Question regarding TNG movies/DS9

[Diddle]

I'm not sure if this is the right place for this question, mods please, move it to the right location if so.


Well, to the question. I was watching First Contact earlier today again and there was the Defiant with Worf, the last couple of times I watched FC I wasn't into DS9 yet, so I guess I just overlooked it, but anyway, when does First Contact takes place on the DS9 timeline?

I know DS9 is commissioned by the time of TNG's seventh season, and Worf is only assigned to it by the time of its forth season... Now, wasn't the Defiant's original function to fight off Borg attacks? Also when it comes the time to fight the Borg they send Worf and a couple of random people. Not only that, but even if First Contact were to take place after the Dominion war, meaning the ending of DS9, what was Worf doing there? Wasn't he suppose to be back on the Klingon Empire with Martok hunting Targs and stuff? And even if it were to take place in the middle of the Dominion War (which I believe is the closest explanation) when did they had the chance to break off the Defiant from the front line and go save Earth from... one Borg ship...?

Thinking about it, the closes explanation I can get is that FC was released in '96, while DS9 ended in '99, so I guess it's somewhat plausible, but yet pretty confusing. But anyway, does anyone know exactly when are the movies, especially FC, are suppose to take place on the DS9 timeline?

Thanks in advance.

 

[RyuRoots]

DS9 was in S5 when First Contact took place. Not sure exactly when, but both are set in 2373. It takes place before the Dominion War.

GEN and DS9 S3 = 2371

FC and DS9 S5 = 2373

INS and DS9 S7 = 2375

 

[Diddle]

Ah, so it was before the War. I suppose it makes sense, which I guess also explains what was Worf doing in Nemesis...well sort of...

Anyway, thank you RyuRoots!

 

[Too Much Fun]

There's actually a reference to "Star Trek: First Contact" in the DS9 episode "In Purgatory's Shadow" when Sisko says something like, "after the incident with the Borg, Starfleet is spread pretty thin".

I would have liked it if DS9 and TNG had been connected more often and more directly ("Insurrection" should have been a Dominion movie, for example, and the TNG cast should have had more of a crossover episode or two or three with DS9 aside from the few cameos we got like "Birthright" and "Firstborn"). Still, even that little mention by Sisko makes me happy now. Better than them just totally ignoring TNG's events.

 

[tharpdevenport]

Didn't "Insurrection" have a deleted scene with Quark?

 

[knine]

^Yep. And good thing it was.

 

[Withers]

I would have liked it if DS9 and TNG had been connected more often and more directly ("Insurrection" should have been a Dominion movie, for example, and the TNG cast should have had more of a crossover episode or two or three with DS9 aside from the few cameos we got like "Birthright" and "Firstborn"). Still, even that little mention by Sisko makes me happy now. Better than them just totally ignoring TNG's events.

I agree with all of that. My biggest problem with the Dominion War was that the Enterprise (and her sister ship) never made any appearance. I can understand, from a production stand point, that getting the Enterprise-E into DS9 might have been prohibitively expensive...but still. You watch the Dominion War arc where it very much seems that all hands are on deck and you wonder... "What the hell is the Enterprise doing right now?" And if it's a problem with sending the flagship (for want of it not being destroyed) fine, send the Sovereign.


-Withers-​

 

[RyuRoots]

I would have liked it if DS9 and TNG had been connected more often and more directly ("Insurrection" should have been a Dominion movie, for example, and the TNG cast should have had more of a crossover episode or two or three with DS9 aside from the few cameos we got like "Birthright" and "Firstborn"). Still, even that little mention by Sisko makes me happy now. Better than them just totally ignoring TNG's events.

I agree with all of that. My biggest problem with the Dominion War was that the Enterprise (and her sister ship) never made any appearance. I can understand, from a production stand point, that getting the Enterprise-E into DS9 might have been prohibitively expensive...but still. You watch the Dominion War arc where it very much seems that all hands are on deck and you wonder... "What the hell is the Enterprise doing right now?" And if it's a problem with sending the flagship (for want of it not being destroyed) fine, send the Sovereign.


-Withers-​

A bigger issue to me is how the Dominion War is given two lines at most in INS when it supposedly takes place right in the middle of it. Instead, the Enterprise is off doing archaelogical surveys apparently.

I can understand not having the Enterprise itself, but it was always a shame that we never saw a single Sovereign onscreen despite seeing a bunch of Galaxy-class ships. The Sovereign is apparently one of the best warships the UFP has at its disposal when that purpose is called for, so it's bizarre that we never see a single one canonically aside from the Enterprise-E.

 

[Withers]

A bigger issue to me is how the Dominion War is given two lines at most in INS when it supposedly takes place right in the middle of it. Instead, the Enterprise is off doing archaelogical surveys apparently.

If they'd made INS about the Enterprise assisting (or even leading) the Romulan front assault on the Dominion (since the Romulans lost their flagship) it could have set up the idea that, in Nemesis, Enterprise was the closest ship to Romulus and could have scrapped that terrible B4 plot line. I mean, it's not like the other powers only sent their ships to the Federation. Surely the Federation sent ships to them as well.


