Picard's biggest mistake
- Thread starter Makarov
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If you'll recall the movie, that is exactly what happen.
But if Picard meets himself in the real world wouldn't that create a paradox?
Apparently (later)Picard replaces his earlier self. This conveniently deals with the issue of saving his brother and nephew (maybe he could have made a phone call, warning them) but still doesn't excuse him just arresting Soren days earlier.
And what about Kirk? He was never in the 24th Century, so if he can travel through time with impunity, why not Picard?
And what about Kirk? He was never in the 24th Century, so if he can travel through time with impunity, why not Picard?
Yes, I think the earlier Picard would still live out the "loop in time," it would still exist through to the point the Nexus ribbon destroys the Veridian planet.
From the time he appears, Picard would be living in a new time line.
Eh I don't really consider Picard's nexus thing a choice. It was a choice of the filmmakers that wanted to show him redo the final fight without going further back in some more complicated way. But Picard never really chooses the exact time based on any pros/cons he just vaguely decides to go back to that redo the fight. What I'm saying is Picard only did that because of storytelling laziness/streamlining. I'm not even sure if the writers considered what we're talking about when they made Picard do that.
Lets be honest though, if Picard did the smart thing, he'd just go back to when Soran is on the enterprise and arrest him. But doesn't really make sense in a Hollywood movie where they always have a dramatic showdown with the bad guy. And Kirk would have no reason to be there.
The whole scenario is just kind of flawed no matter how you slice it. I'd scrap the entire movie if it were up to me. Then I'd make a movie where Kirk & Picard beat eachother up for the entire movie and then become friends at the very end. The amount of Kirk vs. Picard discussions shows that it would be a hit.
Lets be honest though, if Picard did the smart thing, he'd just go back to when Soran is on the enterprise and arrest him. But doesn't really make sense in a Hollywood movie where they always have a dramatic showdown with the bad guy. And Kirk would have no reason to be there.
The whole scenario is just kind of flawed no matter how you slice it. I'd scrap the entire movie if it were up to me. Then I'd make a movie where Kirk & Picard beat eachother up for the entire movie and then become friends at the very end. The amount of Kirk vs. Picard discussions shows that it would be a hit.
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I've heard that the Generations commentary has some discussion by the creators on how they saw the Nexus exit scheme operating (why Picard could only go to certain points in time, etc). Has anyone heard this or got access to a transcript? It might shed some light on what the original intentions were, even if not very well translated to the screen.
Yes, I think the earlier Picard would still live out the "loop in time," it would still exist through to the point the Nexus ribbon destroys the Veridian planet.
From the time he appears, Picard would be living in a new time line.
Just one more thing that they didn't think through.
There were no 'original intentions'. During the commantary, Moore and Braga simply do the speculation game (ie, justify it after-the-fact), the same as any of us on here.
The reality, as boring as it sounds, is that a deadline was looming, and they just didn't have the time or money for any other options. 
Braga, for his part, really puts the boot into the whole Nexus thing during the commentary, particularly the image of "The two great captains of Star Trek finally meet... and they make an omelette!", which he says was meant to be off-beat, but which just comes across on-screen as stupidly mundane.
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He was hoping they would eventually put it in a museum.
Cheers, bit of a shame there wasn't some greater pool of knowledge but good to know anyway!
There were no 'original intentions'. During the commantary, Moore and Braga simply do the speculation game (ie, justify it after-the-fact), the same as any of us on here.
Braga, for his part, really puts the boot into the whole Nexus thing during the commentary, particularly the image of "The two great captains of Star Trek finally meet... and they make an omelette!", which he says was meant to be off-beat, but which just comes across on-screen as stupidly mundane.
What's funny is that Soran thought he was safe once inside the Nexus and yet Picard managed to pull him out of it! That's the second time. I mean you could be in the Nexus for one hundred years and someone could just ruin it for you by doing a bit of paradoxical time traveling...
But part of Guinan remained, so is a part of Soren still inside the Nexus?
Yes, that's the part where it gets a bit confusing...
I think Picard's biggest mistake was in "Q Who" when he decided to get all mouthy with Q about how mankind was strong and ready enough to face whatever was out there.
Remember Q is a creature who could go anywhere and knew what dangers were out there and was kind of warning Picard he didn't know what he was talking about and he should just shut up. But Picard kept on pushing to the point where Q decided to teach him a lesson and introduce him to the Borg.
Then Picard decides to push ahead despite Guinan's very explicit warning that it wouldn't be a good idea and he should turn back and of course runs into the Borg making them aware there's this whole area they haven't explored yet that is apparently heavily populated.
If not for his arrogance and smart mouth the Borg may have gone in some different direction in the galaxy and never encountered the Federation and countless lives and ships, at least Federation ones, wouldn't have been lost.
Remember Q is a creature who could go anywhere and knew what dangers were out there and was kind of warning Picard he didn't know what he was talking about and he should just shut up. But Picard kept on pushing to the point where Q decided to teach him a lesson and introduce him to the Borg.
Then Picard decides to push ahead despite Guinan's very explicit warning that it wouldn't be a good idea and he should turn back and of course runs into the Borg making them aware there's this whole area they haven't explored yet that is apparently heavily populated.
If not for his arrogance and smart mouth the Borg may have gone in some different direction in the galaxy and never encountered the Federation and countless lives and ships, at least Federation ones, wouldn't have been lost.
Hadn't they already assimilated Seven of Nine's family at that point though?
There were no 'original intentions'. During the commantary, Moore and Braga simply do the speculation game (ie, justify it after-the-fact), the same as any of us on here.
Braga, for his part, really puts the boot into the whole Nexus thing during the commentary, particularly the image of "The two great captains of Star Trek finally meet... and they make an omelette!", which he says was meant to be off-beat, but which just comes across on-screen as stupidly mundane.
Hey back off. In my opinion Kirk and Picard making an omelette ranks just behind "No.....I am your father" as the most dramatic and memorable moment in sci-fi history.
That's one big piece of retconning!
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