I work for the United States Navy. I used to be in the navy, and now I do pretty much what I did in the navy as a civilian. One of my hobbies in life is to watch "people", and how the times change around us. Here is a situation that they, the active military, are facing in this building I am working in. Rap music; I am old enough, and wise enough, to know that you can not change what people like to listen to. You have those who listen to hard rock, those who listen to Rap, Country and all the other types of music. The current policy here is that you can play anything thing you want, including the most violent aspects of rap. And, having never heard until recently, I am shocked what they are singing about, in terms of what they do to women, or want to do women, in these rap songs. Pretty rough stuff. But the policy is they can listen to it, as long as no one is offended by it. And if someone is offended, they must ask the person who is playing the rap music to turn it down. Me? Like I said, I was in the navy for many years. And when you share that much time with the melting pot of our society, you just learn to let live. But now that women, and very young ones at that, are in the navy, I think it should not be put upon them to have to ask someone not to play something that might be offensive. And if it means no music at all? I think it would better than having to make her be the one to face ridicule if she protests. What do you think? I know there are some young folk on this website. Is it acceptable for young girls to have to just listen to this stuff and just accept it??? I'd like to hear what you have to say... Rob Scorpio
I think you'd be hard pressed to find anyone, especially anyone young, that is going to get very offended by what's being listened to lyrically in music. It's considered so normal to have offensive lyrics now that most people have just acclimatised.
Wait, are you implying that the wholesome church-appropriate rap music of my youth has given way to lyrics that are often disrespectful or offensive to women? Et tu, 2 Live Crew? I'm sure the women of the Navy can weather this musical crisis. If not, we're pretty fucked when we come up against an enemy regime with a huge list of samples and a turntable.
Yes, but people did actually make a fuss about it then, it definitely wasn't allowed on the radio, certainly not here in the UK at any rate and there would have been a major stink if it had ever been broadcast. Now, nobody gives a shit about what music is broadcast, even on the BBC. Times have certainly changed. Tipper Gore has certainly quietened down.
Is the atmosphere amongst enlisted crew equivalent to an office or corporate environment during off hours or in more informal settings (like a galley rather then the CIC for example)? I know. I was poking fun at Scorpio being suddenly surprised and shocked by the content of a lot of rap music.
Rock, metal and punk aren't necessarily Mother Teresa's jams either. It's unfortunate that the only rap you hear is the type that offends you. I've said this many a time on this board, and I'm more than tired of it, but there is much more in hiphop than the rap that the media labels it as. But the close minded will agree with what they're told; that rap is a bunch of black guys professing about murder, drugs and misogyny, and rock is full of wholesome white guys that sing of love and good times. But you know that the latter isn't true, so the first should be open to skepticism too. I don't want to list off a plethora of the lyrically deep, emotional, political and introspective songs in hiphop, because chances are, you're not going to listen to them since hiphop isn't your taste in music anyways. It's understood. And also, I'm not saying rap is innocent, but at the same time, neither are many other commercial genres of music. So just hum a tune to yourself or rock an ipod to drown the sounds.
I don't know...but what would happen if someone in corporate america came to work one day and just started playing rap music that had MOTHER Fing this and MOTHER Fing that every few words..and thats not even taking into accound what they are rapping about? Rob
Yes..some of the Rap music I hear is as you say, very interesting topics about the life they come from..and how to change it..and it too is filled with the F this and F that lyrics...but is good and deep.. But what about the stuff that is about blacks and thugs and killing and being chased by cops and the sexual aggresson against women..because as I type this that is exactly what I am hearing....should a woman have to hear that stuff??? Would you want your young daughter to have to enter a work space enviroment where that music is being played? I wouldn't. Rob
I think you'd also be surprised at the variety of people that listen to it as well though, it's probably the best selling kind of music in the USA. Not just the offensive stuff, but hip hop in general. It has very wide appeal.
Just because it is done, doesn't mean it is right. Most people wouldn't want to pay taxes. This kind of behavior would not be accepted in the past, and then on the flip side, people complain that our society is falling apart around us... Rob
They might get sued, they might get asked to turn it off, or they might get the party started. Depends on the place, the time, and the people. Don't you think you're giving the women in the Navy a little less credit than they deserve though? If they can't handle telling someone to turn off some music that offends them then we've got problems.
Thats where we disagree. It is now against the navy regulations to have images that show nudity in your work place. You can get in serious trouble if you have it displayed any where. It was a very difficult transistion. The reason given? Women should not have to be put into the position of having to ask people to take it down. What is the difference here? Instead of public viewing, we have public listening. Why should the woman be put into the position of having to tell anyone anything?? We are training many of these military kids to someday go out into society and work in corporate america. The armed forces are making a big push to be more like, ta da, corporate america. I think this is an area they need to work on..right away. Rob
blacks and thugs! hahahaha... I don't think music about blacks would be forbidden to my future kids. I chant along with Mos Def when he says "I want black people to be free, to be free, to be free..." Also, you should make the distinction between "club music" and "the rest". Club music... c'mon. We're adults getting into adult things in adult environments, certainly not a place for kids in the first place. Like Rated R movies, if the parent thinks their child is responsible enough to distinguish between reality and what should be done, and fiction and what couldn't/shouldn't be done, then they choose what's what. Ofcourse, kids can sneak into movies and d/l album torrents regardless. So how would I feel about my future daughter listening to something like "Bitches ain't shit"? By the time that she developed a taste in music, I would hope that my parenting would already instill values and judgement for her to skip the track and go right into Lauren Hill's "Everything is Everything". So I wouldn't mind too much, but if she's around me at a young age, then guarantee we're playing something along the lines of Blue Scholars. So you have your daughter going through your Buckcherry album, and she reaches "Crazy Bitch". And???
So this would music is played inside office settings such as Qualcom or any other office enviroment you can think of. Well, since I do alot of work with Defense contractors, I can tell you it isn't. And if we are gong to shield women from having to work in places where offensive posters can no longer be hung on walls, then the same should apply to music as well...its that cut and dry...either it is acceptable behavior or it isnt. And the reason why it is a issue at all here, is because the woman who was offended is, as I heard a while ago, going to make a big deal about it. And, according to others who I work with, it is against regs to listen to that kind of music due to the fact that they all share these work enviroments. He could be in a lot of trouble...Good, Rob
It sounds like you already made up your mind on the issue and are just looking for validating opinions.
RobertScorpio, do you actually care about women being offended, or is this just an excuse to take the offensive on getting rid of a kind of music you don't like listening to?
If a person is in the military and gets offended by rap lyrics, any rap lyrics, then I fear for my country. How does one make it through boot camp and be that soft?
The stories, and slang, I've heard from friends and family in the military I know is far more vulgar than anything I've ever heard in an office. And shielding women from pictures with nudity because they're women is awfully presumptuous and sexist. "Protecting" them from lyrics is equally so--at least as sexist as the mysogynistic lyrics in any rap song. If you listen to Sting, Elvis Costello, or Death Cab for Cutie, most of those songs are kind of mysogynistic too. Would their songs get censored? Unlikely. What about John Lennon's Working Class Hero, which drops and F-Bomb. The military, like any workplace is a place for adults old enough to have been exposed to this stuff already. Shielding people from it is silly.