RDA Era Vs Moffat Era
- Thread starter DeadmeatDiggory
- Start date
Honestly, though, I think Moffat is building on RTD's and his own work, combined, when he recruits these big-name writers. Doctor Who wouldn't be able to attract, or afford, writers like Richard Curtis or Neil Gaiman if RTD hadn't built up a strong audience and sound critical reputation during his tenure, and Moffat has carried on earning DW's quality reputation. (That's also why they're able to attract guest stars like Sir Michael Gambon, Michael Sheen, Sir Patrick Moore, Sophie Okonedo, Helen McCrory, Toby Jones, James Corden, Morgan Shepherd and his father, etc. And, of course, that's building on RTD's work, too -- netting guests like Jessica Hynes, Simon Pegg, Penelope Wilton, Sophia Myles, Catherine Tate, John Simm, Kylie Minogue, Peter Capaldi, Alex Kingston, David Morissey, Michelle Ryan, Lindsey Duncan, Bernard Cribbons, and Sir Derek Fuckin' Jacobi.)
I dont care Who is making Who, as long as its being made and its enjoyable.
You know I’d somehow convinced myself that I wasn’t enjoying Who as much anymore, but just the other day I sat back and went through the episodes of Series 6 and, actually I think the percentage of them I like is probably roughly about the same as it always was under RTD.
And like I said in another thread, whilst not perfect, Moff has yet to make me want to throw things at the telly in the way RTD often did (farting aliens, big brother etc, paving slab girlfriends, giant space vacuums, Dr Dobby, Jebus Dr, Doctor 10.5, defeating an entire race of Daleks by twiddling some knobs etc). That’s not to say Moffat doesn’t do things that bad, I just think he does them in a far less annoying manner.
And people keep going on about Moffat’s Who having no emotion? I really don’t get it, especially given some of the things we’ve seen this series alone in The Doctor’s Wife, The Girl who Waited and the God Complex. Just because Tennant and Billie aren’t emoting like crazy and the Murray Gold score isn’t ratcheted up to eleven doesn’t mean the emotion isn’t there. It’s just quieter.
I think as well it has to be noted the RTD seemed to have more control, and certainly a slicker production staff while Moffat seems to have had problems in that area. Worth noting as well that I’d wager Moff has less budget to play with (I have no proof of this of course).
This isn’t to say there aren’t things about the RTD era I miss, and for me the real shame of the Moffat era is that he doesn’t have an RTD to handle that one tonally different episode a series, in the way that RTD had Moff.
So I’m voting for Steven, but really this poll needs a both option!
And like I said in another thread, whilst not perfect, Moff has yet to make me want to throw things at the telly in the way RTD often did (farting aliens, big brother etc, paving slab girlfriends, giant space vacuums, Dr Dobby, Jebus Dr, Doctor 10.5, defeating an entire race of Daleks by twiddling some knobs etc). That’s not to say Moffat doesn’t do things that bad, I just think he does them in a far less annoying manner.
And people keep going on about Moffat’s Who having no emotion? I really don’t get it, especially given some of the things we’ve seen this series alone in The Doctor’s Wife, The Girl who Waited and the God Complex. Just because Tennant and Billie aren’t emoting like crazy and the Murray Gold score isn’t ratcheted up to eleven doesn’t mean the emotion isn’t there. It’s just quieter.
I think as well it has to be noted the RTD seemed to have more control, and certainly a slicker production staff while Moffat seems to have had problems in that area. Worth noting as well that I’d wager Moff has less budget to play with (I have no proof of this of course).
This isn’t to say there aren’t things about the RTD era I miss, and for me the real shame of the Moffat era is that he doesn’t have an RTD to handle that one tonally different episode a series, in the way that RTD had Moff.
So I’m voting for Steven, but really this poll needs a both option!
I've enjoyed both but there but the Moffat era has given me as many meh episodes as I got in the longer Davies era. But Moffat has been responsible for some of my favorite individual episodes so it is really hard for me to come down for one or the other.
They're both shit and unworthy of being called Doctor Who.
That said, I liked most of last year and rated it top of the new Who seasons. Then it plummeted from the Christmas special onwards with Matt Smith morphing into a spasticated Jar Jar Binks and the whole thing disappearing up its own arse with the ongoing River Cunt storyline. But then again, the latest two episodes have been brilliant and very good. It's really difficult to judge.
As for the RTD era, he gave us a binman snogging up a chav with flatulence monsters and burping bins, followed by a prancing tit. But separate that prancing tit from the bimbo chav, and he was pretty good when not sobbing over her.
