Question, Starfleet Registy Numbers TOS, Movie and TNG

[Nimitz CO]

Hello Everyone,

I have been working on several projects to create custom logos for various federation vessels, you can see my work here . http://www.trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=88546. Anyway, I want to branch off from the "starship based" ships and make some logos for other Starfleet and Federation "support" vessels" Now I know that in the TNG era, they have different registries that are not the traditional NCC prefix. Here is what I have so far.

NAR = Federation Research Vessel
NCC = Starfleet Starship
NCV = Starfleet Time Ship
NDT = Starfleet Transport
NFT = Federation Transport
NSP = Vulcan Transport
NCX = Federation Battleship??????

Are these accurate as far as continuity, and also, are there any others like for example, Starfleet Cargo/Resuply etc. Any help would be greatly appriciated

 

[Omega_Glory]

I doubt that NCX has anything to do with battleships.

 

[Nimitz CO]

I doubt that NCX has anything to do with battleships.

I was thought so, since I always thought that NX (or any regitry with an "X" in it) = Experimental Ship, But that theroy was torpedoed with Star Trek: Enterprise when the introduced the Columbia NX-02, Then I thought that Starfleet brought back that designation being experimental with the Excelsior and the Prometheus.

 

[captcalhoun]

never seen NCX. there's NX (Excelsior, Defiant, Prometheus) and NCV (Relativity)

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

I doubt that NCX has anything to do with battleships.

I was thought so, since I always thought that NX (or any regitry with an "X" in it) = Experimental Ship, But that theroy was torpedoed with Star Trek: Enterprise when the introduced the Columbia NX-02, Then I thought that Starfleet brought back that designation being experimental with the Excelsior and the Prometheus.

In ENT's time period, NX is only a class name. It doesn't mean 'experimental'. That only comes much later.

And there is no NCX that we know of.

 

[The Wormhole]

I doubt that NCX has anything to do with battleships.

I was thought so, since I always thought that NX (or any regitry with an "X" in it) = Experimental Ship, But that theroy was torpedoed with Star Trek: Enterprise when the introduced the Columbia NX-02, Then I thought that Starfleet brought back that designation being experimental with the Excelsior and the Prometheus.

In the 22nd century, different classes of starships had their own registry codes. Enterprise and Columbia were NX class starships (stated so in dialogue on at least three seperate occasions). Therefore, NX-01, NX-02, and so on. In the 23rd and 24th centuries, NX was the registry code used for experimental starships, as all starships shared the same code NCC.

 

[Timo]

Alternately, perhaps NX was a classic pennant code similar to those used by the USN today. That is, it denoted the type of the vessel, not its class.

In the USN system (post 1975), the prefix DDG would refer to guided missile destroyers, regardless of whether they were of Farragut or Spruance or Arleigh Burke class or whatnot. The prefix FFG would specify guided missile frigate, be it Brooke class or Oliver Hazard Perry class or whatnot. That's fairly intuitive: D for Destroyer, F for Frigate, G for guided missile (as opposed to gun, which is a bit confusing but still...). The doubling of the letters is an odd custom that Starfleet could well have dropped.

In the UESF system, N might be the generic letter for a specific size category of ships - analogous to D=Destroyer or F=Frigate or C=Cruiser. X might in turn denote Xplorer.

Since NX-01 was the first-ever ship in the N-sized Xplorer category, it would then make perfect sense to refer to her as "NX class" until the next NX-designated class was fielded. Similarly, USN once referred to AEGIS class while meaning Ticonderoga class, until a second class equipped with the AEGIS anti-aircraft weapon system was fielded in the USN and half a dozen other AEGIS systems appeared internationally. It is still somewhat customary to refer to the Tarawa and Wasp classes as the LHA and LHD classes, respectively, because there are currently no other classes with those exact type designation prefixes.

That model for UESF ship designation works just fine because there are no counterexamples. We never saw or heard the registry prefix of another UESF vessel, or vessel class, after all. For all we know, the Intrepid was registered NT-14, being the fourth N-sized Torpedo starship in Triton class, the third class of NT ships (NT-10 through NT-16), while ships from Lepanto class (NT-05 through NT-09) and Messier class (NT-01 through NT-04) were already retired.

Of course, this sort of usage would no longer apply to the UFP Starfleet, where the letter prefix doesn't reflect the type of the vessel in any identifiable manner. Giant explorers like NCC-1701-D and tiny escorts like NCC-74210 and humble transports like NCC-2010 all have the same prefix. But it could still be how the old UE Starfleet liked to do things.

As for the prefixes of the UFP Starfleet or UFP civilian shipping, we can't really have NAR stand for research, because the NAR prefix was also used on the shuttlecraft that hauled our heroes to Spacedock in ST6:TUC. The rest of the OP speculation remains valid. But I'd be happier with a system that tries to find systematic logic in the letters. Both Vulcan mercantile ships and Starfleet combatants have the letter N, so it probably doesn't denote Starfleet. Yet it might well denote Federation, as we also have one non-Federation prefix (YLT for an Yridian vessel in "Birthright).

