Resistance to Change

[Cutter John]

I guess as people get older they tend to slow down, while the rest of the world keeps zooming on past. They lile to cling to their old way of doing things just to give them some sense of stability.

I can kinda sympatize. I don't mind change as long as it really DOES make things faster or easier for me. It does grate a little though when a company pulls a 'We'll be doing things THIS way now. So STFU.'

 

[RobertVA]

The way many bank ATMs are designed is a mixed blessing though:

During the transaction the card is (by design) retained in the machine. While that is good for retrieving the card from an unauthorized user, if there are any problems there is a potential the legitimate user won't be able to retrieve the card until they are able to visit the interior of that branch during business hours. Has anyone on the board had to retrieve a retained card? I wonder if the staff at the branch is allowed to return the existing card or if the customer would be required to wait for a replacement card in the mail. Although they have a reputation for charging fees, ATMs in retail stores (like convenience stores and discount department stores) don't have the "lost card" concern, since the have a "swipe" style reader that allows the customer access to the card through the entire process.

When ATMs were introduced the maximum daily withdrawal (and the entire weekend was treated as a "day") was $200 (US). I haven't heard of that figure being adjusted for inflation.

While ATMs theoreticaly permit withdrawals at any hour, there are issues about customer security during periods of darkness and times when there is light vehicle traffic past the ATM site. On that topic: are other readers of this thread more comfortable with drive thru ATM instalations or the ones where it's necessary to park your car and walk up to the ATM? If positioning the ATM in easy view of the street increases the distance between the nearest available parking space to a dozen yards or more would you still be comfortable using it after dark or the daylight portion of a summer "evening" (between "rush hour" traffic dying down and sunset)?

 

[Hermiod]

^Yeah, I think the machines shouldn't be able to take the card. It should just be a matter of swiping it.

 

[RoJoHen]

^My god, I had no idea about all of that. I guess I've never really thought of how banking was done before computers. I got my first account at 16, which was in 2002.

I've got to say, that's pretty crazy! I barely even go to the ATM anymore, I use direct deposits and do all of my banking online!

Same here. I think I got my first bank account in 2001 or something, when I first started working. I have a check book, which I never use. I have an ATM/debit card, which I only use when I go to the gas station.

Every other store purchase is made with cash, and all of my bills are paid for online.

I never really thought about the history of banking, and I've certainly never heard of a passbook.

 

[RobertVA]

The banks were somewhat progressive about computer use. Bank check processing centers were using those funny looking machine readable MICR routing and account numbers when utilities were using the equivalent of payment coupons in the form of punch cards that were processed with machines that detected the data (limited to 80 characters per card) with metal probes that had to make electrical contact through the holes (some newer units used light beams). Since a damaged card would jam the reader, the payment cards were all conspicuously marked "Do not bend, spindle or mutilate"

The first processing center to handle a check would type the payment amount in the lower right corner so that the centers that subsequently handled the check could use their readers for the payment amount as well.

 

[John Picard]

The way many bank ATMs are designed is a mixed blessing though:

During the transaction the card is (by design) retained in the machine. While that is good for retrieving the card from an unauthorized user, if there are any problems there is a potential the legitimate user won't be able to retrieve the card until they are able to visit the interior of that branch during business hours. Has anyone on the board had to retrieve a retained card? I wonder if the staff at the branch is allowed to return the existing card or if the customer would be required to wait for a replacement card in the mail. Although they have a reputation for charging fees, ATMs in retail stores (like convenience stores and discount department stores) don't have the "lost card" concern, since the have a "swipe" style reader that allows the customer access to the card through the entire process.

When ATMs were introduced the maximum daily withdrawal (and the entire weekend was treated as a "day") was $200 (US). I haven't heard of that figure being adjusted for inflation.

While ATMs theoretically permit withdrawals at any hour, there are issues about customer security during periods of darkness and times when there is light vehicle traffic past the ATM site. On that topic: are other readers of this thread more comfortable with drive thru ATM instalations or the ones where it's necessary to park your car and walk up to the ATM? If positioning the ATM in easy view of the street increases the distance between the nearest available parking space to a dozen yards or more would you still be comfortable using it after dark or the daylight portion of a summer "evening" (between "rush hour" traffic dying down and sunset)?

