Paris Fans: Did you ever forgive Janeway?

[LeadHead]

"Thirty Days" was just back on today on Spike. I remembered how pissed I was at Janeway after this episode.

This was why: She gave Tuvok and B'Elanna a Stern Warning afer they disobeyed direct orders, violated they Prime Directive, and nearly blew up the ship in "Prime Factors."

She only said she was dissapointed with Chakotay when he stole a shuttle and a crucial tool for disabling a stolen transporter module in "Maneuvers."

Neelix was an accessory to a murder and cover-up in "Fair Trade" he had to do grunt work for 2 weeks.

Seven disobeyed Janeway's direct orders nd got Species 8472 killed in "Prey," attacked Kovin in "Retrospect" and deriliced her duties in "Human Error" Her punishments were in order, having to stay in the Cargo bay, (her quarters) get a polite conversation with Janeway and... nothing.

Torres attacked a fellow officer in "Parallax" she let Chakotay sweep it under the rug and then promoted her at the end of the episode.

The Doctor compleetly betrayed Voyager in "Flesh and Blood" which took heavy damage as a result, got their Cheif Engineer kidnapped and got off scot free. Janeway said he should learn from his mistake and blamed herself for the Doctors betrayal.

Yet when Tom Steals they Flyer and tries to destroy a polluting installaton that Janeway herself thought was dangerous, he is demoted and jailed.

Honestly after "Equinox" when she committed attempted murder of Noah Lessing, I was hoping she would acknowlage how horribly she had gone over the line she would relieve herself of command for a month or something to atone for her heinous crime. She didn't.

I'm just curious, when you saw the Promos for "The Voyager Conspiracy," and they were teasing the line, "Is the Captain of Voyager a Traitor?" did anyone else think, finally, isn't it Janeway's turn for a punishment?

Honestly, up to "Thirty Days" I was a big Janeway fan, after tha I became more skeptical of her character. After "Equinox" I was disgusted. I got over it, but I always had a hard time taking her seriously after those incidents.

 

[Korczynski]

After they went to Warp 10 together, their relationship went to another level

 

[Kegek]

I liked "Thirty Days". They demoted Paris and kept his demotion for a while... it was almost like a non-reset button had slipped in.

Nice CGI, too.

You think Paris had it hard? Try "The Disease". A never before heard of rule, which will never be heard of again, is invoked simply to prevent Kim from having sex.

 

[KiraDax]

Kegek Kringle said:
You think Paris had it hard? Try "The Disease". A never before heard of rule, which will never be heard of again, is invoked simply to prevent Kim from having sex.

Yes, but was Kim demoted to Crewman and stuck in the brig for thirty days for being ornery about something as trivial as wanting to have illicit sex? No.

Yet she emotionally thrashed Paris and tossed him in solitary for a month for trying to save a planet? You can't help but think she fell down on Tom harder because of her history with his father and his own speckled history.

As has been mentioned, its not so much the severity of the punishment as the unfairness of it in comparison to what other crew members faced for worser, or at least less ethically guided, crimes.

As a Paris fan, no, I never forgave her.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Not true. They talked about that rule after Tucker in Enterprise got knocked up.

 

[Kegek]

^
Are you sure they mentioned the rule, or did T'Pol just frown on his bumpskin, overly-forward ways?

 

[Malcom]

He's lucky I wasn't captain of Voyager.

He:

1) Violated a direct order.
2) Interfered with relations with an alien culture against direct orders.

I'd a keel-hauled him.

 

[Sisu]

Consistancy and Janeway never seemed to gel. Bad writing. Or the character of Janeway had some mental problems undiagnosed because she deleted the EMH's psychiatitric subroutines.

 

[Guy Gardener]

No, Tuvok diagnosed her mental problemsn the omega Directive, and the entire crew gossiped about her having a screw loose in Night.

paris' demotion was good for his relationship with B'Elanna. it gave her more power in their duo, which made her intersting from a I like to be emasculatyedsort of angle.

Sure;ly his job had been Chief helm officer, which meant he had admin and managerial duties to wrangle all the other helm Officers... Who ever took over his position would have had to have been demoted (Unless they were promoted or killed.) to give Paris his job back, unless there was no chief helm officer holding the interim while Paris was demoted?