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Nimitz CO]

Alternately, perhaps NX was a classic pennant code similar to those used by the USN today. That is, it denoted the type of the vessel, not its class.

In the USN system (post 1975), the prefix DDG would refer to guided missile destroyers, regardless of whether they were of Farragut or Spruance or Arleigh Burke class or whatnot. The prefix FFG would specify guided missile frigate, be it Brooke class or Oliver Hazard Perry class or whatnot. That's fairly intuitive: D for Destroyer, F for Frigate, G for guided missile (as opposed to gun, which is a bit confusing but still...). The doubling of the letters is an odd custom that Starfleet could well have dropped.

In the UESF system, N might be the generic letter for a specific size category of ships - analogous to D=Destroyer or F=Frigate or C=Cruiser. X might in turn denote Xplorer.

Since NX-01 was the first-ever ship in the N-sized Xplorer category, it would then make perfect sense to refer to her as "NX class" until the next NX-designated class was fielded. Similarly, USN once referred to AEGIS class while meaning Ticonderoga class, until a second class equipped with the AEGIS anti-aircraft weapon system was fielded in the USN and half a dozen other AEGIS systems appeared internationally. It is still somewhat customary to refer to the Tarawa and Wasp classes as the LHA and LHD classes, respectively, because there are currently no other classes with those exact type designation prefixes.

That model for UESF ship designation works just fine because there are no counterexamples. We never saw or heard the registry prefix of another UESF vessel, or vessel class, after all. For all we know, the Intrepid was registered NT-14, being the fourth N-sized Torpedo starship in Triton class, the third class of NT ships (NT-10 through NT-16), while ships from Lepanto class (NT-05 through NT-09) and Messier class (NT-01 through NT-04) were already retired.

Of course, this sort of usage would no longer apply to the UFP Starfleet, where the letter prefix doesn't reflect the type of the vessel in any identifiable manner. Giant explorers like NCC-1701-D and tiny escorts like NCC-74210 and humble transports like NCC-2010 all have the same prefix. But it could still be how the old UE Starfleet liked to do things.

As for the prefixes of the UFP Starfleet or UFP civilian shipping, we can't really have NAR stand for research, because the NAR prefix was also used on the shuttlecraft that hauled our heroes to Spacedock in ST6:TUC. The rest of the OP speculation remains valid. But I'd be happier with a system that tries to find systematic logic in the letters. Both Vulcan mercantile ships and Starfleet combatants have the letter N, so it probably doesn't denote Starfleet. Yet it might well denote Federation, as we also have one non-Federation prefix (YLT for an Yridian vessel in "Birthright).

Timo Saloniemi

WOW Thanks for that Timo. Based on what you have written, do you think that a registy of "NCS" for a Starfleet Cargo/Resupply ship would fit into the genre? Or do you or anyone out there have other suggestions?

BTW, In the TOS, does anyone know what the registries were for the SS Beagle or the SS Antaries?

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Alternately, perhaps NX was a classic pennant code similar to those used by the USN today. That is, it denoted the type of the vessel, not its class.

The only problem with that is the one episode where somebody says that there are three more NX-class ships on the drawing board.

 

[The Wormhole]

As I noted, the term NX class was used in three episodes of Enterprise.

-Fortunate Son: Mayweather is telling his buddy from the freighter that there are more NX class starships being planned. Later on, while facing down the Nausicaans, Archer tells them he commands an NX class ship, and that they'll be seeing more of them soon.

-E2: When the other Enterprise is first detected, T'Pol identifies it as "Starfleet ship, NX class."

-Home: Archer is talking about a conversation he once had with Captain Jeffries, who he explains was the designer of the NX class.

 

[WendellM]

do you think that a registy of "NCS" for a Starfleet Cargo/Resupply ship would fit into the genre? Or do you or anyone out there have other suggestions?

BTW, In the TOS, does anyone know what the registries were for the SS Beagle or the SS Antaries?

In TAS's "More Tribbles, More Troubles," a "robot grain ship" is shown as NCC-G1465. In TAS's "The Pirates of Orion," the manned "freighter" SS Huron is shown as NCC-F1913.

In the remastered "Charlie X," the Antares (which is referred to there both as a "cargo vessel" and a"science probe vessel") is shown as NCC-501. In the remastered "The Ultimate Computer," the "old-style ore freighter converted to automation" Woden is shown as NCC-325.

So, it looks like plain "NCC-xxx" numbers would work for cargo ships/freighters based on remastered images. If you'd like more variety, I suppose you could extrapolate from TAS that "NCC-Fxxxx" is for manned freighters and "NCC-Gxxxx" is for unmanned ones.