-Withers-​

 

[Piper]

Wasn't there some cock-up with the stardates, in that a DS9 episode references "the Borg invasion" with a stardate before that of First Contact?

 

[RyuRoots]

Wasn't there some cock-up with the stardates, in that a DS9 episode references "the Borg invasion" with a stardate before that of First Contact?

Think I remember reading forever ago that FC had botched stardates, though I'm not really sure. Not that it matters much either way. They probably sound like random numbers to most people, anyway.

 

[Bones2]

I can understand not having the Enterprise itself, but it was always a shame that we never saw a single Sovereign onscreen despite seeing a bunch of Galaxy-class ships. The Sovereign is apparently one of the best warships the UFP has at its disposal when that purpose is called for, so it's bizarre that we never see a single one canonically aside from the Enterprise-E.

DS9 (or rather, the producers) wanted a Sovereign to appear in battles, but it wasn't allowed. The ship was to be kept movie-exclusive.

​

 

[RyuRoots]

I can understand not having the Enterprise itself, but it was always a shame that we never saw a single Sovereign onscreen despite seeing a bunch of Galaxy-class ships. The Sovereign is apparently one of the best warships the UFP has at its disposal when that purpose is called for, so it's bizarre that we never see a single one canonically aside from the Enterprise-E.

DS9 (or rather, the producers) wanted a Sovereign to appear in battles, but it wasn't allowed. The ship was to be kept movie-exclusive.

​

Yeah, I remember hearing that. It's so patently absurd. It's not like these were two competeing franchises.

 

[Mysterion]

FWIW, the timeline in Voyages of the Imagination puts First Contact after the DSN episode The Ascent, and before the DSN episode Rapture, in 2373.

 

[Too Much Fun]

I can understand not having the Enterprise itself, but it was always a shame that we never saw a single Sovereign onscreen despite seeing a bunch of Galaxy-class ships. The Sovereign is apparently one of the best warships the UFP has at its disposal when that purpose is called for, so it's bizarre that we never see a single one canonically aside from the Enterprise-E.

DS9 (or rather, the producers) wanted a Sovereign to appear in battles, but it wasn't allowed. The ship was to be kept movie-exclusive.

​

Yeah, I remember hearing that. It's so patently absurd. It's not like these were two competeing franchises.

This stuff happens all the time, though. It's like how the animated series "The Batman" couldn't use the characters of The Scarecrow and Ra's Al Ghul because they were to be involved in "Batman Begins". People called that a 'bat embargo'. Seemed pretty silly to me.

 

[Withers]

DS9 (or rather, the producers) wanted a Sovereign to appear in battles, but it wasn't allowed. The ship was to be kept movie-exclusive.

I totally believe you but I've read every page on DS9 at Memory Alpha at least once and I don't ever recall reading that. Do you know where I might find the source on that? It seems so ridiculous. We all knew the USS Sovereign was out there somewhere. It should've been helping in at least the Battle of Cardassia Prime. The only other production stand point excuse I can think of is that having said ship present would have over shadowed the Defiant.


-Withers-​

 

[RyuRoots]

DS9 (or rather, the producers) wanted a Sovereign to appear in battles, but it wasn't allowed. The ship was to be kept movie-exclusive.

I totally believe you but I've read every page on DS9 at Memory Alpha at least once and I don't ever recall reading that. Do you know where I might find the source on that? It seems so ridiculous. We all knew the USS Sovereign was out there somewhere. It should've been helping in at least the Battle of Cardassia Prime. The only other production stand point excuse I can think of is that having said ship present would have over shadowed the Defiant.


-Withers-​

If Galaxies don't overshadow the Defiant, I can't believe a Sovereign would.

 

[Withers]

If Galaxies don't overshadow the Defiant, I can't believe a Sovereign would.

That's certainly true. The only difference is, at the time, Defiant was a unique ship. They weren't in mass production yet. Galaxy's were, on the other hand, so you could watch them get pawned left and right. Sovereigns couldn't be shown that way. We'd have two somewhat unique classes on screen, vying for center stage.

But I agree with you and maybe that's a point on DS9: Why was a Defiant class ship always in charge when there we dozens of Galaxy class ships that out powered it?

-Withers-​

 

[Flying Spaghetti Monster]

i no longer have my DS9 Companion, but if memory serves, "The Darkness and the Light" is the first epsiode that takes place after the film First Contact

 

[Bones2]

DS9 (or rather, the producers) wanted a Sovereign to appear in battles, but it wasn't allowed. The ship was to be kept movie-exclusive.

I totally believe you but I've read every page on DS9 at Memory Alpha at least once and I don't ever recall reading that. Do you know where I might find the source on that? It seems so ridiculous. We all knew the USS Sovereign was out there somewhere. It should've been helping in at least the Battle of Cardassia Prime. The only other production stand point excuse I can think of is that having said ship present would have over shadowed the Defiant.​

-Withers-​

I read it on here somewhere, a while ago.