Question About "The Chimes at Midnight"

[Captain Clark Terrell]

"The Chimes at Midnight" is a story that's part of the Myriad Universes novel Echoes and Refractions . The story details events set in the timeline in which Spock died during childhood after being attacked by a Le-matya, and the Andorian Thelin th'Valrass becomes Kirk's closest friend and first officer.

The story details events beginning around the time of TMP and continues through TUC. Details of Thelin's involvement during the five-year mission are sparse, but enough information is shared to suggest that the TOS portion of this timeline is similar to what happened in the primary universe. That being the case, I have to wonder what Thelin might have done to conceal his identity during "The City on the Edge of Forever" if he traveled back in time with Kirk instead of Spock. Does a timeline exist where there is a mysterious blue-skinned visitor in Earth's past?

--Sran

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Maybe Thelin didn't go on that mission.

 

[Captain Clark Terrell]

^Yes, but that's no fun.

--Sran

 

[Sci]

I think the simplest hypothesis would be that upon realizing they would need to travel downtime to Earth's pre-warp era, Thelin stayed back with the rest of the landing party and did not enter the Guardian.

Of course, heck, for all we know, maybe the Enterprise never discovered the Guardian in the first place without Spock aboard.

 

[Captain Clark Terrell]

I think the simplest hypothesis would be that upon realizing they would need to travel downtime to Earth's pre-warp era, Thelin stayed back with the rest of the landing party and did not enter the Guardian.

Or maybe McCoy ended up traveling to a different world's past where Thelin could have gone safely.

Of course, heck, for all we know, maybe the Enterprise never discovered the Guardian in the first place without Spock aboard.

Yes, but that's no fun.

--Sran

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

If circumstances forced Thelin to go, he probably stayed hidden for as long as possible. Maybe wore a full hoodie if he needed to go out in public.

 

[Sci]

I think the simplest hypothesis would be that upon realizing they would need to travel downtime to Earth's pre-warp era, Thelin stayed back with the rest of the landing party and did not enter the Guardian.

Or maybe McCoy ended up traveling to a different world's past where Thelin could have gone safely.

True!

Heck, maybe the Guardian sent them downtime to an equivalent point in Andor's history, and it was Kirk who had to disguise himself!

 

[Captain Clark Terrell]

Heck, maybe the Guardian sent them downtime to an equivalent point in Andor's history, and it was Kirk who had to disguise himself!

This is an interesting idea. Though I wonder what Kirk's role might have been in Andor's past if Thelin were out roaming the streets. Would he have tried repairing the tricorder as Spock had done while on Earth? It's never been made clear what Kirk's formal training was in during his Academy or pre-command days. It's implied that he was always on the command track. But even command track cadets and junior officers spend time learning specific skills in case they're in a situation where they have only themselves to rely on. Could he have made the repairs while Thelin fell in love with the Andor equivalent of Edith Keeler?

--Sran

 

[Captain Clark Terrell]

If circumstances forced Thelin to go, he probably stayed hidden for as long as possible. Maybe wore a full hoodie if he needed to go out in public.

Good point! I guess the convenient thing about Kirk and Spock's predicament in the actual episode is that Spock needed to spend most of his time indoors to repair the tricorder and finish the pneumonic memory circuit. Thelin had similar skills and expertise, so it wouldn't have been a stretch to believe he'd have done the same thing. I just wonder how Kirk might have explained his blue complexion to the curious Edith.

--Sran

 

[DorkBoy [TM]]

I see you've noticed the antennae?

They're actually very easy to explain.

You see, he got his head caught in a mechanical rice picker.

See? It still works. Basically.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

"Sorry about my friend here. He's feeling blue."

 

[JD]

"The Chimes at Midnight" is a story that's part of the Myriad Universes novel Echoes and Refractions . The story details events set in the timeline in which Spock died during childhood after being attacked by a Le-matya, and the Andorian Thelin th'Valrass becomes Kirk's closest friend and first officer.

The story details events beginning around the time of TMP and continues through TUC. Details of Thelin's involvement during the five-year mission are sparse, but enough information is shared to suggest that the TOS portion of this timeline is similar to what happened in the primary universe. That being the case, I have to wonder what Thelin might have done to conceal his identity during "The City on the Edge of Forever" if he traveled back in time with Kirk instead of Spock. Does a timeline exist where there is a mysterious blue-skinned visitor in Earth's past?

--Sran

This brings up my one minor complaint about the Myriad Universes series. They managed to create 9 fascinating new universes, and there are a lot of questions like these about their futures and pasts. I especially wish we could get a follow up to the Kahn victorious universe. It ended on a bit of a cliffhanger, and I would love to see what happened next.

 

[Captain Clark Terrell]

This brings up my one minor complaint about the Myriad Universes series. They managed to create 9 fascinating new universes, and there are a lot of questions like these about their futures and pasts. I especially wish we could get a follow up to the Kahn victorious universe. It ended on a bit of a cliffhanger, and I would love to see what happened next.

I've similar feelings. Star Trek is the one place where alternate universe stories could actually be considered canon (as much as any novel could given that none of actually are canon). Why not expand on some of the ideas already used in the MU stories and flesh out what happens in these timelines before or after the stories in question?

Now that I'm thinking about it, there are several MU stories that would be interesting to tell if they ever decide to revive the series. I know of at least one Trek author who has an idea he'd like to write about (I don't know what his idea actually is). I won't post my ideas here because it's forbidden by board policy but am willing to share them via PM.

--Sran

 

[F. King Daniel]

"He's from Albania."

 

[jpv2000]

I see you've noticed the antennae?

They're actually very easy to explain.

You see, he got his head caught in a mechanical rice picker.

See? It still works. Basically.

That Kirk, he was awesome.

 

[Christopher]

Really, given all the times that Spock's unique abilities were the only way to save the day, it's hard to believe the ship and crew even still exist in the movie era in a Spock-less timeline. I still wish Chimes had explained how they saved Earth from V'Ger without Spock around.

 

[DonIago]

Thelin's antennae must have picked up on signals the rest of Our Heroes would have missed.

 

[Christopher]

In general, this is one of the problems with alternate timelines from a dramatic standpoint. So many stories are built around the idea of the heroes' unique skills or attributes enabling them to surmount impossible odds, the idea that if the protagonists hadn't been in the right place at the right time, all would've been lost. It kind of undermines that if you reveal that in an alternate reality where your hero never existed, the world still turned out pretty much the exact same way.

 

[DonIago]

True enough, though the author played that up well enough when depicting later events IMO.

If I was to guess with regards to the author's intentions, it's possible they felt their hands were tied with regards to V'ger and consequently opted to omit that particular incident (along with who knows how many scenarios in TOS where Spock's presence was pivotal) or that they planned to cover it but had to cut it due to story length restrictions.

Heck, maybe without Spock, Our Heroes end up stranded in the mirror universe.

 

[Captain Clark Terrell]

Really, given all the times that Spock's unique abilities were the only way to save the day, it's hard to believe the ship and crew even still exist in the movie era in a Spock-less timeline. I still wish Chimes had explained how they saved Earth from V'Ger without Spock around.

I wondered about this, too. The story starts in 2274, which would put it about a year after the incident. Will Decker never makes an appearance in this timeline (as depicted), so it's possible he merged with V'Ger as he did in the primary universe. But it's not clear how the Enterprise crew would have gained their insight into V'Ger without Spock's ability to mind-meld.

I suppose it's possible Enterprise was never assigned to intercept V'Ger in the Thelin continuity. Another vessel and crew could have found a way of diverting the entity before it destroyed Earth. But it still would have been nice to learn how those events played without Spock being there.

--Sran