 

[Timo]

The only problem with that is the one episode where somebody says that there are three more NX-class ships on the drawing board.

Why would this be a problem? Apparently, UE Starfleet is going to build four vessels of the class that can be alternately referred to as Enterprise class or NX class, or perhaps NX-01 class - much like the USN alternately referred to its earliest truly useful guided missile frigate as Perry class, FFG class or FFG-7 class.

It is only when UE Starfleet would build an Xplorer of a different design, say, NX-05 of Endeavour class, that they'd have to stop referring to Archer's ship as the NX class.

If you'd like more variety, I suppose you could extrapolate from TAS that "NCC-Fxxxx" is for manned freighters and "NCC-Gxxxx" is for unmanned ones.

And fanfic has come up with half a dozen other such letters. This helps somewhat when trying to believe in the thousands of fanfic ships at the same time - their registries may overlap, but they may be told apart by their special letters...

I just hate those TOS-R registries, which overlap with some of the most well-established fanships. So my Woden will be NCC-G325, considering that the registry wasn't visible in the episode... And the Antares might be NCC-G501 despite visuals, so as not to overlap with the Saladin destroyers - or then NCC-G01, which looks almost the same, and might jibe with the idea that those drones were named alphabetically or something.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

The only problem with that is the one episode where somebody says that there are three more NX-class ships on the drawing board.

Why would this be a problem? Apparently, UE Starfleet is going to build four vessels of the class that can be alternately referred to as Enterprise class or NX class, or perhaps NX-01 class

Well, I'm only going on what they said in the episode. And they specifically called it "NX class". It was Archer talking, I believe, and I think he'd know the name.

I'm not saying there absolutely couldn't be other names for the class, but I think if there were, we would have heard. Just easier to interpret it literally: the class name is NX.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Maybe "NX" was the term Archer prefered

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Maybe "NX" was the term Archer prefered

Starfleet officers don't go around making up names for classes. If Archer says it was NX class, we can take him at his word.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Maybe "NX" was the term Archer prefered

Starfleet officers don't go around making up names for classes. If Archer says it was NX class, we can take him at his word.

I didn't say he made it up, I said it was the one he prefered.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Maybe "NX" was the term Archer prefered

Starfleet officers don't go around making up names for classes. If Archer says it was NX class, we can take him at his word.

I didn't say he made it up, I said it was the one he prefered.

Why would a class have more than one name, though? That doesn't make a ton of sense, IMHO.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Starfleet officers don't go around making up names for classes. If Archer says it was NX class, we can take him at his word.

I didn't say he made it up, I said it was the one he prefered.

Why would a class have more than one name, though? That doesn't make a ton of sense, IMHO.

Ask the Navy,

Why would this be a problem? Apparently, UE Starfleet is going to build four vessels of the class that can be alternately referred to as Enterprise class or NX class, or perhaps NX-01 class - much like the USN alternately referred to its earliest truly useful guided missile frigate as Perry class, FFG class or FFG-7 class.

 

[Timo]

To be sure, navies if formally queried would probably insist they have just one official name for each ship class. But naval personnel would have different opinions...

The Royal Navy is a classic example: it has operated quite a few "County classes", that is, ship classes where each ship is named after a county. Formally, those would still have been named after the specific county whose name the very first ship of that design carried; thus, the WWII County class would formally be called the Kent, London and Norfolk classes (as there were three distinct designs), and the subsequent HMS Exeter and HMS York would also form their own single-ship "County classes".

At the same time, the RN would operate destroyer classes commonly known by the first letter of their alliterative naming schemes: "L class" rather than Laforey class, and so forth. There'd also be a "Battle class" where each ship was named after famous battles but none was named HMS Battle; a "Tribal class" where there was no HMS Tribal; etc.

After the war, there'd emerge yet another County class, but more interestingly there'd be a Duke class of frigates. No HMS Duke there, of course - but significantly, the Royal Navy wouldn't speak of Duke class, either. Instead, the preferred name for the class would be Type 23. The contemporary destroyers would be of Type 42, and their most recent successors Type 45 - not Sheffield and Daring classes, respectively.

In USN parlance, the classic example is the 688 class of attack submarines, the name preferred to Los Angeles class.

What Star Trek relevance this has is a matter of opinion. One just wonders... Perhaps the "Starship class" on the dedication plaque of Kirk's TOS ship is an alternate name to the Constitution class, and reflects the fact that all ships in that class were named after preceding starships?

It is relatively uncommon to just quote former ship names for a new class, especially in an organization as young as Starfleet; generally, there's some other sort of a theme. Perhaps the Constitution class indeed was the first Starfleet ship class to purely quote former celebrity vessel names?

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Forbin]

I still contend, just out of spite, that "NX" has always meant "experimental," and the person who decided to start calling the ship "NX class" and put NX-02" on the Columbia was a retard.