I guess it comes down to good to bad story ratio. Despite being almost completely poor, we did get some great stories here and there in the RTD era (Unquiet Dead, Dalek, Utopia, Library), but the good to bad ratio is about one in 4 or 5. Despite series 6 having the two all time worst episodes in a row, if we include series 5 then it's still hitting a higher average. I guess it goes to Moffat.
That said, I liked most of last year and rated it top of the new Who seasons. Then it plummeted from the Christmas special onwards with Matt Smith morphing into a spasticated Jar Jar Binks and the whole thing disappearing up its own arse with the ongoing River Cunt storyline. But then again, the latest two episodes have been brilliant and very good. It's really difficult to judge.
As for the RTD era, he gave us a binman snogging up a chav with flatulence monsters and burping bins, followed by a prancing tit. But separate that prancing tit from the bimbo chav, and he was pretty good when not sobbing over her.
I guess it comes down to good to bad story ratio. Despite being almost completely poor, we did get some great stories here and there in the RTD era (Unquiet Dead, Dalek, Utopia, Library), but the good to bad ratio is about one in 4 or 5. Despite series 6 having the two all time worst episodes in a row, if we include series 5 then it's still hitting a higher average. I guess it goes to Moffat.
I enjoy both, but I give the edge to RTD. I prefer the episodes, the standalones, the general style and feel of the show, the season finales were amazing... I like Smith in different ways than Tennant but nostalgia makes me go with Tennant.
I think the most damning thing about the Moffat era is the vast number of uninspiring standalone episodes. There were very few RTD episodes that BORED me, but I can't say the same for Moffat.
I think the most damning thing about the Moffat era is the vast number of uninspiring standalone episodes. There were very few RTD episodes that BORED me, but I can't say the same for Moffat.
To each their own, but you need to take care as to how you express your distaste. That's what caused much of your trouble before.
Checkmate
Commodore
See, that was probably the worst thing about his run in my opinion. I can't recall a single one that wasn't completely and insanely absurd and only resolved through some stupid handwavium solution above and beyond anything else in the show. Every time I came here to see the reactions, my mind just shut down at how celebrated they often were.
I really don't get British audiences.
For me, the RTD era has a slight edge. Having said that though, season six has some great bits and I am looking forward to the finale.
doubleohfive
Fleet Admiral
I never knew Richard Dean Anderson was on Doctor Who...
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Re: RTD Era Vs Moffat Era
I like them both, though (as has been noted) it'll be a while before a fair comparison can be made. Moffat does appear to have more of a long-term plan, though, what with the naming of Amy Pond and the whole Silence arc. RTD's seasonal arcs could feel a little shoehorned at times. As writers, they're distinctly different, with Davies going for the ludicrous-but-brilliant moments and Moffat going the more cerebral and clever-clever route while never forgetting to put real heart into his stories. I would like to see him go a few episodes without much timey-wimeyness, even if he is exceedingly good at it.
I like them both, though (as has been noted) it'll be a while before a fair comparison can be made. Moffat does appear to have more of a long-term plan, though, what with the naming of Amy Pond and the whole Silence arc. RTD's seasonal arcs could feel a little shoehorned at times. As writers, they're distinctly different, with Davies going for the ludicrous-but-brilliant moments and Moffat going the more cerebral and clever-clever route while never forgetting to put real heart into his stories. I would like to see him go a few episodes without much timey-wimeyness, even if he is exceedingly good at it.
Despite a few good to occasionally great episodes per series, the RTD era overall never really worked for me. It wasn't until Series 5 (and "The Eleventh Hour" in fact) that I fell in love with the show and while I'm not fully pleased with this year's arc, I'm still eager to watch each Saturday, which I wasn't especially before Moffat took over.
I chose the Moffat era. Series 5 is my favorite season of Modern Who and my favorite season out of all of the Classic-Who seasons I've seen on DVDs and PBS. I liked how the arc was deeper than having one mysterious word repeated every episode that means something in the finel but less complicated than Season 6. I'm still enjoying the overall quality of S6 but I'd prefer he tone down the arcs a touch or two.
That being said, I did enjoy the RTD era; Come to think of it, I thought his second season was weaker than the first too. Also, Nine is my Doctor.
That being said, I did enjoy the RTD era; Come to think of it, I thought his second season was weaker than the first too. Also, Nine is my Doctor.
The more I spend time in Who forums I find Who fandom isn't really a fandom at all, its a lot of disparate groups battling to prove their favourite era (usually proportionate to the era that they grew up with) is the best of all.
OK you get that in Trek too but at least with the different series you can happily segregate yourself into being a DS9 fan and not bother with Voyager, but who Fans just can't seem to do that whole "oh, maybe this era of the show is not for me, I'm not going to stop watching I'm going to shout loudly about it and wish they'd put things back the way I liked it!"