 

[LeadHead]

It sounds like they just had other crew memebers fill in for him during the 30 days. And I don't think the whole demoted thing about everyone in his department thing is right. Harry Kim was an Ensign the entire 7 years and I'm sure not everybody in the operations division was an Ensign or below.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Why not?

besides, operations like helm is one seat. we'll assume a three shift turnover, so really as far a tom or harry are concerned, that's 2 other people, unless they're training up new poeple for redundancy and back up.

 

[Caprica_Six]

As a Paris fan and Janeway fan, meh who cares. The other characters have done a lot worse and she has to punish people so thats how it rolls.

 

[exodus]

What Paris did was he went against the entire governments wishes. The govenment representive told Voyager not to get involved. Paris didn't just punch somebody or kill just one person, he went against the law of an entire government. That's the most anti-Starfleet/Federation thing ever!!!

The entire crew of Voyager would have gone to jail or been executed(depending on that worlds laws)because of his actions. They never would have gotten home, ever.

BTW, Neelix isn't an officer or an "offical" crewman, so technically Janeway can't really punish him like an officer. He is a civilian, therefore not subject to the same rules of conduct and punishment as the rest of the crew. Neelix only chose to follow them to fit in with the rest.

Seven's punishment was fitting for her. How many times has she stated the worse punishment for a drone was to be left alone?

 

[Deckerd]

Lets face it, if you're looking for consistent, you're watching the wrong show.

 

[Smiley]

Deckerd said:
Lets face it, if you're looking for consistent, you're watching the wrong show.

Exactly. If VOY remembered what happened to it in previous episodes, the show would have been a little better.

 

[exodus]

Merry said:

Deckerd said:
Lets face it, if you're looking for consistent, you're watching the wrong show.

Exactly. If VOY remembered what happened to it in previous episodes, the show would have been a little better.

Like TNG was?

Anybody notice how Picard went from talking diplomat to action hero? Not bad for a guy with a pacemaker.

How Riker went from playboy to one woman man overnight?

How about Troi going from crying fits to rolling her eyes at everybody -"I'm so cool" back to crying then to drunken floozy and talking about her boobs?

How the warp was destroying space concepted just totally disappeared.

How not one of their scientific or technological discoveries ever got used beyong their introduction.

How Data completed the entire Acadamy, lived amoung humans and never asked what a joke was until he joined the Enterprise crew?

TNG was just as uneven as Voy.

 

[Smiley]

Obviously, no show has perfect continuity, TNG included. VOY, however, had more than its share of inconsistencies, given the nature of the ship's mission, and it would have been a better show with less of them.

Please note: I like VOY. It's a good show, but it had areas where it could have been improved. Internal continuity is one of them.

 

[exodus]

Merry said:
Obviously, no show has perfect continuity, TNG included. VOY, however, had more than its share of inconsistencies, given the nature of the ship's mission, and it would have been a better show with less of them.

Please note: I like VOY. It's a good show, but it had areas where it could have been improved. Internal continuity is one of them.

I understand that but that isn't the case here. It has nothing to do with inconsistancy, the crime Paris commited was far more severe than what his other crewmen have done.

Had he done what he did back in the Alpha Quad., he would be once again thrown out of Starfleet.

 

[Luckyflux]

It bothered me. Tom was one of my favorite characters, and Janeway rips him a new torpedo launcher out of the blue. Sure he violated orders, but so did other crewmen. But Janeway has the balls to throw him in the brig?!?!?

As soon as the 30 days were up, I wanted Tom to step out of the cell and cold-cock the bun wearing ho! That ain't very trekkish, but I was upset.

 

[Vonstadt]

I was fine with his punishment, he deserved what he got for violating orders of his Captian and the Alien Government. Even if he was in the right to do so morally.

However my issue with it was the writers of the show never seemed to give the Janeway character the consistency to be believable at times. As a stand alone episode, my cousin who was in the navy thought he got off easy :P and it showed though Janeway has to maintain order, she sorta agreeed with him un offcially (since his punishement could've been worse)

Plus It was nice to see VOY leave him at that rank too for a while...as opposed to the series' reset button.

The story was fun, its always been one of my favorites, and Janeway simply never benifitted from the writers.

I still like her for the potentional she should have had :P