My dad was bad about having his card "eaten" in the early days of ATM banking. He always forgot his PIN (friggin engineer ). He'd have to return to the branch, during working hours, to get his card back.

As for the machine holding the card, more and more machines are designed for swiping the card through the reader. I haven't encountered a "hold and read" machine in over 15 years.

 

[Triskelion]

Well now there's a record of all your income, when and how you spend it, where you go, what you do online.... What happens when living "off the grid" becomes a crime?

 

[FPAlpha]

What's a bankbook? (snip)...

A serious question?

At one time bank branches lacked computer terminals that allowed them instant access to the balance and other activity of an account. The customer's pass book simultaniously served as the customer's "statement" of the account status and proof that there was money in the account (for the purposes of withdrawals). Interest payments didn't appear in the pass book until the customer took it to the bank branch where the bank employees calculated the interest with electromechanical adding machines (the interest amounts were still calculated based on the proper dates - often the end of a quarter) and wrote the amounts in the pass book (usually with a ball point pen). Each teller had ink stamps to mark entries as legitimate and identify which teller made the entry.

All this was duplicated in the branch's accounting books. Presumably the labor necessary for maintaining the branch's records was the motivation behind the bank's limited daily lobby operateing hours (many closed at 2:00 PM - weekend hours were unheard of). All the information from the checks and deposit slips had to be copied into the cloth bound account books!

As a modest concession to ordinary working people the banks did have short late afternoon lobby hours on Fridays. Miss that lone afternoon opportunity and you had to wait a full week or conduct your business during your lunch break (if a branch was close enough).

In Germany the only thing coming close to it is a savings book, i.e. a "book" you get when opening a savings account (not your standard, day to day account). Using such a book for your "daily" financial transactions is what got me confused since i had my own account since the early 90s and even back then it was all computerized and i had an ATM card.

I"m still a bit shocked that US americans still use paper checks to pay for their stuff (or is that a TV show outdated model)? How one of the most advanced nations is still using such an outdated method is beyond me.

In Germany all you need is your ATM card at most stores.. you put it into the reader, confirm the sum to paid and then either enter your PIN number or sign the receipt.
That's all.. no filling out checks of any kind. It's all paperless and very convenient and i've never had an instance where the shop has deducted more or any other mistake happening (and i check my account online almost every day).

 

[John Picard]

^^Checks come in handy for different transactions. Since I live in a rural area, all I have is trash pickup. I tried to see if I could pay online; however, the City's website is confusing and I haven't figured out if/where the place is so I can pay electronically.

Not all shops are set up for electronic payment (ie. an attorney) or even buying over the Internet via private sale.

 

[Spot's Meow]

I"m still a bit shocked that US americans still use paper checks to pay for their stuff (or is that a TV show outdated model)? How one of the most advanced nations is still using such an outdated method is beyond me.

In Germany all you need is your ATM card at most stores.. you put it into the reader, confirm the sum to paid and then either enter your PIN number or sign the receipt.
That's all.. no filling out checks of any kind. It's all paperless and very convenient and i've never had an instance where the shop has deducted more or any other mistake happening (and i check my account online almost every day).

Well, in stores, most people use ATM cards or credit cards, some use cash, and pretty much no one uses checks. A lot of places have stopped accepting them.

However, checks are still needed or preferrable for certain transactions, such as paying bills. The bigger companies allow you to pay online now, but the smaller, more local companies often don't. For example we pay using checks for water and trash. Actually we use checks for all of our bills because we have the duplicate checks that leave us with a paper copy for our records. I have paid online before and had them claim that I never paid, so doing it on paper seems more safe to me.

The biggest thing we need a check for is rent. I think it's the only form of payment that my landlord (and most others in this area) will accept. Maybe they take cash too, I never asked.

ETA: I also use checks to pay my tuition and at the pharmacy. They allow you to pay online for these, but there is a fee attached. It's not a huge percentage but when you are paying hundreds or thousands for tuition it can come out to be a pretty big fee.

 

[Amaris]

I was surprised last Saturday when after walking and being thirsty, I bought a drink for $1.19 with my bank card.

I thought, dang, what happened to quarters?

I've done that once. I didn't think I'd ever do it either, but it was completely automatic, I didn't even realize I'd done it until I was halfway finished with my lemonade.

J.