So Baker fans hate RTD fans and Mccoy Fans (Are there any?
) hate Troughton fans and on and on it goes...
Me? Personally I grew up in the void between series, one of the few generations that was denied the treat of Doctor Who being on every Saturday as they matured.
So I have a fondness for the RTD era which introduced this fantastic new show to me, but I do still like what is being produced now, just not to such an extreme level.
I think it's mainly because I haven't quite clicked with the 11th Doctor.
Moffat is turning the Doctor into quite a nasty character (lies, tricks his companions and generally more morally ambiguous and not in a fun way which isn't what the Doctor should be, imo) which I'm not too keen on, but otherwise the man has made few missteps. (Except allowing James Corden to have a role in the series...TWICE! Good God man what's wrong with you...?)
What I hate is the hypocrisy of original series fans who would criticise the RTD era to death about it being too emotional and "soapy" who are now praising the Moffat era despite it being exactly the same, in that regard.
(Companion fancying the Doctor, wedding, Girl Who Waited pretty much the most soapy episode since the revival)
C'mon, the superficial stuff might have changed (Tardis, Doctor, Companions, theme tune etc) but at its core the show has largely been the same since 2005.
There aren't suddenly any episodes about entropy and high end mathematical concepts, its still the Doctor and his companions and their relationships!
No doubt about it, there's a subsection of Who fandom who hated RTD just because of what he was and resented that when their show finally came back it was in the hands of a gay man.
There, I said it, and I'm not accusing anyone here btw its more the uk based forums I'm on, but a vocal minority of posters would jump on anything RTD did and especially highlighted the Gay references in the series calling them some kind of "agenda" and are now ignoring the fact that Moffat is doing the exact same thing!
Sadly there'll always be a minority of people spoiling it for everyone else!
OK you get that in Trek too but at least with the different series you can happily segregate yourself into being a DS9 fan and not bother with Voyager, but who Fans just can't seem to do that whole "oh, maybe this era of the show is not for me, I'm not going to stop watching I'm going to shout loudly about it and wish they'd put things back the way I liked it!"
So Baker fans hate RTD fans and Mccoy Fans (Are there any?
) hate Troughton fans and on and on it goes...Me? Personally I grew up in the void between series, one of the few generations that was denied the treat of Doctor Who being on every Saturday as they matured.
So I have a fondness for the RTD era which introduced this fantastic new show to me, but I do still like what is being produced now, just not to such an extreme level.
I think it's mainly because I haven't quite clicked with the 11th Doctor.
Moffat is turning the Doctor into quite a nasty character (lies, tricks his companions and generally more morally ambiguous and not in a fun way which isn't what the Doctor should be, imo) which I'm not too keen on, but otherwise the man has made few missteps. (Except allowing James Corden to have a role in the series...TWICE! Good God man what's wrong with you...?)
What I hate is the hypocrisy of original series fans who would criticise the RTD era to death about it being too emotional and "soapy" who are now praising the Moffat era despite it being exactly the same, in that regard.
(Companion fancying the Doctor, wedding, Girl Who Waited pretty much the most soapy episode since the revival)
C'mon, the superficial stuff might have changed (Tardis, Doctor, Companions, theme tune etc) but at its core the show has largely been the same since 2005.
There aren't suddenly any episodes about entropy and high end mathematical concepts, its still the Doctor and his companions and their relationships!
No doubt about it, there's a subsection of Who fandom who hated RTD just because of what he was and resented that when their show finally came back it was in the hands of a gay man.
There, I said it, and I'm not accusing anyone here btw its more the uk based forums I'm on, but a vocal minority of posters would jump on anything RTD did and especially highlighted the Gay references in the series calling them some kind of "agenda" and are now ignoring the fact that Moffat is doing the exact same thing!
Sadly there'll always be a minority of people spoiling it for everyone else!
No doubt about it, there's a subsection of Who fandom who hated RTD just because of what he was and resented that when their show finally came back it was in the hands of a gay man.
There, I said it, and I'm not accusing anyone here btw its more the uk based forums I'm on, but a vocal minority of posters would jump on anything RTD did and especially highlighted the Gay references in the series calling them some kind of "agenda" and are now ignoring the fact that Moffat is doing the exact same thing!
Sadly there'll always be a minority of people spoiling it for everyone else!
John Nathan-Turner was also gay, the "gay agenda" is just a way of attacking RTD and as you pointed out Moffat is doing the same thing. I think in the end for Whovans it's the stories themselves that matter more than the eras do, all the various eras have good stories and bad ones when looked at on the whole.
I'm a fan of both eras since they are both parts of the same journey though I'm loving Matt Smith's Doctor a bit more than Tennant's.
