perfectly ok with them...or they might not even think about it the way I did.
 
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